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    Originally posted by CarpHunter View Post

    Plead guilty, agreed to work with investigation for a reduced sentence. You can read the actual plea agreement yourself. Try doing so. And legally a guilty plea is an admission of guilt, that's literally the definition.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spec...%E2%80%932019)
    If you are innocent, but don't have the financial ability to put up a fight, you will take a plea bargain. It is not an admission of guilt in any sense except in the purely technical definition. Let's put it this way...if you are tried for some specific crime called crime A, but you committed other petty crimes B, C & D and the prosecutor does not want to go to trial for crime A but can get you to accept punishment on lesser charges, you never plead guilty to crime A, only B, C & D. Same situation if you are going to be poor as shit. They have enough to take you to trial, but you strike a bargain to avoid all that.

    "A plea bargain is a negotiated agreement between a criminal defendant and a prosecutor in which the defendant agrees to plead "guilty" or "no contest" to some crimes, along with possible conditions, such as attending anger management classes, in return for reduction of the severity of the charges, dismissal of some of the charges, or some other benefit to the defendant. A defendant must uphold his or her end of the deal, such as pleading guilty on a particular date, cooperating in the investigation of another offense, or testifying against a co-defendant.or the plea bargain may be revoked."

    https://definitions.uslegal.com/p/plea-bargain/

    It is quite a bit more nuanced than you are trying to make it.

    What? You have so many conflicting ideas it's hard to follow. All seems pretty victimy to me, bo ho we're in control of everything but this secret conspiracy is stopping us. If the statement from the article you link is proof of a deep state against trump, then wouldn't McConnell's statement to the press about "making obama a one term president" be proof of a deep state against obama?

    On one hand republicans are being blocked by a conspiracy, then on the other their getting everything they want done. So their not being blocked then?

    Life long establishment politicians are the problem, yet you vote them in year after year?

    As far as the unconstitutional laws, there's actually a government website that tracks that ironically. So if your truly interested you can dig into yourself. But here's a few to get you started. How bout the multiple north Carolina districting maps, multiple state voting laws, multiple state laws violating the civil rights act, the multiple teams bathroom laws, the multiple anti LGBTQ laws. All cases of actual republicans passing actual laws that strip actual americans of their actual rights.

    I think we can figure this all out with one simple question. And please truly give this some thought and answer honestly. We have to set a baseline.

    Do you vote based on politician or party?

    And I mean purely party vs party, no inter party stuff. Me personally, I vote based on politician, I've voted for members of both parties. In local, state, and national elections. I just want the best person, don't give a damn about party affiliation.
    I don't think I have any conflicting ideas. The problem is that you think that I think is wrong so you couldn't see it from my side if you wanted to. Apparently you don't get the fact that there isn't a conspiracy at all, its reality that the Dems are locked in tight with the media and lifelong bureaucrats. Over 90% of the media voted for Hillary in 2016. Either way, you will dismiss all of this as nonsense because for your worldview to hold, you have to believe in the dogma of the left. Its cool.

    Mitch McConnell is not part of the Deep State, he is part of the Establishment. You don't seem to understand what the Deep State is. If you did, you would know that Mitch McConnell, an elected Senator. The Deep State are staffers who float from rep to rep for decades at a time. They are unelected and are actually pulling many of the levers of government.

    In what universe are the republicans getting everything they want done? The first term they had both houses and could have done great things, but Paul Ryan did everything he could to filter the Trump agenda. Now, you may see it as anything that the republicans pass is exactly what you are against, but most conservatives see two distinct factions within the Republican Party. Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell blocked much of what Trump wanted to do and when they had their chance to fix Obamacare, those two made sure it didn't happen. God knows why. I was pissed, most of my family and friends were pissed and I know Trump was pissed too. That's why he talks shit on Paul Ryan so much and why Paul Ryan talks shit on Trump. The past two years have had a split house. The only thing that gets done is Senate confirmation of constitutionalist judges and stupid pandemic bills that are just killing us more. Nancy Pelosi is driving the latest relief package down everyone's throats filled with all sorts of leftist garbage. With any luck, that shit won't get past the Senate.

    Thanks for the link to that website you are referring to. Again, your whole perspective is 180 from mine so we aren't going to get anywhere. You are just hurling ideas out as if they are fact. Asking for proof of your person-hood before going into a voting booth is not racist...yet, I am sure you would disagree. I do not think that men identifying as women should be allowed to go into a woman's restroom, you probably have no problem with that.

    To your very, very silly question, I vote the most conservative person who lines up with my values. Most of them claim to be Republicans. Since that is true, you get some stupid morally relevant victory here by claiming I am partisan. Oh well. If you haven't read anything I have written that shows very clearly that I disagree with many things that Republicans do, then I don't know what to tell you.
    Si vis pacem, para bellum.

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      Originally posted by marshallnoise View Post
      I don't understand why no one is talking about the complete setup that Flynn endured and what Trump had said about the case was verifiably accurate. The difference here is that Obama did weaponize the DOJ and no one seems to care.

      It was interesting...I listened to the radio last night and Dinesh D'Souza was on and pointed out the not so obvious...
      Hm. You're seriously talking like you don't realize that the FBI is doing what it has always done going back to J. Edgar Hoover: They set people up. They get people to self-incriminate. Many times going to great lengths to draw out and catch fairly inconsequential people. Even if that is somehow news to you, why have any sympathy for Flynn on this? At the time Flynn was a paid foreign agent of Turkey, which he kept secret and also lied about, and he had no official governmental authority or status with the United States yet he acted in tandem with Trump to thwart Official US Foreign Policy at that time. Then there's also the fact that Flynn did then lie to the FBI about talking to Russia. He then plead guilty for it and admitted he knew what he was doing was wrong when he was doing it.

      A funny aspect is that "evil" