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I came back to R3v after years away to say one thing...

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    #91
    Originally posted by roguetoaster View Post
    Maybe you don't quite get how it works, but a society should exist for the betterment of all, and one person can't make that happen. So, as a consequence, everyone should (or must when legislated) chip in.
    Exactly. "No man is an island."

    Here's an example of how jacked up medical care is in terms of costs. For the birth of our first child our insurer was billed ~$27,000. In the end we paid out ~$4500 OOP (deductible) and the insurer another ~$8000. WTF? $12500 for a natural child birth? GTFOH...

    My parents paid $25 OOP through my Dad's military (Air Force officer) provider (TriCare at the time). And my sister, also paid <$50 for my niece because she was still a dependent at that time (though my dad was retired by that point). WTF! Just illustrating the ridiculously wide range of the spectrum for coverages/costs. It's funny he pays annually what we pay monthly, and he complains about that as it recently went up to that figure.

    As long as care providers are allowed to charge whatever they want to, health care will cost the average citizen too much money to the insurer, and the insurer too much to the provider. You should not have to negotiate your care prices down with the provider... whether you do it or your insurance company on your behalf.

    Example 2, I had walking pneumonia for a year without knowing it until one day I could not breathe. Went to the emergency room (lesson learned) because I've never had that experience before. We were there about 3 hours, seen by the doc about 20 minutes ($1200), radiologist for x-rays ($500), and charged for the room for the night by the hospital ($3000). The big kicker though... the doc wanted a CT with contrast to confirm his diagnosis of a bad pneumonia in the lungs. Cost? $8000! No FYI during the consult concerning cost. WTF? I've since read articles about hospital admins pushing for extra testing and such, especially when costly and dealing with an insured patient. I don't know that's what happened... but it didn't feel any better receiving that statement either way.

    Now, I have quite a few friends in the medical field... very well regarded docs (VERY well off too obviously) and they all agree it's screwed up. A medical emergency, or child birth even, should not be able to bankrupt a family.
    "A good memory for quotes combined with a poor memory for attribution can lead to a false sense of originality."
    -----------------------------------------
    91 318is Turbo Sold
    87 325 Daily driver Sold
    06 4.8is X5
    06 Mtec X3
    05 4.4i X5 Sold
    92 325ic Sold & Re-purchased
    90 325i Sold
    97 328is Sold
    01 323ci Sold
    92 325i Sold
    83 528e Totaled
    98 328i Sold
    93 325i Sold

    Comment


      #92
      you make good points to the fact that other than your deductible you have no reason to shop for a better price on say the CT scan

      while the cost seem too high, the insurance company pays once you've paid your deductible.

      what if you had a healthcare savings account that you could purchase insurance through for catastrophic events, but ordinary care was paid for out of the account. do you think you might care about cost then? would you shop for multiple CT scan providers based on cost?
      “There is nothing government can give you that it hasn’t taken from you in the first place”
      Sir Winston Churchill

      Comment


        #93
        ^

        The issue then has the posibilty of cut rate providers that sell you a sub par service for a little bit of cost savings, like the person the interperts the results of your CT/sonogram/Xray/MRI etc... may not be of the caliber you want looking at your results when its YOUR health on the line. Not to say this is not happening as it is now with the "cheap HMO" dicatating your providers, and so on. Just do we really want something like Walmart for health care where only the bottom dollar and making the product as cheap as possible the ONLY concern.

        Dont get me wrong I agree with you the free markets need more involvement, and there has to be better solution to what we have now other than single payer Medicare for all.
        Last edited by mrsleeve; 11-04-2016, 02:33 PM.
        Originally posted by Fusion
        If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
        The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


        The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

        Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
        William Pitt-

        Comment


          #94
          Originally posted by gwb72tii View Post
          you make good points to the fact that other than your deductible you have no reason to shop for a better price on say the CT scan

          while the cost seem too high, the insurance company pays once you've paid your deductible.

          what if you had a healthcare savings account that you could purchase insurance through for catastrophic events, but ordinary care was paid for out of the account. do you think you might care about cost then? would you shop for multiple CT scan providers based on cost?
          In an emergency you do not shop for anything. You go to the closest facility available. If I had known the cost of the CT however, I would have declined it since the doc had his diagnosis from the X-rays... which clearly showed the massive fluid buildup.

