Honda K24 swap interest?

[E30SPDFRK]

I simply state a fact; bs was posted. There is no widespread left and right engine swapping of k series into s2000’s. This is bullshit

NorCal is Laguna, thunderhill, sonoma

Tracks ranked #1,#2,#17 in North America. Slightly different crowd and level and mass amounts of cars compared to your Michigan tracks of gingerman, Waterford hills - I know Michigan tracks also.


Track photo is from buttonwillow. Neither NorCal or Socal; both.
Out of the Pictured 3 s2000’s At a center of cali track two were from Socal, one NorCal.

In the major groups that book the tracks NorCal and Socal I’m involved with: there is not a single k swap s2000. There is one j32 swap s2000, that’s it. Plenty of supercharged or built f series engines as well


In Cali we have both the need and the money and the time for good engines, obviously the k is not the best route for s2000’s.

In the fwd vtec club world the b series cars often run just as fast as the k series cars.


Perhaps all the kits you have sold (I’ll be generous and assume you have sold 20).....are never at the track and too busy posting build threads. Ps there are usually 20-30 s2000’s at most track days and nobody who actually tracks an s2000 has a k motor swap.


The m20b25 that comes with every cheap ass e30 (and e30 owner) is a extremely responsive torquey engine.

Spending $4-5k on parts alone just to bolt in a fancy modern k series engine is more money than installing a native bmw engine with much more power. S54b32 and s52b32 are popular and the e30 does still handle very good with a inline 6 as delivered from the factory. The bmw engines are native installs with cheap off the shelf clutch/mounts/tuning parts. Just bolt it in and kick ass

I’m making a positive suggestion to push the new k20 turbo engine swaps; this is where people will open their wallets and be ok with the costs.

[iwantspeed]

Interested
Keep us posted

S2000 ap1 engine blocks are no longer made FYI.

[SkiFree]

I'm with WanganStyle on this one.

[Wanganstyle]

I'm with WanganStyle on this one.

Interested
Keep us posted

S2000 ap1 engine blocks are no longer made FYI.

this is a moot point; most people are not buying crate motors for any car.

used item vs used item F22 and F20's cost LESS than K20R engines; this is simple for anyone to understand - the K20R never made it to north america

The f20 and f22 can be honed with honda factory tools to accept honda factory oversize pistons. Money does solve these problems

a K24 for $800 from a CRV is not anything close to a K20R
Nor is a TSX K24 = K20r or anything close to a F20/F22c


Those who track see S2000's everywhere in any group.
Those who track instruct know all the usual suspects;
when you go to the racetrack enough you know everyone there.


NO k24 swapped s2000's from all major shops in norcal that mess with the S2000 competitively

Sorry there are not s2000's left and right with K24 swaps. This is a bullshit statement

Most moderators of r3vlimited don't go to the track enough to even comment; even as a spectator.

I don't even understand Why the K-miata folk object to this FACT.

I am one of the only people responding on this thread who would actually pull the trigger on a K-miata setup; also influence local friends to follow. I do know many friends in the Miata world; one friend just bought an entire clean title rolling chassis NB2 with Ecotec powerplant + swap parts for less money than the K-miata kit would cost without a K engine. Just think about that.... everyone swapping an engine is trying to build a faster car for less money because of financial limitations of buying the faster car w/ factory engine already installed.

I personally considered installing a K23 turbo (RDX) into my BMW many times with the K-miata ZF box adapter; not sure this is possible but the pattern should be relatively close.

Decided that I would be smarter to wait for the new K20 CTR (and accord K20A4)



If other shops are doing adapters for things not done by K miata the obvious fact would be that the customer base is not nearly as gung ho about the reality of the k swap vs other powerplants.

Fastest time attack Miata in socal is running a GM v6. even cheaper and more power avail; fastest in norcal is running a boosted built miata engine

[2mAn]

Whats your purpose here? Let them develop it.

