Careers Thread

[nando]

...

We have access to the newest versions of Cadworx Structure so I tested 2018 and 2019 (basically the same thing as 2014). They send us updates on new features but they're pretty pitiful (now they can add base plates to columns, woopdeee!) It is pretty obvious that their target market are companies that do basic layout "stick models" and send out all detailing elsewhere. We need something closer to a detailing package than a layout package (thus Tekla); when pressed the dev / marketing guys they made it really clear they would not be adding the things we needed for it to be viable.

I have also tested the AutoDesk equivalent, which isn't horrible but it was pretty clunky - and AutoDesk license costs are insane. I also used to teach a class using their previous Structural Steel Detailer which was promising but also pretty horrible (and buggy), so they killed it off. Basically it being an Autodesk project and given their poor history of supporting and then just disappearing structural packages, we felt it was the wrong choice. Not being under their thumb is honestly a big advantage IMO.

We have a bunch of Faro scanners, they work pretty well for us. We have scanned every single project pretty much for the last 8-9 years now. I can't say we've had any issues (except once when a scanner fell of a platform and had to be shipped to europe for repair). Laserscans are indispensable to how we work.

[The Dark Side of Will]

80-90% of work is related to e30's, rest is filled up by 20+yr old BMW's.

60 Degree V6 market drying up?

[LEANE30]

I have never used tekla but I've read up a little on it. Seems like a mainstay. But yes, cadworx structure (and equipment) they are scrambling to technologically catch up to cadworx plant's functionality. What release/version of cadworx structure (or was it just the old “steel” supplemental module to plant) did you test/evaluate? Part of my job I have to stay on top of it as well.

Intergraph/hexagon is a juggernaut in the space, they even dwarf Autodesk, but the left hand doesnt know the right hand in typical big company fashion. they don't move as fast as they should, or they move too quickly too often in a development direction that does nothing for the masses and average user. Slowly and surely as cadworx cannibalizes hexagon's own market share from smart3d, they cannot help themselves but to slowly over-complicate cadworx plant until it basically turns into smartplant.

Meanwhile Autodesk is begging for AutoCAD to die, but it never will. So they sit there giving away Plant3d for free with AutoCAD now, but it's about as complex as cadworx was in 2011, just with an automated route function. Cadworx components work in AutoCAD better than Plant3d components. All bets are off looking forward now that hexagon bought up Bricscad, unless Autodesk can start to port models to their FEA engines.

My company sent me to Hexagon's conference to look at the Lieca scanners along with the Plant software, supposed to be wanting me to go to the Autodesk University 2019 conference in November as well, we will see. Faro seems to be sharing the bed with Autodesk, their hardware is much more reasonably priced, but you do get what you pay for, sometimes. Get your company to send you to Vegas in November for AU, I should be there.

Software release versions and updates can make or break not just projects but entire firms. Companies have gone under trying to deploy both smartplant, PDS, and plant3d. Cadworx plant for the most part (except 2013-2014) hasn’t entirely bankrupted anyone that I know of in the denver market. But the software with best stability of current releases changes nearly quarterly.

The last time the autodesk reps made their rounds and sat down with me, the senior product owner joked to me “you know what ACAD stands for? Always Control Alt Delete” all I could think was, this is your own damn product, man!

...if it wasn’t for Hexagon’s competition and use, I’m pretty sure they would have killed off the DWG platform a long time ago and started running everything on Revit’s engine.

[nando]

No, Revit doesn't really work for this industry (a lot of our work is retrofits and totally custom stuff). I can't imagine trying to use an architect program to design a drill site or a wharf for example.. that sounds horrible!

We're using Tekla, which is quite excellent and actually less expensive than many alternatives (including our old Bentley software that we paid hundreds of thousands worth of maintenance for and never got an update in like 8 years). The irony is Tekla interoperates better with AutoCAD than Revit does, lol. I think Autodesk secretly wishes AutoCAD would go away.

