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CM5908/5907 Plug-n-Play Bluetooth upgrade board

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    Oh - BTW - just ran into this this week. If you need some shielding, I stumbled upon a DYI electric guitar making forum. And they use this copper adhesive sheets. Didn't know they existed. Google for "copper adhesive guitar sheets" and you should find it.
    Originally posted by Matt-B
    hey does anyone know anyone who gets upset and makes electronics?

    Comment


      Originally posted by tuckerware View Post
      random observation - Bluetooth connection is super fast upon startup. Phone connects within a couple seconds after radio power. Way faster than my other cars with factory BT.

      Jay, a little feedback and would be curious as to experience of others:

      Volume when on a phone call is much quieter than with other audio. For instance, if listening to Pandora and I receive a call it is barely audible until I raise the volume. Then, I must quickly lower as the call ends so it isn't crazy loud.

      Caller on the other side will get an echo when speaking. As in when my wife calls me it sounds just fine in the car but she is getting an echo on her side.

      Let me know if you need clarification on either issue.
      Volume is tricky. As was mentioned, iOS maintains separate volumes for music playback vs. phone calls and Siri (not sure what Android does here). I do have some control over the relative volumes of the two BT profiles (streaming vs. phone calls), and I messed with this as I noticed the level on phone calls was lower even when both iOS session volumes were at 100%. After adjusting this (I think a +3 or +6dB bump on phone calls) I was pretty happy with the level matching, and that's what you have.

      So try turning up the volume on your phone when in a phone call and make sure it's all the way up. I wish there was a way to disable the phone volume and have everything forced to 100% but alas there's no way to do that that I can see. I would be interested to know how it works in your other OEM radios where you say this isn't an issue. When you connect to these, does the volume change on your phone?

      There are default levels like Jim pointed out, and I have those values set to 100%, but then I found iOS doesn't honor them and it remains at whatever level it was at prior to connection.

      Originally posted by earthwormjim View Post
      Noise cancellation to prevent echo'ing is usually handled by the bluetooth device. Jay might need to check if there is a setting for this in the bluetooth module's firmware.

      You might try a more directional mic too, and aim it at your mouth better, it's pretty hard to cancel audio with Bluetooth, there's so many delays in the system.
      The Echo canceller is enabled on the module. I have had one or two the other end complained to me about an echo, but then most of them have had no complaints. Not really sure on that one other than CSR's EC isn't converging for some reason. The delays really shouldn't be an issue for the module though since there should be negligible input and output latencies from the chip's perspective - everything around it is analog.

      Anyway Travis, if it's always an issue for you, let me know and I'll make sure there's nothing else I can do. The more directional mic also might help.

      Comment


        Originally posted by jaysterling View Post
        So try turning up the volume on your phone when in a phone call and make sure it's all the way up. I wish there was a way to disable the phone volume and have everything forced to 100% but alas there's no way to do that that I can see. I would be interested to know how it works in your other OEM radios where you say this isn't an issue. When you connect to these, does the volume change on your phone?
        I'll try that. Obviously not ideal from a hands-free functionality standpoint but curious to see how that impacts volume.

        I'll say that no BT system I have works perfectly, OEM or not. They all have weird quirks. I don't have these volume issues on the other cars but even the otherwise excellent Ford system does an odd thing: it maxes ringer volume when it connects. Strange, since the phone doesn't even use the ringer when synced. Maybe it just maxes all volumes to 100% but I've never had a BT device adjust this value. Mornings after result in a very loud alarm on my phone when I forget to lower it back down.

        Bluetooth calling is pretty low on the totem poll for me so these are minor issues personally. For those that spend a lot of time on the phone while driving this might be more impactful.

        My priority was much more on music and especially podcasts. Podcasts sounded so bad when using FM or tape adapters. The audio quality is in a different league now.
        1989 BMW 325is Coupe - Alpine White

        Comment


          You’re microphone may also be a factor, and quality of the cell connection. Try several calls and if possible a different mike to be sure. BT phone connection quality with the board I’ve been using has been great, with the top down.
          I BUY/SELL REFURBISHED CM5907s & CM5908s

          HOWTOs:
          DB vert plastic bumpers
          OEM Keys
          MTech1 docs

          88 ix Lach/Card
          91 ic Calypso 3.1
          86 Cosmo 2.7

          OEM+ or bust!


          reelizmpro: I will always be an e30 guy.. I still do all of my own labor
          TrentW: There's just something so right about a well-built M20 in an E30
          e30m3s54turbo: I save my money for tuner parts.

