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    the "fuss", for me, is the destruction of our reefs and oceans as I mentioned earlier in the thread.

    the bright future you're describing won't be the end of the world, just our food chain and eventually us. some will argue that the world would be a better place without us but the thrust of my argument is that I prefer human habitability.

    and our oceans' health *is* directly related to the toxins we've dumped in there, CO2 emissions, and the way we treat them commercially. it's a separate argument from global warming but it's relevant.
    Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!

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      Originally posted by smooth View Post
      the "fuss", for me, is the destruction of our reefs and oceans as I mentioned earlier in the thread.

      the bright future you're describing won't be the end of the world, just our food chain and eventually us. some will argue that the world would be a better place without us but the thrust of my argument is that I prefer human habitability.

      and our oceans' health *is* directly related to the toxins we've dumped in there, CO2 emissions, and the way we treat them commercially. it's a separate argument from global warming but it's relevant.
      i'd argue we're all on the same page as you with that
      “There is nothing government can give you that it hasn’t taken from you in the first place”
      Sir Winston Churchill

      Comment


        I was at a planetarium today and part of the show explained how another ice age is soon to happen on earth, but human related global temperature rise is prolonging our days until "the big freeze".
        So I guess 2012's the year of making GW a positive thing :D

        Comment


          We're in an ice age, we're just not in a period of glaciation........cause knowledge is power!

          Comment


            Stay up-to-date with the latest science and technology news from Daily Mail including scientific discoveries, pictures, new technology, and more.


            Is this finally proof we're NOT causing global warming? The whole of the Earth heated up in medieval times without human CO2 emissions, says new study

            Evidence was found in a rare mineral that records global temperatures
            Warming was global and NOT limited to Europe
            Throws doubt on orthodoxies around 'global warming'

            Current theories of the causes and impact of global warming have been thrown into question by a new study which shows that during medieval times the whole of the planet heated up.

            It then cooled down naturally and there was even a 'mini ice age'.

            A team of scientists led by geochemist Zunli Lu from Syracuse University in New York state, has found that contrary to the ‘consensus’, the ‘Medieval Warm Period’ approximately 500 to 1,000 years ago wasn’t just confined to Europe.

            In fact, it extended all the way down to Antarctica – which means that the Earth has already experience global warming without the aid of human CO2 emissions.

            At present the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) argues that the Medieval Warm Period was confined to Europe – therefore that the warming we’re experiencing now is a man-made phenomenon.

            However, Professor Lu has shown that this isn’t true – and the evidence lies with a rare mineral called ikaite, which forms in cold waters.

            ‘Ikaite is an icy version of limestone,’ said Lu. ‘The crystals are only stable under cold conditions and actually melt at room temperature.’

            It turns out the water that holds the crystal structure together - called the hydration water - traps information about temperatures present when the crystals formed.

            This finding by Lu's research team establishes, for the first time, ikaite as a reliable way to study past climate conditions.

            The scientists studied ikaite crystals from sediment cores drilled off the coast of Antarctica. The sediment layers were deposited over 2,000 years.

            The scientists were particularly interested in crystals found in layers deposited during the ‘Little Ice Age,’ approximately 300 to 500 years ago, and during the Medieval Warm Period before it.

            Both climate events have been documented in Northern Europe, but studies have been inconclusive as to whether the conditions in Northern Europe extended to Antarctica.

            Lu’s team found that in fact, they did.

            They were able to deduce this by studying the amount of heavy oxygen isotopes found in the crystals.

            During cool periods there are lots, during warm periods there aren’t.

            ‘We showed that the Northern European climate events influenced climate conditions in Antarctica,’ Lu says. ‘More importantly, we are extremely happy to figure out how to get a climate signal out of this peculiar mineral. A new proxy is always welcome when studying past climate changes.’

            The research was recently published online in the journal Earth And Planetary Science Letters and will appear in print on April 1.

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              Farb I will beat the warmists


              LA LALALALALALALAlA I cant her you LALALALALALALALALALALaL NANANANANANANANANAN I cant hear you.