I tested every single structural modeling program that exists, except SDS/2 (which is $$$$). Cadworx steel is simply the worst one by far. It's like MS Paint vs Photoshop. They also made it clear they were never going to be adding the things we require to stay competitive. Unlike east coast engineering firms, we design and detail all of our own connections because everything has to meet seismic codes. The only thing it has going for it is the dirt cheap cost, but you get what you pay for in this case.

[LEANE30]

Are you guys using Revit for steel? Or one of the more boutique options? Keep in mind cadworx structure only just came out as a stand alone program two years ago. It took them a solid 4 years for them to fix plant after the 2013 rewrite.

We have a number of immensely talented engineers and other employees on staff. Some sit on boards, some phds. I particularly enjoy working with some of the old timers, a couple have been in the industry for more than 60 years. They just keep going because they enjoy what they do. It's amazing the wisdom they bring to the table. You are absolutely on point that someone has to stamp stuff at the end of the day.

You guys are taking yourselves so serious.... This is r3v after all. Acting like a bunch of engineers here, all broody. LOL

[nando]

We actually have an office in Denver. They are more or less run separately from us. But nah, if I ever change jobs it would be to a different industry - I have it pretty good here. I got to choose (and implement) new structural modeling software to replace Bentley's crap with. I'd probably have to use Cadworx Structural if I went anywhere else, which unlike the piping module, is pretty much useless. It works for cartoon steel but that's about it.

I've been fortunate to work on many projects (or parts of projects) where the primary input was actually civil or structural rather than piping. But we don't tend to have so much friction there, our piping and structural departments work well together, and we have very competent and experienced engineers. The electrical/controls guys though... yeesh. :p

I hear you on the endless meetings. Luckily I have avoided that for much of the past year.

The engineer argument is kind of funny. The thing is, somebody has to be licensed in the jurisdiction that the project is being built in, in order to get the plans stamped and approved. I can do quite a bit on my own without the engineer's input; I mean if you design the same things over and over again you know what elements are required and how they go together. But I'm not responsible for that (and I don't want to be).

But often we're faced with totally out of the box stuff, and even if I come up with a good idea, the engineer still has to verify that it will work. I'm not comfortable myself having something built that nobody has checked - probably I made it stronger than it needed to be, but the risks are too high especially in our industry.

[LEANE30]

Haha. Engineers cannot help but take that ^ bait. And you callin me cocky? Who else here is an engineer? Surely we can flush a few more out of the woodwork with just a couple more posts. All joking aside, giving engineers a hard time is one of the favorite pastimes of designers. ;)

Honestly tho we both have some valid points. I'm one of the type that looks at automating his own job daily. Much of my above comments were very tongue in cheek.

Another favorite is "what do you call a productive engineer? An inventor." ... Both of my brother in laws' are engineers, I've got a stock pile.

Seriously tho, designers and engineers are fundamentally two halves of a whole. Architecture and product design are inverse fields where you see that cross over of over-educated people doing the everyday work of the other half via automation, simply because some of those tasks can be done consistently or have comprehensive codes or standards that must be utilized. Only the subjective parts of thought work will remain the domain of humans over the next decade or two.

[MR E30 325is]

This is painfully true ^. So many engineers were just kids with good grades from successful families, had minimal childhood work experiences, when straight from high school to college then went directly to engineering things. It is amazing how few engineers know how to use their hands, yet they are liable if something fails. I fondly refer to my engineers as my "meat-calculators." -no offense to any engineers here, but your jobs will be easier to automate with AI than my job is. Piping designers (with usually just an associate degree) typically make more than engineers until the later senior years when they have their PE and have climbed the ladder a few rungs.

Honestly I really do enjoy my job, especially when I get to actually stay put and am left alone to do cad. Its very much like getting paid to play with legos and draw all day. Sadly tho this week it’s been a solid 75% having to sit in meetings and talking to other people. Next week should be better, it's not a career for extroverts...

HAHAHAHAHA This is the funniest thing I have read on R3v in a long, long time.

