Another N52 swap attempt!

[Striker01]

Last post I mentioned waiting on pins for the green connectors, actually its two one white and one green. After looking at things again I decided to just eliminate them and wire everything directly to the IVM and ECU. Here are the ones I was talking about. I think their only purpose is to allow the 3 engine harnesses to be pulled individually. Still don't know what male and female pins they require, they aren't the same as ECU/IVM. The wiring was plenty long to reach without them. Worked out better anyway because I broke a couple locking tabs off before I figured out how to disassemble them.



Finished up all the wiring tonight. Tomorrow I will have my son or brother help ring out what hasn't been tested. For the harness ground I drilled a hole in the body tab that the dash connects to, on the passenger side. Stripped the area back to bare metal and bolted the grounds down, hit it with some paint after it was bolted together. I also added the ibooster ground here.



IVM will reside in the glove box. Two wires not connected are the Check engine light and service reset. I'll figure them out later.



Power all ran and the M3 cover fit with a little trimming. Last wire is for the alternator light. Hopefully I can get Hoveringuy's gadget for that once this thing is running.




Planning to attempt to start it this weekend!!!

[hoveringuy]

Good work!

You will absolutely, positively need INPA working when you start it.

I used it to verify each injector and coil individually by firing them, same with all the sensors, gas pedal and so on.

[Striker01]

Good work!

You will absolutely, positively need INPA working when you start it.

I used it to verify each injector and coil individually by firing them, same with all the sensors, gas pedal and so on.

I have the bimmergeeks app. Be a good chance to test it out.

[Striker01]

It runs!!!!

Not great but it started on about the 8th try. Would start and immediately die before that. Stumbles when I try to rev it a little, could be the MAF just hanging in the ambient air.

Found the pin for switched power to the EKP not seated in the lock. Fixed that now the fuel pump runs continuously with the key in run, not sure what's going on there. I also can't activate the fuel pump with bimmergeeks protool.

VANOS servo makes a screeching noise when I start or attempt to have it learn its limits with protool.

Also, the ECU was almost too hot to touch after the first few attempts and start. Not sure that's good.

Lots of work left but it runs, oil pressure was good, no fuel or oil leaks. Call that a win for the night.

Only got a short clip. My son was videoing the first few tries but got bored when it wouldn't start. I was almost too shocked to remember to video when it actually stayed running.

https://youtu.be/3ArAut_-NiQ?feature=shared

[adam.nonis]

Great news!!!!

Not great but it started on about the 8th try. Would start and immediately die before that. Stumbles when I try to rev it a little, could be the MAF just hanging in the ambient air.

Mine did this too, but it was a valvetronic issue. Once I got that cleared up it was good. Also, I HAD to use a Z4 MAF. 328 and X3 look exactly the same, but are different in communication

Found the pin for switched power to the EKP not seated in the lock. Fixed that now the fuel pump runs continuously with the key in run, not sure what's going on there. I also can't activate the fuel pump with bimmergeeks protool.

Which CAN system are you using for the EKP? I was on the wrong system and it did the same thing. I can't exactly remember what I switched it to, but PT CAN and D CAN are definitely different.

VANOS servo makes a screeching noise when I start or attempt to have it learn its limits with protool.

Mine did this too and it was a worn eccentric shaft. Pull the valvetronic motor and see if the teeth on the eccentric shaft are “nasty”. Mine were sharp. I think when these motors get started after sitting for long periods we should pull the valvetronic motor and put some assembly lube on the eccentric shaft teeth. It gets lubricated by an oil squirter and if you try and set limits dry, I could see it being an issue. I wound up having to replace the eccentric shaft.

Also, the ECU was almost too hot to touch after the first few attempts and start. Not sure that's good.

I've heard this is because of too much current on the valvetronic motor. Be careful, I've also heard it can burn the drivers.


This ALL sounds exactly like what I went through. It'll get worked out though and you'll be ecstatic!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[hoveringuy]

It runs!!!!