              ITS SETTLED
              Originally posted by Fusion
              If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
              The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


              The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

              Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
              William Pitt-

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                Here are the same stories without the editorial from a conservative news paper. Tell me if you can reach the same conclusion.



                And a link to the actual research (for purchase):
                sigpic

                Comment


                  Originally posted by smooth View Post
                  the "fuss", for me, is the destruction of our reefs and oceans as I mentioned earlier in the thread.

                  the bright future you're describing won't be the end of the world, just our food chain and eventually us. some will argue that the world would be a better place without us but the thrust of my argument is that I prefer human habitability.

                  and our oceans' health *is* directly related to the toxins we've dumped in there, CO2 emissions, and the way we treat them commercially. it's a separate argument from global warming but it's relevant.

                  This! when I tell people I'm an Environmental Policy major they ask me if I'm like saving the planet and stuff. No, I'm saving US, haha. Sustainability equals the balance of all social, economic and environmental factors, and we must preserve that balance to sustain human life for as long as possible.
                  Last edited by Rustyduktape; 03-27-2012, 08:02 AM.
                  1987 325is Black/Black
                  -91k
                  -Stock (mostly)

                  Comment


                    Well......it would seem something is going on with 6000 records falling in the month of March alone.....

                    Comment


                      I'm pretty sure I speak for most if not all when I say, no one is arguing that there are changes, they are arguing that the changes are not directly due to man.
                      Last edited by Farbin Kaiber; 03-27-2012, 09:47 AM.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Farbin Kaiber View Post
                        I'm pretty sure I speak for most if not all when I say, no one is arguing that there are changes, they are arguing that the changes are not directly due to man.

                        But still, what we're doing is unsustainable. Again, the reason for changing our ways shouldn't be dictated by the state of the Earth, we should be proactive in creating a sustainable existence for humans. These attitudes and perspectives just perpetuate our ideals of being reactionary, not proactive.
                        1987 325is Black/Black
                        -91k
                        -Stock (mostly)

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Farbin Kaiber View Post
                          I'm pretty sure I speak for most if not all when I say, no one is arguing that there are changes, they are arguing that the changes are not directly due to man.
                          Uh, no, you are speaking for yourself and those of the general public that want to believe we are not causing the changes. All climate scientists agree that the climate changes by natural forces, but the rate of change has never been observed before in history and there is plenty of evidence to suggest the rate of change is due to human activity. Notice I underlined "rate of change". Read that three times if you have to. Although there is evidence of warmer and cooler times in earth's history, there is absolutely no evidence that shows historical climate temperatures changing as rapidly as they are now.
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by herbivor View Post
                            Uh, no, you are speaking for yourself and those of the general public that want to believe we are not causing the changes. All climate scientists agree that the climate changes by natural forces, but the rate of change has never been observed before in history and there is plenty of evidence to suggest the rate of change is due to human activity. Notice I underlined "rate of change". Read that three times if you have to. Although there is evidence of warmer and cooler times in earth's history, there is absolutely no evidence that shows historical climate temperatures changing as rapidly as they are now.

                            so what? *troll face*
                            1987 325is Black/Black
                            -91k
                            -Stock (mostly)

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by herbivor View Post
                              Uh, no, you are speaking for yourself and those of the general public that want to believe we are not causing the changes. All climate scientists agree that the climate changes by natural forces, but the rate of change has never been observed before in history and there is plenty of evidence to suggest the rate of change is due to human activity. Notice I underlined "rate of change". Read that three times if you have to. Although there is evidence of warmer and cooler times in earth's history, there is absolutely no evidence that shows historical climate temperatures changing as rapidly as they are now.
                              aaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

                              well herbie, the rate of change has been zero to negative for the last 12 years

                              “There is nothing government can give you that it hasn’t taken from you in the first place”
                              Sir Winston Churchill

                              Comment


                                I'm sure herbivor will argue thermometers were not as accurate back then, so that data should be thrown out.

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