I will agree with you that it is truly laughable how many of my college engineering classmates had never swung a hammer, or framed a jack rafter into a door header, or even disassembled an old VCR. I'll also admit that I have very limited exposure to the oil and gas industry. Maybe my weaker classmates end up in positions in that field and truly make a mess of things that you have to fix. I don't know.

I had an old employee, who is still a great friend, who was a cocky sunofagun (like yourself) when it came to truss design. He had worked through programs that helped determine the efficacy of an engineers design. In a lot of situations he was right about member sizes, truss layouts, etc. That was, until off the wall non-standard situations arose, and then it was all too clear that he was out of his element. His experience had reached its limit, and he was unable to properly correct the situation.

Remember, you are paid in direct relation to the difficulty of the problems you solve. Jobs that mostly revolve around drawing, and not sophisticated problem solving, have their cap. I've created LISP routines in CAD, over the course of single afternoon, that can create complex foundation details, rebar and foundation key included. Or entire roof and floor framing plans based on ~45 or so inputs that will literally draw me an entire house in a matter of minutes. Yet I have never found a way, or even come close to finding a way, to automate acute problem solving.

Do you have a professional license, and the responsibility that is associated with that, that is recognized by the authority having jurisdiction? No? Then you do not 'tell people what to do'. Perhaps this is a crucial lesson for you to keep in mind.

[LEANE30]

This is painfully true ^. So many engineers were just kids with good grades from successful families, had minimal childhood work experiences, when straight from high school to college then went directly to engineering things. It is amazing how few engineers know how to use their hands, yet they are liable if something fails. I fondly refer to my engineers as my "meat-calculators." -no offense to any engineers here, but your jobs will be easier to automate with AI than my job is. Piping designers (with usually just an associate degree) typically make more than engineers until the later senior years when they have their PE and have climbed the ladder a few rungs.

Honestly I really do enjoy my job, especially when I get to actually stay put and am left alone to do cad. Its very much like getting paid to play with legos and draw all day. Sadly tho this week it’s been a solid 75% having to sit in meetings and talking to other people. Next week should be better, it's not a career for extroverts...

[mrsleeve]

^
As someone that actually builds the shit you put on paper, Common sense is far more rare that you seem to allude to.....

[LEANE30]

I'm sorta in the same line of work as Nando and Melon, energy (mostly oil & gas) cad designer. As far as designer jobs, as an industry it's pretty well paid. Moving laterally to any other industry (or even discipline) would equal substantially lower salary ranges. I sort of just fell into O&G Piping Design about 8 years ago after doing a series of other design-related work in different industries, but will likely make a healthy long term career out of it unless I get pulled toward more and more management responsibilities.

Specifically I do Oil and Gas Piping Design, with a preference for CADWorx on Autocad, (other piping design programs are inferior.) Writing LISP programs and utilities to automate stuff comes up regularly. Ancillary work as well with piping and material specifications, engineering and municipal codes, and various critical systems database work. I enjoy giving Mechanical Engineers research to do, telling Structural Engineers what needs to be done, and showing Process Engineers what common sense looks like. If it wasn't for the piping there'd be no reason for structural designers to design anything. Looking at you Nando.

Currently I am designing a compressor station. The company I work for is small on the scale for being an EPC(M) but we are known for being nimble, designing cryogenic gas processing plants as well as working with the mining industry, which really helps average out the boom and bust business cycles of O&G. Overall it's one of the most reputable, award winning firms in the greater Denver area, based in DTC and has been a great place to work, company culture is top notch, benefits are great, work is challenging and always changing, risk level is low, occasionally get out of the office, we do projects across the country and occasionally abroad. Get to dabble with ever evolving software and the technologies are always adapting. Having been able to do 3d laser scanning at facility scales, design multimillion dollar (project engineering budget) plants from the napkin sketch stage till standing in the middle of a final completed as-built plant is a humbling experience, sort of like summiting a 14er.

Right now we actually have an opening for a senior level civil/structural designer... If either Nando or Melon would be interested in moving to Colorado...? Haha, PM me.