Not great but it started on about the 8th try. Would start and immediately die before that. Stumbles when I try to rev it a little, could be the MAF just hanging in the ambient air.

Found the pin for switched power to the EKP not seated in the lock. Fixed that now the fuel pump runs continuously with the key in run, not sure what's going on there. I also can't activate the fuel pump with bimmergeeks protool.

VANOS servo makes a screeching noise when I start or attempt to have it learn its limits with protool.

Also, the ECU was almost too hot to touch after the first few attempts and start. Not sure that's good.

Lots of work left but it runs, oil pressure was good, no fuel or oil leaks. Call that a win for the night.

Only got a short clip. My son was videoing the first few tries but got bored when it wouldn't start. I was almost too shocked to remember to video when it actually stayed running.

CONGRATS!!

Everything that Adam said.

The EKP will go into failsafe mode and run continuously when t doesn't have a valid CAN signal, when it's working correctly you'll be able to turn it on and off in your app. The correct EKP will say "CAN 11h". They were used on X3 and E85 Z4.

Put a 4mm(?) hex into the back of the VVL motor, it should turn pretty smoothly and without excessive force. If you're feeling the teeth on the spline as they move it's gotten worn. It was so tight on Adam's that we assume it was a corroded motor, but it wasn't.

ECU shouldn't be getting that hot...

No throttle body, no MAF?

Z4 MAF uses analog signal and E90, etc use digital. Not compatible....

You just have some details to sort at this point.

[Striker01]

Great news!!!!




Mine did this too, but it was a valvetronic issue. Once I got that cleared up it was good. Also, I HAD to use a Z4 MAF. 328 and X3 look exactly the same, but are different in communication

I ordered the Z4 MAF back when you guys were talking about this issue. I'll double check the part number, may just be because it's plugged in but just hanging by the engine.



Which CAN system are you using for the EKP? I was on the wrong system and it did the same thing. I can't exactly remember what I switched it to, but PT CAN and D CAN are definitely different.

I don't know what CAN system it is using. I have the EKPM2 Can11h. I tried switching the bus wires around, pulled the pin 8 to 15 jumper and still runs constantly. Next step is 120OHM resister on the jumper wire. No idea after that.



Mine did this too and it was a worn eccentric shaft. Pull the valvetronic motor and see if the teeth on the eccentric shaft are “nasty”. Mine were sharp. I think when these motors get started after sitting for long periods we should pull the valvetronic motor and put some assembly lube on the eccentric shaft teeth. It gets lubricated by an oil squirter and if you try and set limits dry, I could see it being an issue. I wound up having to replace the eccentric shaft.

I will check this out today.

I've heard this is because of too much current on the valvetronic motor. Be careful, I've also heard it can burn the drivers.

That would make sense, the way it sounds.


This ALL sounds exactly like what I went through. It'll get worked out though and you'll be ecstatic!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Thanks Adam!!

[Striker01]

CONGRATS!!

Everything that Adam said.

The EKP will go into failsafe mode and run continuously when t doesn't have a valid CAN signal, when it's working correctly you'll be able to turn it on and off in your app. The correct EKP will say "CAN 11h". They were used on X3 and E85 Z4.

I have the one that says CAN11h. I tried to follow your guidance for everything, read through the original thread 3 or 4 times at this point. I wonder if 22RPD tune is different enough from Nando's original that something needs to be wired different. Going to try a resistor on the jumper wire.

Put a 4mm(?) hex into the back of the VVL motor, it should turn pretty smoothly and without excessive force. If you're feeling the teeth on the spline as they move it's gotten worn. It was so tight on Adam's that we assume it was a corroded motor, but it wasn't.

Will look into that today

ECU shouldn't be getting that hot...

No throttle body, no MAF?

Both are installed but MAF is just hanging. will verify one I ordered is actually Z4.

Z4 MAF uses analog signal and E90, etc use digital. Not compatible....

You just have some details to sort at this point.

Did you weld the bung on your radiator for the heater line or can I get a radiator that already has one installed?

