The Official OBD1 vs OBD2 argument thread.

328ijunkie · 12-13-2011, 04:32 AM

Alright im tired of explaining to every single guy that calls me about wiring this exact thing so here goes:

Common Arguments:
-Running your M52/S52 OBD1 does NOT make more power.
-Its not really easier
-If youre having someone like me do the wiring its no different to you
-You can still run a M50 manifold with OBD2
-You DONT have to mess with EWS at all, it is easily flashed out of an ECU
-Custom Tunes are just as available for OBD2 as they are for OBD1
-Secondary air pump and Evap stuff can also be flashed out of the ECU.

Gains with OBD2:
-Ability to reuse the sensors/harness/ecu that you most likely got with your engine
-Smarter/Better ECU that allows you to troubleshoot small issues alot better than an OBD1 ECU would
-Ability to pull live data just like you could off any other OBD2 car, data like codes, current engine temp, vehicle speed signal, short and long term O2 adaptations, etc.
-Generally better/cleaner running engine because of the smarter ECU=more power

So all you M52/S52 people, why are you so stuck on OBD1? If i could run M50/S50s on OBD2 i would. My pile of crap shop car is running an OBD2 M52 without issues and the issues it had to start with (bad cam sensor and bad coil) the ECU yelled at me for and i was able to easily just throw some new parts on it and call it a day vs OBD1 that doesnt spit out CELs for really anything and you end up having to throw all sorts of parts at it before you solve the problem.

That is all

Sputnik · 12-13-2011, 05:01 AM

Wow, alot of good points here!
what are the disadvantages of running a obd2 setup?

328ijunkie · 12-13-2011, 05:10 AM

The only real thing i can think about is the extra O2 sensors and the minor annoyance of having to get the ECU flashed.

10Toes · 12-13-2011, 08:52 AM

Where do you get all these OBD II tunes?

scottinAZ · 12-13-2011, 09:59 AM

biggest downfall to OBDII is the added cost of the system, in that you need to flash the ECU and also the additional sensors, if they did not come with the engine. R3v, being a bunch of cheap bastards that would try to negotiate a discount on a free engine, doesnt see the value added in the better system over 1980's technology.

luckysnafu · 12-13-2011, 12:07 PM

I'm in the OBD2 camp. Swapped an OBD2 M52 with S52 cams in my e30. I went OBD2 since I bought an engine that came with the rest of the parts car it was in so I had all the sensors/EWS components/etc.

If you can get a car/engine with the EWS components I don't know why you wouldn't keep OBD2. It's very simple to hook up the EWS system with all the components.

I'm surprised how many go OBD1 considering the extra parts/sensors you need to buy.

I get my ECU flashed at TRM and they are great to work with.

SwiftE30 · 12-13-2011, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luckysnafu

I'm in the OBD2 camp. Swapped an OBD2 M52 with S52 cams in my e30. I went OBD2 since I bought an engine that came with the rest of the parts car it was in so I had all the sensors/EWS components/etc.

If you can get a car/engine with the EWS components I don't know why you wouldn't keep OBD2. It's very simple to hook up the EWS system with all the components.

I'm surprised how many go OBD1 considering the extra parts/sensors you need to buy.

I get my ECU flashed at TRM and they are great to work with.

I thought if you had all the parts (ECU, ignition, and harness from the same car you didnt have to flash your ECU? How do you like those s52 cams?

I had the same thing you did, sourced a full m3 for everything and planned on staying obd2, but then i had my ECU and MAF stolen right out of my driveway, so that screwed that plan. Glad i went obd1 though, FI is a lot easier to tune with obd1.

Leo_328i · 12-13-2011, 02:14 PM

I'm doing an M52 2.5l swap early next year and already have all the OBD2 sensors ready to go.

Problem in Australia is that flashing the EWS out seems to be an unknown act... eventually I will find someone that can do it though!

If no one in Australia, and no one in the USA is happy to have a go on a Euro spec ECU, then I may have to just give up and go OBD1....

Who does these EWS delete flashes for OBD2?

328ijunkie · 12-13-2011, 02:16 PM

I can

mammoth_e30 · 12-13-2011, 02:48 PM

lol well look what I started. Sorry I didn't get a chance to call you today Dave, i am the Brett you have been trading emails with. The s52 arrived today though! I am all about not purchasing OBDI parts and modifyting the engine etc if you can wire this puppy up right. I do need to get my hands on a OBDII wire harness as all i got was the engine and a few bolted on sensors with my purchase, most everything was cut off when they pulled it.