          Comment


            Originally posted by jaysterling View Post
            The Echo canceller is enabled on the module. I have had one or two the other end complained to me about an echo, but then most of them have had no complaints. Not really sure on that one other than CSR's EC isn't converging for some reason. The delays really shouldn't be an issue for the module though since there should be negligible input and output latencies from the chip's perspective - everything around it is analog.

            Anyway Travis, if it's always an issue for you, let me know and I'll make sure there's nothing else I can do. The more directional mic also might help.
            Might be hard to get good cancellation with all the different setups people have with one mic. You might need mic placement instructions for people, and tune things around that?

            There's also provisions for two mics, and CSR says two mics are the main component of their noise cancellation. Maybe a mic inside the radio might help?

            Their echo patents also talk about the mic being very close to the noise source. Not sure what to make of that, maybe too directional of a mic won't work for their acoustic echo cancellation?
            Embodiments are directed towards providing acoustic echo cancellation in a closely-coupled microphone/speaker system. A speaker may produce an audible signal from a reference signal, which may be captured with a microphone. Full band cancellation (FBC) may modify the captured signal to suppress an echo of the reference signal caused by a direct acoustic path between the microphone and speaker. FBC may include a fixed filter and an adaptive filter. The fixed filter may modify the captured signal based on the reference signal. The adaptive filter may automatically adapt based on the captured signal and the reference signal. If a comparison of a performance of the adaptive filter and the fixed filter is above a threshold, then the fixed filter may be updated based on the adaptive filter. Subband acoustic echo cancellation may generate an output signal that suppresses residual echoes of the reference signal based on the modified signal.

            Comment


              Originally posted by george graves View Post
              Oh - BTW - just ran into this this week. If you need some shielding, I stumbled upon a DYI electric guitar making forum. And they use this copper adhesive sheets. Didn't know they existed. Google for "copper adhesive guitar sheets" and you should find it.
              Yeah I actually heard about that stuff while trying to work out the noise problem, didn't know it existed either. I bought some in tape form and I tried to build up a shield with it but I had bad results, it didn't do much. In hindsight, I'm not sure I had realized the importance the top lid plays in the shielding when I did this, so I might not have tested with it on. Anyways, cool stuff:



              Originally posted by tuckerware View Post
              I'll try that. Obviously not ideal from a hands-free functionality standpoint but curious to see how that impacts volume.

              I'll say that no BT system I have works perfectly, OEM or not. They all have weird quirks. I don't have these volume issues on the other cars but even the otherwise excellent Ford system does an odd thing: it maxes ringer volume when it connects. Strange, since the phone doesn't even use the ringer when synced. Maybe it just maxes all volumes to 100% but I've never had a BT device adjust this value. Mornings after result in a very loud alarm on my phone when I forget to lower it back down.
              Ah, ok. Even though your ringer itself isn't used, that volume still applies when it rings over BT, so the Ford system must set the volumes to max like you said so that you don't get a silent ringer going, and that still applies next morning to your alarm. It'd be better if the OS kept volumes separate for BT vs. built-in, but at the end of the day, I don't think there is a way to disable remote volume control, so that battle of volumes is there.

              The thing that probably makes it integrate into new head units better is that the stereo volume and volume knob are all controlled digitally, so they can make the stereo volume track the slider on your phone, they stay in sync, and it can be pretty seamless.

              Originally posted by earthwormjim View Post
              Might be hard to get good cancellation with all the different setups people have with one mic. You might need mic placement instructions for people, and tune things around that?

              There's also provisions for two mics, and CSR says two mics are the main component of their noise cancellation. Maybe a mic inside the radio might help?