Also noticed something strange that I forgot to post last night. With C101 pin 18 jumped to pin 15 I was getting 9V with key in Run and 12V in start, ended up diode isolating pin 18 to get it to read 0 in run and 12V only during start. Thought it was kind of weird.

[hoveringuy]

I welded a 3/4" bung to a standard radiator.

Adam's ECU was straight-up cloned from mine, which has the Z4 base code.

I don't know how 22RPD did yours, if it has the E90 based code.

Nando had a reason for switching to Z4 but theoretically E90 would work as well, you just need to know what you have!

I was wondering how it was idling so smoothly with what I assume is a VVL code. If there is one, it will go into limp mode and run off the throttle body. To your point, it won't rev well without the MAF.

[Striker01]

Thanks. I'll get a bung on the way for the radiator.

EKPM2 without the can11h is $30, one is on the way. Tried everything else I could think of. Looks like the E90 uses PT Can instead of D can, maybe that will fix the issue. I'll also try to find out what they used for the base tune, be good to know. Hopefully it won't require any other changes if it is e90.

Looks like I partially destroyed my eccentric teeth, lots of shiny concave spots on them now. Adam mentioned using assembly lube on that gear and I will when I install the new one.

[Striker01]

I ran into the same issue both hoveringuy and adam.nonis had with the VVT limit learning. After talking with those guys I thought I would need to get my hands on INPA to see the movement limits to the eccentric physical stops, live data wouldn't work before on protool, got a not available for your ECU error. Couldn't find a copy of INPA I could get to work so got frustrated and tried my protool app again. The live data option started working after the car finally started for the first time. The only difference was I was wired to the OBD port through USB, it was bluetooth the first time. Read the limits like Steve suggested. Mine was reading from 0 to 224 degrees but still wouldn't pass the limit learn procedure. ended up using a washer just like they did. Took it from 0 to 3 and passed on the first try. Steve mentioned this procedure should be mandatory preflight before attempting to start and I agree 100%, also assembly lube like Adam suggested. The noise it was making before the limit learning passed was pretty scary.

My eccentric teeth didn't look as bad as I thought, just some shiny spots on a couple teeth. I'm going to send it for now and will change it and the actuator if it gives me any problems. There are a few spots where its harder to turn but I'm hoping that's just spring tension. The ECU turns it fast and doesn't seem to get as hot as it did before.

I can see why Steve said its so important to have INPA. The protool app seems to work good as well, now that I have live data. Verified pedal readings, intake air temp, VVT commanded position vs actual and quite a few other parameters. My only complaint is that it takes forever to load and get connected to the car, it searches for every module a newer car should have; wish you could select only to search for the DME but its in English so I'm not complaining too much.



Reached out to 22RDP to find out what they used for my base tune, not able to get protool to talk to the EKP or get it to turn off once ignition power is applied. Hopefully have that issue sorted shortly. Time to button up the exhaust and get the cooling system sorted.

[Striker01]

Slowly getting closer to being able to drive this thing.

Exhaust is fully welded and ready to go. I have a little leak at one of my header flanges, guess it warped a little during welding. Hopefully find a slightly thicker gasket or maybe some copper spray on the gasket for final install.




Heater core port is installed on the radiator, should've put it lower to be flush with the frame rail but it'll work.



Lower radiator hose is set, had to space the thermostat housing out a little to clear the AC pulley, still only have about 3/8" of clearance between the hose and belt. Have to keep an eye on it but motor shouldn't move much on poly mounts, I hope.




Found out my ECU is indeed coded as an E85. Still working with 22RPD to figure out why my EKP runs constantly, tried another CAN-11h one and it does the same thing. CAN H wire gets around 3v and L around 1V when powered so I think I have a protocol issue between it and the ECU. They sent me a file to flash, to change the protocol but I can't get it loaded into the ECU.

Their flash tool can see and read the ECU but fails with an unable to erase ECU error every time I try to flash it. I am using the bimmergeeks expert cable with COM latency set to 1ms. I'm open for ideas if anyone may know what the issue is.