[Wanganstyle]

Whats your purpose here? Let them develop it.

did you read above; I want one for k20+ bmw trans + bmw chassis myself
but not NA K20; turbo oem k20 A4 or CTR - they are NOT the same and the block has been revised

or K23 RDX turbo; its not compatible with K20/k24 NA engines from the dc5 era or tsx.

Different bellhousing, different block.

the k24/k20 is a waste of time compared to what comes in the e30, people can also do what you & jaker &I did with using an aluminum dohc I6 vs iron.

jaker wants a turbo, I want a turbo. How are we any different at all?

Same boat just saying the stock k24 is not worth the trouble unless adding snail;

I'm also saying there is new CTR/accord or RDX turbo honda oem engine that is just as cheap/cheaper and better please build kit for it

[agile30]

I think if he is working on a bolt in kit that will require minimal modifications then let them do it. The K power plant has its own place in the world and so do F swaps. Once the initial K install kit is designed then it just becomes easier to start developing other engine kits that are for similar designed engines, like the k20ctr. But to shoot down the idea completely because he stated that people k swap s2000s left and right is dumb as well. Maybe it isnt 100% fact that they arent. But F engines arent as plentiful as K motors are anymore. I am glad that someone is developing a new kit for e30's and trying to do it properly. The miata kit is new subframe and a bunch of custom parts. But all fabricated and bolt in to lessen the modification that the end user has to do. Which I am sure that custom subframe adds to the cost of the miata kit a lot. If one doesnt need to be done in the E30 then I am sure that it will make it cheaper than the miata kit. I am hoping that the kit is priced well and not absurdly, because I am actually planning on buying a kit when the time comes.

Kmiata needs to apologize for offending your view though on s2000s and experience.

[2mAn]

did you read above; I want one for k20+ bmw trans + bmw chassis myself

that message gets lost in all the F20 v. K24 talk.

I still like my old aluM52 setup and fight thoughts to do it again with my current E30. Ive been wanting to build a 2.8L M20 but the costs of the M52 is hard to beat...

anyways, I hope this can stay on track and I think both you and KMiata have your positions in the FvK debate. Just leave it and lets move on

[Wanganstyle]

that message gets lost in all the F20 v. K24 talk.

I still like my old aluM52 setup and fight thoughts to do it again with my current E30. Ive been wanting to build a 2.8L M20 but the costs of the M52 is hard to beat...

anyways, I hope this can stay on track and I think both you and KMiata have your positions in the FvK debate. Just leave it and lets move on

yes move on to K20 TURBO! OEM turbo!!!
or K23 RDX. the engine is $800 on ebay and stock turbine mapped boost up will output 350fwhp and perhaps even more torque

[agile30]

I think once this kit is designed though then it opens doors for future engine kits and adapters. I agree with what you said about the e30 market being cheap. But if it is a reliable, lightweight, and sitting back. Along with the availability of honda parts that can be found left and right and in stock at stores without a wait time is nice. But they need to start somewhere with a swap into the e30/36. And if it is a k24 then so be it.

[KMiata]

yes move on to K20 TURBO! OEM turbo!!!
or K23 RDX. the engine is $800 on ebay and stock turbine mapped boost up will output 350fwhp and perhaps even more torque

We actually have a k23a1 here in the shop. I picked it up a couple years ago and it's really different than the k20s and k24s. The oil pump is the main hurdle with that engine because a Type S oil pump can't be swapped onto the block unless we do some major machining.

The new k20c is really awesome, although it's a K series engine in name only, it shares no similarities to the older engines. I've looked one over and measured it. There are some really big challenges for RWD swaps with the oil filter and pan position, as well as a lot of stuff on the back of the cylinder head that would require firewall surgery in most RWD cars. We're keeping our eye on those engines though, and particularly as the cheap k20c engines from the Accords start popping up in junkyards.

