Re-wired audio system, sounds oh so good! (semi-long read)

[sonick]

As promised, stereo system photos:

Daytime


Dimmer = ON


MTX tweeter retrofit (i.e. dremel-ed) into oem tweeter pods.


Kappa 6x9


Glamour shot


Ugly el-cheapo sub

[sonick]

+1, hooked the tweeters back up after work today, much better.

[P. Kennedy]

.02

I'm going to jump in here on the rear speaker issue: I have always loved headphones (good ones) and have always utilized rear speakers in a balance that makes me feel like I'm in the "middle" of everything. Yeah, I know it's not lifelike, or concert-like, but...I...like.

In 1974 I saw Emerson Lake & Palmer live, and that particular tour was in Quadraphonic! To this day, best concert I've ever seen in my life! Talk about surround sound!

[sonick]

It's not unbearably shrill; 'fatiguing' is a better descriptor.

[StereoInstaller1]

Your comment that the tweets are that shrill makes me wonder if the wiring is correct...I mean, yeah, they can be harsh, but should not be that bad.

[sonick]

I followed the advice in here and amped up the front components while powering the rears off the deck.

Definitely more oomph and warmth from the front without sacrificing rear sound quality.

Also disconnected the tweeters from the rears. Not sure if I like it or not. It definitely does push the soundstage forward, but at the expense of rear passenger and treble sound quality as the MTX tweeters aren't very good and I find them a bit shrill by themselves.

[StereoInstaller1]

Yeah, that 0 gauge is barely adequate, I know.

Seriously though, I am doing a run of 00 to the front and adding a second battery sometime.

[quickervicar]

Luke, have you considered investing in a better battery & leads? ;)

[StereoInstaller1]

Funny, like 8 years ago I stopped into a new car audio shop and talked to the sales people about what I could do with my system... they suggested that I get a 2-channel amp and wire it to the rear speakers! I walked out and wasn't surprised when they went out of business a year later.

Yeah...people wonder why I say that 99% of the people in this industry are idiots.

"Oh yeah, I like the music from behind me"...do you really stand facing away from the band at a concert? Aaaaargh!

I now run nothing in the rear in one E30, and 2 5.25 in the rear of another, but with it turned waaaaaay down. You really don't need them for good sound reproduction in a small car.

I have mixed feelings on this. My car has no rear stage, but my fronts are just a bit more aggressive than most:



Most cars I do now have some kind of rear speakers, but I keep the sound 95% front. I have tried the "rear midbass only" thing, but I didn't care for it.

Fortunately, this stuff is easy to change, right? Well, it isn't if you cannot get to your controls:


Luke

[dubdub]

Funny, like 8 years ago I stopped into a new car audio shop and talked to the sales people about what I could do with my system... they suggested that I get a 2-channel amp and wire it to the rear speakers! I walked out and wasn't surprised when they went out of business a year later.

I now run nothing in the rear in one E30, and 2 5.25 in the rear of another, but with it turned waaaaaay down. You really don't need them for good sound reproduction in a small car.

[sonick]

Rear speakers should be midbass only (or rear "fill") will sound even better still.

Cool, will definitely try that. Easy enough as the rears have a separate crossover "box", I can simply disconnect the tweeter leads.

Nope, kinda the other way around. Larger speakers generally are more efficient, IE, more sound per watt, so they actually need less power per given frequency.

In addition to this, the E30 has a strong rear bias just from the weird acoustics, so if you have 1 watt to the rear, you should have about 10 to the front.

Can't wait to get home from work and try this!

So what, like May?

Hopefully sooner. More like on a weekend day when it stops raining. Hard to do on weekdays when all my daylight hours are spent in an office :(

That could be one of about 4 or 5 different woofers. You may have a great candidate for one of my boxes there. No one ever complains about sloppy bass with one of my designs, and if they do it is the wrong specs...you might wanna jump on one with this next round of boxes.
Luke

I'll find time to take out the woofer and take a look.