              Their echo patents also talk about the mic being very close to the noise source. Not sure what to make of that, maybe too directional of a mic won't work for their acoustic echo cancellation?
              https://www.google.com/patents/US9280983
              That'd be interesting for me to look into, I wonder how usable that signal would be in there. Anyway, for now I'm going to stick with 1 mic and I'm going to look into supplying a mic with the kit to remove that variable.


              So I have quotes back on the board fabrication + assembly and the shields and I think I'm ready to hit the big red button on the first 50 :) Other than the feedback here, I worked with Shannon on an issue where it would stop doing next/previous after going immediately from forward to rewind. Luckily that was just a firmware bug that is now worked out. So I don't know of any outstanding "it doesn't work" issues.

              Assembly of the boards is quoted at 4-5 weeks, so there's a bit of a waiting period. In the meantime though, I'll be working on a testing/programming jig so I can quickly plop a board on, validate the hardware in an automated way, program the firmware, and be done.

              Comment


                Originally posted by jaysterling View Post
                I'm not sure I had realized the importance the top lid plays in the shielding when I did this, so I might not have tested with it on. Anyways, cool stuff:
                Sorry - unclear photo. So question. Are you just trying to cover the amp chip? I'm sure any noise is get into the PCB traces (aka antennas) way before it. If you look at some of the better aftermarket decks, they go as far as putting the voltage buck/booster circuit in it's on little RF faraday cage at about 12" of wire away from the deck. But I bet you know that.
                Originally posted by Matt-B
                hey does anyone know anyone who gets upset and makes electronics?

                Comment


                  so...i pulled my original and sent it to factory radio service in LA. they fixed everything wrong (LEDs, broken #6 and on/off knob, refurbed the whole thing and installed aux jack for 125 bucks...
                  works like new... i stick a blue tooth receiver in the aux jack and i'm golden...
                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                  '90 325i sedan daily driven
                  '85 325e coupe also a daily

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by chefpeterlevine View Post
                    so...i pulled my original and sent it to factory radio service in LA. they fixed everything wrong (LEDs, broken #6 and on/off knob, refurbed the whole thing and installed aux jack for 125 bucks...
                    works like new... i stick a blue tooth receiver in the aux jack and i'm golden...
                    More than $100 and you can't use any of the controls on your radio for Bluetooth, nice....

                    Comment


                      I rarely use the bluetooth.... It's for the kids in the back.... I do play cassettes I made 30 years ago though... Just having fun.... All oem


                      Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk
                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                      '90 325i sedan daily driven
                      '85 325e coupe also a daily

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by chefpeterlevine View Post
                        I rarely use the bluetooth.... It's for the kids in the back.... I do play cassettes I made 30 years ago though... Just having fun.... All oem


                        Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk
                        Sounds like that solution works for you then. But that hole they drilled in your faceplate isn't OEM.

                        Comment


                          you are correct sir.... but at least I still have all the functionality of the original stereo...

                          Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk
                          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                          '90 325i sedan daily driven
                          '85 325e coupe also a daily

                          Comment


                            Knock yourself out Chef. Not sure what your point is about using 30 year old cassette tapes, other than shit posting this thread.

                            However, $125 seems like a very good investment to get an OEM radio working again. I’d certainly invest up to that amount to get an original radio ready for a fully integrated BT retrofit with handsfree phone support.
                            I BUY/SELL REFURBISHED CM5907s & CM5908s

                            HOWTOs:
                            DB vert plastic bumpers
                            OEM Keys
                            MTech1 docs

                            88 ix Lach/Card
                            91 ic Calypso 3.1
                            86 Cosmo 2.7

                            OEM+ or bust!


                            reelizmpro: I will always be an e30 guy.. I still do all of my own labor
                            TrentW: There's just something so right about a well-built M20 in an E30
                            e30m3s54turbo: I save my money for tuner parts.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by chefpeterlevine View Post
                              you are correct sir.... but at least I still have all the functionality of the original stereo...

                              Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk
                              With no Bluetooth integration. Why are you thread crapping in a thread about an integrated Bluetooth solution, that intentionally replaces the tape deck?

                              Comment


                                sorry guys. please excuse my ignorance.

                                Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk
                                ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                                '90 325i sedan daily driven
                                '85 325e coupe also a daily

                                Comment

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