Wanganstyle - I said people are K swapping S2000s "left and right" because I personally have 3 friends with K S2000s that track them and love them, and have seen many others (we have a local-ish shop in WI that has completed a few of these builds). One friend is actually in the bay area and ran a yellow K24 S2000 in TTC that was quite competitive. But to your point, YES the vast majority of S2000s are running with the factory F20/22 and doing just fine, just as the vast majority of any chassis is run with the native engine. I wasn't implying that some huge percentage of S owners were going this route, I've just seen more and more of it lately and I think there's some value to it (check out the "K swapped S2000's" group on facebook for some nice examples). Just felt it was worth clarifying what I meant so we can move on to a more productive conversation.

[Wanganstyle]

We actually have a k23a1 here in the shop. I picked it up a couple years ago and it's really different than the k20s and k24s. The oil pump is the main hurdle with that engine because a Type S oil pump can't be swapped onto the block unless we do some major machining.

The new k20c is really awesome, although it's a K series engine in name only, it shares no similarities to the older engines. I've looked one over and measured it. There are some really big challenges for RWD swaps with the oil filter and pan position, as well as a lot of stuff on the back of the cylinder head that would require firewall surgery in most RWD cars. We're keeping our eye on those engines though, and particularly as the cheap k20c engines from the Accords start popping up in junkyards.

Wanganstyle - I said people are K swapping S2000s "left and right" because I personally have 3 friends with K S2000s that track them and love them, and have seen many others (we have a local-ish shop in WI that has completed a few of these builds). One friend is actually in the bay area and ran a yellow K24 S2000 in TTC that was quite competitive. But to your point, YES the vast majority of S2000s are running with the factory F20/22 and doing just fine, just as the vast majority of any chassis is run with the native engine. I wasn't implying that some huge percentage of S owners were going this route, I've just seen more and more of it lately and I think there's some value to it (check out the "K swapped S2000's" group on facebook for some nice examples). Just felt it was worth clarifying what I meant so we can move on to a more productive conversation.

I agree its a good swap into an s2000 if your resources have more K engines than F avail; I.E. snow states where there are no s2000's crashed because they are all garage queens. OR if your friends company does alot of K swaps and you can just access everything; not the case here or for most s2000 owners

In CA or TX or FL or NJ however the importation of overseas F20's is still there.; Also there are always S2000's being crashed on the track every weekend - S2k, E46M, e36m (sometimes moneyshifted) will always be good donors for e30 engine swaps.

K series into s2000 just not done that often because to one up the F20/22 or F24 or F26 the K series motor needs to be built to the sky. I'd like one myself but perhaps installed in a DC2 :). Locals are building the F20/f22 to output 235-245rwhp on pump garbage 91 octane.
Dynapack dynos; local and more than one of friends shops.

the K23 is the inexpensive and ideal option if possible; it would make any e30 have 4g63 style response for turbo light up with the reliability of abuse my friends wife puts it through

the 2018 accord motor will be the go to, both 1500 and 2000cc.

I think a 1500cc would be an epic sleeper in an e30 and handle extremely good for daily/mountain road use.

[ahrensNW]

I would love a k24. I just struggle so hard with the idea of pulling the m42 out of my 318is and gaining an extra 100 lbs plus over the front end. I drive my 318is for the way it handles, and after 5 m20 cars it just feels right.

[agile30]

I would love a k24. I just struggle so hard with the idea of pulling the m42 out of my 318is and gaining an extra 100 lbs plus over the front end. I drive my 318is for the way it handles, and after 5 m20 cars it just feels right.

The k24 is lighter than the m42. I believe m42s fully dressed are about 350lbs or so. K24 is about 290lbs. So it will be about 60lbs less over the front of a 318is.

[jwal]

I would love a k24. I just struggle so hard with the idea of pulling the m42 out of my 318is and gaining an extra 100 lbs plus over the front end. I drive my 318is for the way it handles, and after 5 m20 cars it just feels right.

I'm with you on the feeling aspect. I'm working on an M4x for my 318is, but I can't think of how an all aluminum Honda motor could be heavier than an iron block M42.