[StereoInstaller1]

Hmm, interesting; never thought of that. I assumed since the 6x9 was bigger it would benefit more from amping.

Nope, kinda the other way around. Larger speakers generally are more efficient, IE, more sound per watt, so they actually need less power per given frequency.

In addition to this, the E30 has a strong rear bias just from the weird acoustics, so if you have 1 watt to the rear, you should have about 10 to the front.

Pics to come once I get more daytime light and weather gets better.

So what, like May?

As for the sub, I haven't had a chance to take it out of the box yet. It just looks like this http://www.list4all.com/www3/click-it/99-2.jpg

That could be one of about 4 or 5 different woofers. You may have a great candidate for one of my boxes there. No one ever complains about sloppy bass with one of my designs, and if they do it is the wrong specs...you might wanna jump on one with this next round of boxes.

Luke

[Jean]

Rear speakers should be midbass only (or rear "fill") will sound even better still.

[sonick]

I think your car would sound MUCH better if you ran the rear speakers off the deck and the fronts off the amp...how about some pics?

BTW, what "old MTX" sub you got?

Hmm, interesting; never thought of that. I assumed since the 6x9 was bigger it would benefit more from amping.

Pics to come once I get more daytime light and weather gets better.

As for the sub, I haven't had a chance to take it out of the box yet. It just looks like this http://www.list4all.com/www3/click-it/99-2.jpg

[StereoInstaller1]

The previous owner of my car had an aftermarket stereo system installed; at first glance it looked like a pretty clean, decent install as it was clean and properly mounted.

However, upon closer inspection, it was the most random set-up ever, consisting of:

• Clarion Head Unit
• Pioneer 4ch 300W amp powering:
  • Front MTX 5.25" Coaxials and OEM Tweeter wired to coax via a bass-blocker/capacitor (via high-level input)
  • Rear Bose OEM-type 6x9 via MTX crossover with tweeters mounted on the rear deck (via line-level RCA)
  
  

So, over the past few months of my ownership, step by step I changed the setup and re-wired it to the setup I currently have now, which I am very happy with:

• Wired front speakers (coax and OEM tweeter) directly to head unit, freeing up a set of amp outputs
• Hooked up an old 10" MTX sub and ported box I had lying around to the amp (shared input with the rear speakers)

• Got rid of MTX tweeters and crossover on the rear deck, hooked up 6x9's directly to the amp (which then I found out they were shitty paper-coned Bose)

• Replaced rear 6x9's with a set of Infinity Kappas

• Rempved OEM tweeters in door pods and retrofit the aftermarket MTX tweeters

• New deck! JVC KD-R800 with iPod Control and Integrated Bluetooth and TI/Burr-Brown DAC
• Ran another set of RCA's to amp, so that the rear speakers and sub will have dedicated inputs/channels for better fine-tuning between the sub and rear speakers.

• Took the crossover from earlier and totally re-wired the fronts properly, snipped the tweeter leads off the coaxial speakers so it sucks less juice from the head unit amp, making it a true 'component' system.

Current setup:

• JVC Head Unit powering front MTX component system
• Pioneer 4ch 300W amp powering:
  • 10" MTX sub (via line-level RCA)
  • Rear Infinity Kappa 6x9's (via line-level RCA)
  
  

Tweaking:

• LPF: 80hz at the amp, off at the head-unit
• HPF: Off. I toyed with it, but found that at low volumes the HPF made the music sound 'thinner'.
• EQ: +5 at 100Hz (this REALLY helped the mid-bass dip I had, reading a comment from Luke that the frequency dynamics of the E30 cabin)

Future Upgrades? For now I am very happy with the setup, but the sub is probably the weakest link right now, I want something tighter and more musical, less boomy.

Anyways, that's my audio journey for my E30! I am more a headphones/home theater/home audio guy, but for what it consists of and what I started out with, I am very happy with the setup.

Comments or suggestions on how to make it better?

I think your car would sound MUCH better if you ran the rear speakers off the deck and the fronts off the amp...how about some pics?

BTW, what "old MTX" sub you got?