          We have an FSA, which we like to keep building, not depleting, so we are always concerned with the cost of services... and have in the past called providers to dicker the charges down. You should not have to do this as a consumer when it comes to health care. This is not being at the flea market trying to score a good deal on some trinket. It's your health. Plus, the average customer can hardly make heads or tails of an EOB statement... which I am guessing is by design.

          As for the quality of care point you make sleeve. There already is a large disparity and variance in the type/quality of care available currently as you say. I don't personally believe anything would change. There will always be good and bad physicians, just as there is in any profession.

          I believe in free markets, unfortunately, like in many other industries (telecom, pharma, banking, etc), health care has not been a free market for a long time. And most importantly, like other industries, it most likely never can be again due to lack of competition. So, unfortunately (as with those other industries), regulation is the answer.
          "A good memory for quotes combined with a poor memory for attribution can lead to a false sense of originality."
          -----------------------------------------
          91 318is Turbo Sold
          87 325 Daily driver Sold
          06 4.8is X5
          06 Mtec X3
          05 4.4i X5 Sold
          92 325ic Sold & Re-purchased
          90 325i Sold
          97 328is Sold
          01 323ci Sold
          92 325i Sold
          83 528e Totaled
          98 328i Sold
          93 325i Sold

          Comment


            #95
            nobody has posted in politics section in 3 days? wtf????
            sigpic
            Gigitty Gigitty!!!!

            88 cabrio becoming alpina b6 3.5s transplanted s62
            92 Mtech 2 cabrio alpinweiss 770 code
            88 325ix coupe manual lachsilber/cardinal
            88 325ix coupe manual diamondschwartz/natur
            87 e30 m3 for parts lachsilber/cardinal(serial number 7)
            12 135i M sport cabrio grey/black

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              #96
              we've all retreated to our fallout shelters and fallen into twinkie-induced diabetic comas
              cars beep boop

              Comment


                #97
                Still here... just all nail biting.
                ACS S3 Build / Dinan 5 E34

                Comment


                  #98
                  Originally posted by TimeMachinE30 View Post
                  Still here... just all nail biting.
                  i think its gonna suck either way.

                  my wife and i early voted last week. i felt so dirty afterward, i came home and took a shower.
                  sigpic
                  Gigitty Gigitty!!!!

                  88 cabrio becoming alpina b6 3.5s transplanted s62
                  92 Mtech 2 cabrio alpinweiss 770 code
                  88 325ix coupe manual lachsilber/cardinal
                  88 325ix coupe manual diamondschwartz/natur
                  87 e30 m3 for parts lachsilber/cardinal(serial number 7)
                  12 135i M sport cabrio grey/black

                  Comment


                    #99
                    It seems like we are all ready for this to be over. Even my neighbor, a former MD representative, and long time politico, isn't at all jazzed about election day.

                    Glad I got to vote early as the queue to get in/out of the parking lot at the polling place was crazy today.

                    Comment


                      I mailed my ballot back not last saturday but the saturday before that I have been ready for this shit to be over for at least 5 months



                      I too felt very dirty about about the whole thing.... I mean really how bad is HRC to make the Donald even remotely a palatable alternative to anyone??????

                      As a good frined of mine keeps saying, she is still waiting for Ashton Kutcher to spring the news on the entire country that we have all been PUNKED.......
                      Originally posted by Fusion
                      If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
                      The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


                      The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

                      Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
                      William Pitt-

                      Comment


                        Well.......
                        ACS S3 Build / Dinan 5 E34

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by codyep3
                          I hope to Christ you have looks going for you, because you sure as fuck don't have any intelligence.
                          2001 silver/Blk 325 cabby. SOLD
                          1988 Blk/Blk e30 factory wide body kit car SOLD
                          1992 DS/BLK 325 m-tech II apperance pack cabby SOLD!
                          2002 325xit Sil/blk. SOLD
                          2012 328i xdrive touring. Wht/blk. SOLD
                          2009 135 cabby. monacoblue/blk leather SOLD
                          2007 Z4m coupe. Silver grey/black/ aluminum. 1of50
                          2010 F650gs twin
                          2016 M235i cabby. Mineral grey/Red leather

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Todd Black 88 View Post
                            Wait, you get to keep Alaska? No fair.

                            Comment


                              Brexit still hasn't been figured out yet and we get a second bombshell, seems like society worldwide is drifting apart more and more into 2 camps
                              Instagram : makeitsnap

                              1985 e28 520i

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                                lol

                                Originally posted by SpasticDwarf;n6449866
                                Honestly I built it just to have a place to sit and listen to Hotline Bling on repeat.

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