May as well ask a few newb questions here.

Do I need an OBDII M3 DME (12141406594) or will a custom tune overwrite any OBDII DME?
Since I am in CA do you think I will run into any issues with smog?
Do I need to keep the Air pump vacuum control and emission control air pump?
Will my factory keyless entry still work?

that's all I can think of at the moment. Thanks!

Leo_328i · 12-13-2011, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 328ijunkie

I can

PM Sent.

328ijunkie · 12-13-2011, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammoth_e30

lol well look what I started. Sorry I didn't get a chance to call you today Dave, i am the Brett you have been trading emails with. The s52 arrived today though! I am all about not purchasing OBDI parts and modifyting the engine etc if you can wire this puppy up right. I do need to get my hands on a OBDII wire harness as all i got was the engine and a few bolted on sensors with my purchase, most everything was cut off when they pulled it.

May as well ask a few newb questions here.

Do I need an OBDII M3 DME (12141406594) or will a custom tune overwrite any OBDII DME?
Since I am in CA do you think I will run into any issues with smog?
Do I need to keep the Air pump vacuum control and emission control air pump?
Will my factory keyless entry still work?

that's all I can think of at the moment. Thanks!

Your Keyless entry should work just the same. If you plan on running an S52 then yes ide get an S52 ECU (i have extra ones in stock at the moment btw)

As far as smog goes, im unsure as to how it works over there but all said and done everything will run cleaner out the tailpipe than an M20 would assuming everything is running good and you can also pass an OBD2 plug in test if you needed to. SAP can be flashed out of the ECU

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwiftE30

I thought if you had all the parts (ECU, ignition, and harness from the same car you didnt have to flash your ECU? How do you like those s52 cams?

I had the same thing you did, sourced a full m3 for everything and planned on staying obd2, but then i had my ECU and MAF stolen right out of my driveway, so that screwed that plan. Glad i went obd1 though, FI is a lot easier to tune with obd1.

FI is just as easy to tune with OBD2 if not easier...

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwvb bmw

Where do you get all these OBD II tunes?

I have the ability to flash OBD2 ECUs with Technica Motorsports Tunes at my shop here in lawrenceville.

325e10 · 12-13-2011, 09:10 PM

My OBD2 swap is running fine, and made more sense cause I had most of the sensors already. ECU flash was a breeze thanks to Dave and Technica. You don't have to keep the Vac pump or related controls. Just gets flashed out with the ecu.

328ijunkie · 12-14-2011, 07:23 AM

Thx thomas

RobertK · 12-14-2011, 07:37 AM

Can you flash out the post cat O2 sensors or just use a simulator instead?

12-13-2011, 04:32 AM	#1
328ijunkie R3VLimited Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lawrenceville, GA Posts: 2,885	The Official OBD1 vs OBD2 argument thread. Alright im tired of explaining to every single guy that calls me about wiring this exact thing so here goes: Common Arguments: -Running your M52/S52 OBD1 does NOT make more power. -Its not really easier -If youre having someone like me do the wiring its no different to you -You can still run a M50 manifold with OBD2 -You DONT have to mess with EWS at all, it is easily flashed out of an ECU -Custom Tunes are just as available for OBD2 as they are for OBD1 -Secondary air pump and Evap stuff can also be flashed out of the ECU. Gains with OBD2: -Ability to reuse the sensors/harness/ecu that you most likely got with your engine -Smarter/Better ECU that allows you to troubleshoot small issues alot better than an OBD1 ECU would -Ability to pull live data just like you could off any other OBD2 car, data like codes, current engine temp, vehicle speed signal, short and long term O2 adaptations, etc. -Generally better/cleaner running engine because of the smarter ECU=more power So all you M52/S52 people, why are you so stuck on OBD1? If i could run M50/S50s on OBD2 i would. My pile of crap shop car is running an OBD2 M52 without issues and the issues it had to start with (bad cam sensor and bad coil) the ECU yelled at me for and i was able to easily just throw some new parts on it and call it a day vs OBD1 that doesnt spit out CELs for really anything and you end up having to throw all sorts of parts at it before you solve the problem. That is all __________________ Check Us out on Facebook Needing a harness adapter or wiring help? Check it out: also have 24v motor mounts, E30 M3 covers and E36 ECU mounts! Full Product Line OBD1, OBD2 24v as well as S54 Swap Tuning and harness modifications now available!

