The Alfa Thread

[LateFan]

Alfa Indy / CART series V8. The chassis wasn't competitive and there wasn't enough engine development time. The funding was unplugged before it had a chance to win.

I went to watch these run at PIR in Portland. There were two distinct groups in the garage - the Miller Lite team guys in black & gold, and the Italian Alfa Romeo guys in light blue fussing over the engine.

[LateFan]

Tipo 33 Stradale
2-liter V8



Starting, running, driving vid...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=0JXJr-jtit8

[LateFan]

3-liter V12 F1 182

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbG1lV9_5to

[LateFan]

New GTV wut....?



.@Alfa_Romeo brings back one the most iconic names in history, the #GTV: a #Quadrifoglio with more than 600hp, AWD with torque vectoring and stunning Italian design.

"FCA 5-year Plan"

https://twitter.com/fcagroup/status/1002483034065702912/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fjalopnik.com%2Fajax%2Finset%2Fiframe%3Fid%3Dtwitter-1002483034065702912%26autosize%3D1

[Nader393]

The Spokane Festival of Speed vintage races included a police-escorted race car parade from the track to downtown Spokane. We parked on a closed street in front of a nice hotel.




And sunbathing in the paddock. Everpresent Porsches in the background:

[2mAn]

I see your Spider is classed for DP, does that mean you have the 2000cc motor in it or one of the smaller variants? Here you can use any of them UP to 2000cc, I know Will firmly believes the 1750cc motor is the one to have

[Nader393]

I don't think the classification really matters. Our organization pays more attention to lap times. I have a 1750, but I'm forced to run with the mid-bore group where I'm mid-pack. If I ran with the small bore cars, I'd be cleaning up.

When you're talking race engines, whatever "sweetness" the 1750 has over a 2L goes out the window when you're installing Carillo rods, high-comp pistons, big cams, big valves, big carbs, etc...

Some guys are running 2L engines with titanium connecting rods, lightweight pistons, thin-stem valves, lightweight flywheel+clutch, etc., and they will out-rev my 1750 with its heavier gear.

[LateFan]

When you're talking race engines, whatever "sweetness" the 1750 has over a 2L goes out the window

This is what I've always read. It's a simple displacement / torque / build quality equation.


So here's 2.6 liters of blown straight 8 goodness, at Goodwood!
The 8C 2600 Monza.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=_WcQAZWQLn4

<EDIT> ..wrong video attached! Sorry!

[BlackbirdM3]

I don't think the classification really matters. Our organization pays more attention to lap times. I have a 1750, but I'm forced to run with the mid-bore group where I'm mid-pack. If I ran with the small bore cars, I'd be cleaning up.

When you're talking race engines, whatever "sweetness" the 1750 has over a 2L goes out the window when you're installing Carillo rods, high-comp pistons, big cams, big valves, big carbs, etc...

Some guys are running 2L engines with titanium connecting rods, lightweight pistons, thin-stem valves, lightweight flywheel+clutch, etc., and they will out-rev my 1750 with its heavier gear.

That may be true, right up till the head gasket blows. I wouldn't touch a 2l engine with a 40 foot pole. In stock form the 1750 makes more power than the 2l (at least in the US) All of those same things can be had for the 1750, but it will cost a fair amount. As far as thin stem valves, those are easy. Sure they might need to be custom made (The ones in my datsun are cut down Chevy valves and are about half the weight of the stock valves, and the stems are roughly 3/4 the size of stock. If I could do this on my Datsun head, there is no reason it couldn't be done on an Alfa head.) Custom rods can be made, as well as the pistons. All it takes is $$$$. Neither the 1750 or 2L heads flow that well, so my guess is its a toss up there. I think the key to piston design is to have the least amount of dome possible while keeping as high compression as possible. (Less dome means greater power from the explosion pushing down on the piston rather than inward around the dome, with some of that energy going toward pushing the piston down. ) You could also try a 1600 GTA twin spark head, I believe it will bolt onto an 1750 block (Haha, there are cheaper ways to get the same hp) That said, how many of those non 2l cars are running later Motronic twin spark 2Ls? Everything about those engines is better than a Nord. Piston design, head design to start with.

I'm really curious how my 1750 goes in my Sprint. Apparently it makes 160 hp at the crank, so its got some get up and go. I need to figure out which flywheel I want to run. I'm leaning toward an aluminum 1300 flywheel, but I'm not sure a small diameter clutch will work well with the engine. I've got a good 1750 clutch, but I think the smaller 1300 flywheel will rev faster. I've been driving a 10lb flywheel on the Datsun since I first learned how to drive, so I'm not at all concerned with driveability due to a light flywheel.

Will

[2mAn]

Motion to prevent Will from posting in this thread until we have an update on his Sprint!

I get so excited when you are posting here because I think its a Sprint update

[BlackbirdM3]

Motion to prevent Will from posting in this thread until we have an update on his Sprint!

I get so excited when you are posting here because I think its a Sprint update

Motion denied. I'd be thrilled to post an update, but I've been busy with other stuff. I'd really like to get back to working on it. Life however gets in the way. Now, if you want to cover a pay period from work, yeah I'll go spend 8 hrs a day for 2 weeks working on it. Then I'll have something to post. :)

Will

[flyboyx]

Motion to prevent Will from posting in this thread until we have an update on his Sprint!

I get so excited when you are posting here because I think its a Sprint update

[Nader393]

That may be true, right up till the head gasket blows. I wouldn't touch a 2l engine with a 40 foot pole...

One of our local Alfa racers, the fast one who dices for the lead against the cheater 2002s, has what appears to be a money-no-object racing campaign. He had a fully developed 1750 (ti rods, etc) built by Terry Tinney. When our rules were loosened a few years ago to allow later cars, it also allowed larger displacement. So this racer had a 2L built to the same degree, and of course made more power and went faster than when he had a 1750. It propelled him to the front of the pack. No denying it.

My dream engine would be my current 1750, machined to accept a monoblock to make 2L, and use a twin-spark head. Basically a GT-Am 2L engine but with Webers. Realistically, I'll end up building a 2L down the road. For now, I have a spare head waiting in the wings, that my head guy insists is better than my current one. If it doesn't make significantly more power and better lap times, I'll start tracking down parts for a 2L sooner than later. It's an arms race.

As for 8 mm stem valves, my machinist makes them for me out of stainless blanks.

[LateFan]

Fast 2-liters

Like, 230 mph fast.

"Bonnie" the worlds fastest Alfa.





"The 2-liter engine, using a factory Alfa block and crankshaft, modified and built by Jim Steck, features a twin-spark cylinder head and turbocharger. The original Alfa engine was rated at 147 horsepower, and Steck estimates his modified version produces about 650 hp. To handle the added power, a transmission from a NASCAR racecar is used, and the rear end is from a Mustang. The rest is strictly Alfa Romeo."

[Nader393]

The man in red in the middle, who actually drove the car, is Mike Besic. He has a very well respected Alfa shop in the Chicago suburbs, and is a KFG (known fast guy) in a roundtail spider. I think he's still running a 1750. That car is a bullet; trick parts and mods everywhere you look. Great guy, and I count him as a friend.

About 5 years ago I burned up a very lightweight CP piston, and the man who originally built my engine wouldn't give me the order number for his pistons. Through him, I learned that CP wanted exorbitant money to replace just one. So I called Besic, and he happily gave me his order number for his particular pistons from Ross. Total cost for 4 gleaming new custom race pistons was just slightly more than what CP wanted for just one. These were beefier, and took some trickery on my part to fit my engine, but the results have been stellar. I've raced this same engine, hard, for 5 years without ever cracking it apart.