[mrsleeve]

this dude.... i subscribe to his channel because there are some interesting vids on machine shop/ welding topics. for some reason, he decided to to make a self-help video. lol. in my opinion, this thing is awesome.

i think everyone could benefit from taking a few minutes to watch it.

https://youtu.be/E7RgtMGL7CA

edit:

aaaaaannnnd.....i see the youtube imbed function still doesn't work even with the new and improved r3v... :(

I dont have many subscriptions on youtube (3 actually) , but AVE has been there for a long long time...... and its one of the few things on social media I look forward too

[roguetoaster]

aaaaaannnnd.....i see the youtube imbed function still doesn't work even with the new and improved r3v... :(

Yeah, thought that was a big thing that was being fixed with the update, but noooooo.

[flyboyx]

this dude.... i subscribe to his channel because there are some interesting vids on machine shop/ welding topics. for some reason, he decided to to make a self-help video. lol. in my opinion, this thing is awesome.

i think everyone could benefit from taking a few minutes to watch it.

https://youtu.be/E7RgtMGL7CA

edit:

aaaaaannnnd.....i see the youtube imbed function still doesn't work even with the new and improved r3v... :(

[b5dover]

I feel like I should explain my story to help those on here who might need it.
I grew up at the drag strip watching my father race a 9 second late second gen Camaro. I’ve always known that one way or another I was going to be involved in the automotive industry in one way or another. He always told me, it’s fine if you want to work on cars your entire career but just know that your body is going to show it by the time you’re 40 and my mother always told me she didn’t care what I did as long as I got a degree for it. Growing up through the 90’s and being one of the children of the internet generation I’ve always been fascinated by technology.
I delivered pizza in high school in a small country town, honing my driving skills on the back roads of southwest Michigan in a lowly J body cavalier.
After graduating high school, I started college for computer science but after one semester I realized that as much as I loved computers, programming just wasn’t for me. Those who do it live and breathe code, which is fine but I just couldn’t do it. I then got my associates degree in automotive technology from Kalamazoo Valley Community College (they have a wonderful program by the way and some of the best instructors I’ve ever had). While at KVCC I found the E30 that I still have to this day, an 88 325is. I’m in the middle of restoring it with a 5 lug E36 M3/318ti coil-over suspension, M54B30 with M50 intake and Megasquirt MS3X on E85 (prepping for a turbo, you’ll see why later…). I’ll make a thread for it once it’s worth showing off.
Following that I completed the bachelors program in Automotive Engineering Technology from Ferris State University (yes it really is a B.S.) There are only a handful of universities that offer the ABET accredited degree. Think of it as a B.S.M.E but with more automotive specific classes instead of as much math. They actually have courses in engine airflow, dyno operation, and engine mechanical design.
I interned at FEV in Auburn Hills learning the ins and outs of OBD certification and calibration. We basically took the diesel Euro 6 FIAT Ducato and made it comply with US OBD regulations to be sold as the RAM ProMaster.
This all brings me to where I am today. I just passed my 5 year anniversary at ROUSH Performance in Livonia. I am privileged enough to oversee all engine calibrations for 15-20 Mustang, including 2.3L and 5.0L performance pacs and supercharged applications. Basically, we sell tuned versions of the stock engines as well as supercharging the V8. Not only do we have to make 700+ horsepower but they all have to pass emissions as well as durability requirements. It’s interesting to be in the middle of a blend of OE calibration as well as competing with all the other companies in the aftermarket in that space. I’ve even gone to California to tune the race engine for our D1 formula drift Mustang to 1000hp with the same supercharger hardware we sell every day. I never know what I’m going to get day to day, some days I spend all my time sitting at my computer releasing new calibrations to our flashing software or in meetings talking federal regulations, other times they ask me to go to the drag strip or road course to test things or fix problems (it helps when you have a competition drag racing license). Sometimes it’s spending 14 hours straight on the dyno making dozens of power pulls to make sure everything works the way it should.
If anyone needs tuning advice or someone to look at their car for them in southeast Michigan let me know, I’ll do what I can to help.