12-13-2011, 05:10 AM	#3
328ijunkie R3VLimited Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lawrenceville, GA Posts: 2,885	The only real thing i can think about is the extra O2 sensors and the minor annoyance of having to get the ECU flashed. __________________ Check Us out on Facebook Needing a harness adapter or wiring help? Check it out: also have 24v motor mounts, E30 M3 covers and E36 ECU mounts! Full Product Line OBD1, OBD2 24v as well as S54 Swap Tuning and harness modifications now available!

12-13-2011, 09:59 AM	#5
scottinAZ E30 Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: San Tan Valley, Arizona Posts: 1,312 Images: 4	biggest downfall to OBDII is the added cost of the system, in that you need to flash the ECU and also the additional sensors, if they did not come with the engine. R3v, being a bunch of cheap bastards that would try to negotiate a discount on a free engine, doesnt see the value added in the better system over 1980's technology. __________________ I saved 15% on my Bimmer parts by switching to ...

12-13-2011, 02:14 PM	#8
Leo_328i Wrencher Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 224	I'm doing an M52 2.5l swap early next year and already have all the OBD2 sensors ready to go. Problem in Australia is that flashing the EWS out seems to be an unknown act... eventually I will find someone that can do it though! If no one in Australia, and no one in the USA is happy to have a go on a Euro spec ECU, then I may have to just give up and go OBD1.... Who does these EWS delete flashes for OBD2? __________________ Leo. E30 318iS, E36 328i

12-13-2011, 02:16 PM	#9
328ijunkie R3VLimited Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lawrenceville, GA Posts: 2,885	I can __________________ Check Us out on Facebook Needing a harness adapter or wiring help? Check it out: also have 24v motor mounts, E30 M3 covers and E36 ECU mounts! Full Product Line OBD1, OBD2 24v as well as S54 Swap Tuning and harness modifications now available!

12-13-2011, 05:01 AM	#2
Sputnik Mod Crazy Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Fort Lauderdale Posts: 707	Wow, alot of good points here! what are the disadvantages of running a obd2 setup?

12-13-2011, 08:52 AM	#4
10Toes Me Father Was A Tree Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Tacoma, WA Posts: 60,513 Images: 470	Where do you get all these OBD II tunes?

12-13-2011, 12:07 PM	#6
luckysnafu Advanced Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Worcester, MA Posts: 145	I'm in the OBD2 camp. Swapped an OBD2 M52 with S52 cams in my e30. I went OBD2 since I bought an engine that came with the rest of the parts car it was in so I had all the sensors/EWS components/etc. If you can get a car/engine with the EWS components I don't know why you wouldn't keep OBD2. It's very simple to hook up the EWS system with all the components. I'm surprised how many go OBD1 considering the extra parts/sensors you need to buy. I get my ECU flashed at TRM and they are great to work with.

12-13-2011, 02:48 PM	#10
mammoth_e30 Mod Crazy Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: three juan euro Posts: 706	lol well look what I started. Sorry I didn't get a chance to call you today Dave, i am the Brett you have been trading emails with. The s52 arrived today though! I am all about not purchasing OBDI parts and modifyting the engine etc if you can wire this puppy up right. I do need to get my hands on a OBDII wire harness as all i got was the engine and a few bolted on sensors with my purchase, most everything was cut off when they pulled it. May as well ask a few newb questions here. Do I need an OBDII M3 DME (12141406594) or will a custom tune overwrite any OBDII DME? Since I am in CA do you think I will run into any issues with smog? Do I need to keep the Air pump vacuum control and emission control air pump? Will my factory keyless entry still work? that's all I can think of at the moment. Thanks! __________________

12-13-2011, 09:10 PM	#13
325e10 Advanced Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 157	My OBD2 swap is running fine, and made more sense cause I had most of the sensors already. ECU flash was a breeze thanks to Dave and Technica. You don't have to keep the Vac pump or related controls. Just gets flashed out with the ecu.

12-14-2011, 07:23 AM	#14
328ijunkie R3VLimited Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lawrenceville, GA Posts: 2,885	Thx thomas __________________ Check Us out on Facebook Needing a harness adapter or wiring help? Check it out: also have 24v motor mounts, E30 M3 covers and E36 ECU mounts! Full Product Line OBD1, OBD2 24v as well as S54 Swap Tuning and harness modifications now available!

12-14-2011, 07:37 AM	#15
RobertK Kicked cancer's ASS. Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 5,269	Can you flash out the post cat O2 sensors or just use a simulator instead?