The Damn Catholic Church...

[87e30]

Nope, I don't discount any single person from any single faith, I can't presume to know what their true relationship to God is. Just because they fall into a neat little categorized series of boxes, it does not mean that that they may or may not gain eternal salvation.

Remember a quote I used above, "Many flocks have I...", who really knows? God, and he is the only one, I'm just glad to be along for the ride and a part of His plan, no matter how meek or meager my place may be.

Interesting. So in that sense, you may not even believe that you are saved for sure? It's sorta a tossup, and you do what you, individually, deem 'best?'

[Farbin Kaiber]

Exactly, I'm just gonna go on doing the best I can, I'll never really know if I'm on the right track until that final day, but it feels right, I feel like I have a much better relationship and understanding now than I did always asking and not feeling right in the Catholic "program". I don't presume to know what his plan is, but simply accept that he has a plan. Maybe Jesus is coming back in a flying saucer. I really don't know. But, I know, one day, he is coming back. It's way too hard to presume what is really gonna happen, so in the mean time, I'm gonna hope the teacher's he has placed in front of me are guiding me down the right path, but shit, it could all be a sham and the one true religion is Unitarian Universalism or Zoroastrianism.

[87e30]

Exactly, I'm just gonna go on doing the best I can, I'll never really know if I'm on the right track until that final day, but it feels right, I feel like I have a much better relationship and understanding now than I did always asking and not feeling right in the Catholic "program". I don't presume to know what his plan is, but simply accept that he has a plan. Maybe Jesus is coming back in a flying saucer. I really don't know. But, I know, one day, he is coming back. It's way too hard to presume what is really gonna happen, so in the mean time, I'm gonna hope the teacher's he has placed in front of me are guiding me down the right path, but shit, it could all be a sham and the one true religion is Unitarian Universalism or Zoroastrianism.

Interesting perspective. For me, I would find that challenging to continue on with my own beliefs. Like I said, after dropping my beliefs I feel like a large weight is off of my back. (Working towards a "relationship" I have no real way of personally gauging, meeting standards placed by individuals, internal struggle on what s really true, what's going to happen when I die, etc)

[markseven]

Belief without doubt is like a body with no anti-bodies. Doubt is needed to continue to have understanding of other's perspective, just as anyone (ourselves) would like civil understanding when it comes to our belief. Not the "you're retarded if you believe in this crap!" as many think is appropriate.

Haha, yeah... funny stuff. Sometimes I let my emotions get the best of me and I'll get, ahem "edgy" or something.

Nope, I don't discount any single person from any single faith, I can't presume to know what their true relationship to God is. Just because they fall into a neat little categorized series of boxes, it does not mean that that they may or may not gain eternal salvation.

Remember a quote I used above, "Many flocks have I...", who really knows? God, and he is the only one, I'm just glad to be along for the ride and a part of His plan, no matter how meek or meager my place may be.

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. - John 14:6

Very clear. There is no other way to God the Father than through the Son, the Messiah, Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

[Schnitzer318is]

Like I said, after dropping my beliefs I feel like a large weight is off of my back. (Working towards a "relationship" I have no real way of personally gauging, meeting standards placed by individuals, internal struggle on what s really true, what's going to happen when I die, etc)

Same^

Which is why I live by the Golden Rule and that is it. I have myself to answer to. If I do something that makes me feel uneasy, it's probably because I did something wrong. And of course the opposite holds true for positive things.

[Farbin Kaiber]

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. - John 14:6

Very clear. There is no other way to God the Father than through the Son, the Messiah, Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

Exactly, thus, I can't presume to know what Christian is doing what, who of who is getting in, whom is doing it right. By faith I was speaking of Christian Faith.

[87e30]

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. - John 14:6

Very clear. There is no other way to God the Father than through the Son, the Messiah, Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

I don't like the fact that everyone else immediately gets punished for ETERNITY because of this. It didn't used to weird me out when I assumed everyone had heard of but rejected Christianity, but when I started thinking about how many people have never encountered this particular belief structure I began to wonder, would 'God' really destroy these people for an entire eternity for being raised in a non-christian culture?

Then what about the exceptions made for children who die, like well since they are kids they get a pass? At this point you start making answers that you simply shouldn't be, but they are valid questions.

Every way I look at it, personally, it seems to be guided by the human hand with a hope in God, rather than the other way around.

[Farbin Kaiber]

But when he comes back, he gives everyone a second chance, or in some cases, a first chance to accept him. So, who is to say natives in Africa, South America, and other places won't be getting in?

[87e30]

But when he comes back, he gives everyone a second chance, or in some cases, a first chance to accept him. So, who is to say natives in Africa, South America, and other places won't be getting in?

That is true, depending on your belief of Revelations, the 7 'last' years, and the "rapture" you make a very good point.

^assuming this is true, and that everyone is left on earth for 7 years, then raptured.

[joshh]

The only way out of messes like this is to buckle down and take responsibility for things under your control. The Pope is supposed to be a leader...

[Schnitzer318is]

The Pope is supposed to be a leader...

Agreed.

Someone needs to man up and allow Catholic priests to marry and forget celibacy. 9/10 times I'm sure it's the root cause of these problems.

[markseven]

Agreed.

Someone needs to man up and allow Catholic priests to marry and forget celibacy. 9/10 times I'm sure it's the root cause of these problems.

If that was the case they would be getting busted with hookers.

[Schnitzer318is]

If that was the case they would be getting busted with hookers.

Better than children any day. ;)

[markseven]

I'll just leave this here.

[ck_taft325is]

I don't like the fact that everyone else immediately gets punished for ETERNITY because of this. It didn't used to weird me out when I assumed everyone had heard of but rejected Christianity, but when I started thinking about how many people have never encountered this particular belief structure I began to wonder, would 'God' really destroy these people for an entire eternity for being raised in a non-christian culture?

Then what about the exceptions made for children who die, like well since they are kids they get a pass? At this point you start making answers that you simply shouldn't be, but they are valid questions.

Every way I look at it, personally, it seems to be guided by the human hand with a hope in God, rather than the other way around.

There's that verse "By no other name than mine" that I've thought long and hard about. I think it's less a matter of knowing the name "Jesus" but rather a statement of fact. No other name, Buddha, Muhammad (spelling?) etc, will get you to heaven. Not so much, "Hey this is the password... say it at the pearly gates and James Dean will let you by".

I'm going to put a question out there... while feeling liberated at discerning your own "right and wrong", how do you reconcile beliefs or sociapathology that dictates to someone else what is right and wrong? Stark contrast wise. Not the "I fold my socks this way and he does it this way, thus wrong." Belief in God is much less than someone, a person (preacher, pastor, priest, etc) telling you how to live your life as there are freedoms in Christ that the Bible does not comment on (Masturbation, smoking cigarettes, smoking weed and the like). Religious types like to claim certain things are wrong and while one can make a case for all of those stated above, I don't think the Bible has a particular view point on these beyond personal conviction.

Fact: Everyone can benefit from the Bible. The Ten Commandments alone are pretty huge. The purpose of the Bible (Old to New Testament) really shows us in stark contrast how little we are capable of following it. Does this make it wrong simply because we fail? I don't think so. It points ultimately to Christ/God and how and why we were created. Relationship.

I'm ranting at this point and as I've been told, I type too much ;)

Definately enjoying peoples opinions and view points on this. To be honest, I've been challanged and had to question things from a different point of view in regards to my faith and for this, I thank you guys.