input on a discussion

[smonkbmw]

me and a friend were discussing what would be the best motor to build for a supercharged/intercooled setup? hes sayin s50 with s52 crank and s50 top end. i think a built m52 block with headwork might work better and be cheaper. price is kind of a option but not really. end result needs to push close or over 500hp and be using FI. or is it possible to get that kind of number without FI. oh and turbo isnt a option.

[xLibelle]

m20b27 block with m20b25 head is the apsolute cheapest, easiest, and moderately powered start available!!!
not to mention, plenty of room in the bay, nice drop in compression, parts on the cheap in every junk yard in america, plenty of torque for a blown setup, etc, etc...
if youre gonna go dohc, do it because of the safer high rev and fact alone its a great NA engine. not because you want to waste your money and show the dohc guys one up.

[matt]

oh and turbo isnt a option.

You're not going to make 500hp with a supercharger.

or is it possible to get that kind of number without FI.

Sure... sell your e30 and buy a camaro.

me and a friend were discussing what would be the best motor to build for a supercharged/intercooled setup? hes sayin s50 with s52 crank and s50 top end.

DOHC is always better. I don't think I've ever seen a 500hp M20 turbo, and I promise you there is not a 500hp M20 supercharged.

[devonjordan]

You're not going to make 500hp with a supercharger.

You can easily make 500 hp with a supercharger, its just going to cost more money. My friend built an S54 with I think just over 600hp, granted it was a fully built and blueprinted motor and bored to 3.4, but still its possible. See next months eurotuner, its the red e46.

[nando]

DOHC is always better. I don't think I've ever seen a 500hp M20 turbo,

you need to get out more often.

[Van Westervelt]

You're not going to make 500hp with a supercharger.

You sure ... ?

Active's stage 2 C38 kit ends with a result of 456 bhp and thats with stock internals etc. running 10.5 psi.

And I think he specifically stated, Supercharger, and that Turbo wasnt an option? Maybe I'm blind. lol

[NC325iC]

get a nice twin screw on that bad boy and you can make 500

[matt]

You sure ... ?

Active's stage 2 C38 kit ends with a result of 456 bhp and thats with stock internals etc. running 10.5 psi.

And I think he specifically stated, Supercharger, and that Turbo wasnt an option? Maybe I'm blind. lol

He said that. Then I said he's not going to make 500hp with a supercharger. I mean, it's obviously possible. Anything is possible, given the right resources. But I don't see it happening.

Regarding the C38: 456bhp my balls. That's probably 350 at the wheels. AA is always very optimistic.

Keep in mind, TRM built and tuned two of, if not the two highest HP twinscrews in the US... I am not anti-supercharger. They just aren't the best option for big power. (400+ wheel hp)

[matt]

get a nice twin screw on that bad boy and you can make 500

500 crank.

[smonkbmw]

m20 is not a option. sorry, this is going to be a huge project car and old school technology isnt going to work. were looking at a 24valve for sure. the bigger question is what mix/match of block, head, crank, pistons etc.

[Keith M]

Money can get you what you want...
The last PTG M3 3.2 AMLS car put out about 440hp with intake restrictors. Cost - $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Supercharged - you could do it but you would need an experienced engine builder and lots of dyno time to tune it.

Cheapest solution is the LS whatever 7.0 litre. 505 hp for $13,000 plus a ton of fab work and other parts.

What the hell do you want 500 hp for Jeff??

Keith

[StereoInstaller1]

What the hell do you want 500 hp for Jeff??

Dude...he is pretty big

[SamuraiSam]

m20 is not a option. sorry, this is going to be a huge project car and old school technology isnt going to work. were looking at a 24valve for sure. the bigger question is what mix/match of block, head, crank, pistons etc.

Not to be a dick but building a 'huge project car' requires 3 things: experience, knowledge, and money.

From the very basic, general questions you have asked, and statements you have made such as "or is it possible to get that kind of number without FI. oh and turbo isnt a option" and "price is kind of a option" it appears that you don't have any of the 3. I have worked at shops and been actively involved in "huge project car" builds, and know what it takes to do the job correctly.

I'm no BMW guru, but I would either build an LSx engine with L92 heads and a Lysholm supercharger, or if you want to stay with a BMW powerplant, build and turbocharge a S50B32.

[smonkbmw]

Not to be a dick but building a 'huge project car' requires 3 things: experience, knowledge, and money.

From the very basic, general questions you have asked, and statements you have made such as "or is it possible to get that kind of number without FI. oh and turbo isnt a option" and "price is kind of a option" it appears that you don't have any of the 3. I have worked at shops and been actively involved in "huge project car" builds, and know what it takes to do the job correctly.

I'm no BMW guru, but I would either build an LSx engine with L92 heads and a Lysholm supercharger, or if you want to stay with a BMW powerplant, build and turbocharge a S50B32.

and you dont know who i am either. i have plenty of knowledge to do whatever it is i choose. a small block swap is to common and not staying with a bmw plant. i worded my question very plain to get the maximum number of DESCRIPTIVE answers. "build and turbocharge a s50" is not the answer im looking for. "if it were me id use a m50 block bored out to 3.1, forged m52 crank, low compression pistons, m50 head with shrick cams, while using a c38 AA kit" is more of the type answers im looking for.

you call me out and then end your post with "im no BMW guru".....interesting.

[whiltebeitel]

The s50 head is significantly better than the M50 head. Much larger ports, etc.

I will also go along with Matt's assesment of AA. I helped build a C38 stg 1 car, and it was sad. LSx swaps are hardly common. 24v swaps are.

Would you mind telling us why you can't turbo?