M50/S50 - M52/S52 Engine questions

[jbontke]

Yes, you should be able to do that.
But any competent machine shop should be able to determine if there will be sufficient cylinder wall thicknrss

[bluptgm3]

My question is, Can I bore a M50 out to fit my S50 Pistons? It would save me from buying oversized stuff, and just reuse the S50 Crank and Rods as well.

Yes, you should be able to do that.
But any competent machine shop should be able to determine if there will be sufficient cylinder wall thicknrss

[f4tj0n]

Sorry to bring up from the dead, but I bought an S50 with a FUBAR'd block, so the guy gave me a complete M50 that snapped a chain from a 95 E34.

My question is, Can I bore it out to fit my S50 Pistons? It would save me from buying oversized stuff, and just reuse the S50 Crank and Rods as well.

[Wanganstyle]

The closest equivalent you could get to an M3 cam upgrade is.......

M3 cam upgrade :)

(note: You cannot put VANOS cams in a non-VANOS motor, and vice versa)

My question then is, if doing non-VaNoS M50 stroker (with M54B30 rotating assembly) what would be the best option for upgrading my cams?

You can add M3 cams to ALL M50 engines; vanos or non vanos. Does not matter :)
****
S50 cams are non-counterweighted, so they fit all M50 vanos cam trays.
S52 cams are counterweighted (like a crankshaft) so the cam trays are clearanced from the factory for this reason.

I have not tried fitting S50 cam trays into M50 non-vanos engine as I did not have S50 cams (my 97 M3 was a S52).

the M50 non-vanos Cam trays are fitted for larger lifters than Vanos size. I don't have any further research on these-
I could try fitting my s54 cams into a M50 family cam tray if anyone has a tray loose in the SFBAY lol

***

You must have the M3 cams and matching trays AND lifters. I just moved the entire setup from my S52 head into a dual valvespring NON-Vanos M50 (1991) head, Vin number of head is photographed for proof :)

I installed a M50 non vanos head into my 1997 M3, ADDED vanos to the head.
I ran this on OBD2, kept full S52 vanos+cams+cam trays.

Why did I do this?

** 7mm thicker valves (for decreased power and increased reliability @ high rpm (s50/52 likes to drop valves as heads are hollow sodium filled and WELDED to the stem)
** Dual valvesprings (for more valve stability @ high rpm); less chance of going static.

I actually downgraded my s52 performance as the S52 beehive valve springs are lighter and the 6mm valves are lighter (and have tiny bit more flow velocity per VAC), Did this "downgrade" happily, and drove it DD on street post.

When I asked my machine shop to compare the M50 non vanos cylinder head to S52 (both were there to be inspected);

the port shape is slightly different on head chamber and inlet port work tiny bit different as well. Compression and flow pretty much same, not much a concern. I am not an engine builder, leave that to my professional shop.

Here is the thread from where I installed it with photos.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1379263

[FreedS4]

You can pick up a whole NV engine these days for about 100 bucks. Look around for some 525i in 91-92 MY.

Took your advice, bought an entire 92 525i (NV) for $400. Starting to take everything out of it. Now I just need to find a M54B30 rotating assembly and a Schrick cam! Thanks again.

Chris

[M-technik-3]

You can pick up a whole NV engine these days for about 100 bucks. Look around for some 525i in 91-92 MY.

[FreedS4]

That's a great read M-technik-3! I wish the Schrick cams weren't so damned expensive. Moving the intake to the exhaust side is a good choice, I guess I'll just have to start looking for an inexpensive NV 252 intake cam. Thanks

Chris

[FreedS4]

If I decided to go with a VaNoS M50, that makes the cam choices a little easier, correct? M3 cams are the easy choice, if I remember correctly. So I guess that should be the decided factor on whether to go NV or V, cam choice?