[Striker01]

Finally making some decent progress. I got the flash issue figured out. After trying multiple times with no luck I decided to run a heavier gauge wire from the OBD port to the ECU. I think I had 24 originally and went with .5mm wire from one of my N52 harnesses, for clarity I've had the IVM bypassed with both wires. strangely that fixed the issue, flashed on the first try after changing it. I was able to flash the updated tune 22RPD sent and now my EKP works as intended; runs for a second on initial ignition and turns off until I crank it. I don't think the wire size here was my problem. I haven't been able to successfully flash the ECU since the one time it worked. Probably tried 100 times in the last 10 days.



Had a pretty big setback with brake lines, after filling the reservoir I had leaks from the ABS unit, rear brake bias valve and the T above the rear subframe. That was just from gravity, I can't imagine if I'd attempted to bleed anything. Luckily the only paint that peeled from it was under the ABS module and the tab for the rear bias valve. I think the problem was a combination of the cheap amazon flare tool I used and some of the fittings I bought didn't have enough neck past the threads to seat the flares. I ended re-terminating all the brake lines, with a better flare tool, and remade a few of the shorter ones. Changing the rear hard lines with the subframe in was quite a project. Everything seems to be good now, brakes are bled and hopefully ready to go.

I battled bleeding the clutch for quite a while, With the N52 my clutch line is too short to pull the slave cylinder with everything connected and pumping the pedal got me nowhere. If the flare tool was my worst amazon purchase then a reverse brake bleeder was the best $60 I've ever spent there. With it, and my son's eyes on the reservoir, I had the clutch bled and ready in about 10 minutes. I recommend it for sure, but thread tape on the bleeder is a must with it.



I think I have everything plumbed and ready to start so I can let the engine run for longer than a minute. I don't really like the N52 intake manifold, it makes running anything a huge pain, ran out of real estate super quick once I started trying to get the power steering and coolant lines ready. I will definitely be switching to EPS and a different intake manifold at some point in the future. I'm not pleased with the heater plumbing and engine wiring mess on the driver's side.






Planning to pick up some distilled water and power steering fluid tomorrow so I can get all the fluids filled and ready for some actual runtime on the engine. I should probably plug in that oil pressure sensor as well, lol.

[hoveringuy]

Nice work!

adam.nonis was just asking about this so I thought I'd post the weight loss from switching to the Magnesium diet...

both of these were fully-dressed, the N52 is as I got it from the dismantler with everything but the exhaust manifold. Note that the 6 speed transmission alone is about 20lbs heavier than the G260.

An M50/S50 would be roughly 90-100lbs heavier than an N52, depending on transmission.

[Striker01]

40lbs lighter, probably 30 with the skidplate/oil pan ;). I'm guessing at least 100hp over a tired M20, 6 gears, no valve adjustments, probably better mileage. If you don't mind a year of frustration and banging your head against a wall it sounds like a win!

Hopefully I'll know soon!!

Started the car to a terrible noise today. I was in panic mode but luckily hoveringuy suggested I pull the belt and see if it went away, fortunately it did. Apparently test starting an engine with a dry power steering pump isn't a good idea Got that replaced and everything seems good with the steering.

Had a couple minor leaks; radiator drain o-ring was dry rotted and new coolant bung on the oil filter housing was leaking from the crush washer. I tried to bleed the cooling system but can't get any heat, scared to let the temp gauge get past 1/2 because I don't have a fan hooked up yet and protool wasn't reading live data for some reason. Heater hose off the radiator wasn't even warm at 1/2 on the gauge. I'm not sure if half is enough to get the water pump pushing fluid. Reached out to make sure my tune is set to run the pump at a low rate all the time.

Also realized that the blower motor wouldn't run once the car is started, window either. Looped pin15 to pin20 on C101 to basically eliminate the the unloader relay feature, another hoveringuy idea. Nice to have some adult supervision around here.