[M-technik-3]

M3 Cams in 325is
I have a 1992 325is with the non-VANOS engine. I've asked some people this question and everyone seems to give me a different answer. I want to put in M3 cams but because my car is non-VANOS I don't think it will work. Some people said. "yes," some said. "no," and some said. "only if the cams are from a 1995 M3." Turner Motorsport sells a M3 cam set for 1993-95 325is. Is the lack of VANOS going to prevent me from upgrading my engine with M3 parts? If I can't put these cams in what could I use from an M3 to give me some more horsepower?
Dave
via the Internet
We consulted BMW engine builder and parts swap specialist Pete McHenry of Precision Performance in Winston-Salem, N. Ca. His reply: "You can install an intake cam from a 1992 M50 on the exhaust side. Check the beginning of valve lift of the stock cam, then set the timing so that the swapped cam has the same starting point. This will give you a 240-degree cam with 9.7 lift vs. 9.0. Buy a Schrick non-VANOS 252 for the intake and you'll have the same timing as an M3."
In other words, forget about M3 parts, Dave--you don't have an M3. But what you do have is a very cool high-revving engine that will never need a replacement VANOS unit. In addition to McHenry's sage advice, you should consider a performance exhaust system and a performance computer chip, although neither is necessary to make the cam job work. There are lots of go-fast parts available for this engine. Just check out the ads in european car and start visiting Web sites.


Read more: http://europeancar.automotive.com/17...#ixzz1TPXHeH9F

[Wh33lhop]

Some people like to use two intake cams since the intake has a bit more lift. The closest equivalent you could get to an M3 cam upgrade is swap the NV intake cam to the exhaust side and use a custom ground 252 for the intake. If you want to go hotter than that, just go Schrick.

[FreedS4]

Holy thread revival Batman, but...

According to this thread, with regards to cams -
non-VANOS 325's had 240/240 cams.
VANOS 325's had 228/228 cams.
M3 (3.0 and 3.2) has 252/240 cams.
I believe the 328 has 228/228.
(note: You cannot put VANOS cams in a non-VANOS motor, and vice versa)

My question then is, if doing non-VaNoS M50 stroker (with M54B30 rotating assembly) what would be the best option for upgrading my cams? Since I can't use VaNoS cams in a non-VaNoS build, is a Schrick intake cam the best/most reasonable option? I've got everything nailed down for my build, with the exception of cam choice. Thanks for your help.

Chris

[breaknwrite]

I am glad i found this thread i was about to start one very similar +1 for search feature.

Anywho so i am looking to get a M50 non vanos put into my car. my question is what do you need to do the S50 conversion? As well i second "MattM20s" qestion

[Dissembler]

So with the exception what valves/springs/cams are used, the heads are all the same dimmensionally (inc intake/exhaust ports/location and bolt patterns) for vanos cars (328s and m3s) and non vanos cars?

[Stu]

Wes---Please give credit to the Alex and Pete McHenry for introducing the thought of a 2.7L M50 that can turn 8000+.

vanos or non stu?

stu, any more info on this? also a question i was hoping would get answered is, what would be the best, most potent streetable M50 without a concern for price, with reliability being one of the key factors. i think it would be interesting to see how the highest performing M50 compares to a maxed out S50, while still carrying a life expectancy of 100k+ miles.

Again, the M50/S50 engines are extremely similar with the exception of the internals. Yes, the block castings are slightly different dimensionally, and the later heads are slightly different with more port-work from the factory...but you can meet/exceed this porting by doing headwork on an earlier head.

They are all 24v 6's with hydraulic valvetrain....everything is the same layout, they just use different parts (pistons, cranks, rods, cams, springs, etc.)

[MattM20]

Wes---Please give credit to the Alex and Pete McHenry for introducing the thought of a 2.7L M50 that can turn 8000+.

vanos or non stu?

stu, any more info on this? also a question i was hoping would get answered is, what would be the best, most potent streetable M50 without a concern for price, with reliability being one of the key factors. i think it would be interesting to see how the highest performing M50 compares to a maxed out S50, while still carrying a life expectancy of 100k+ miles.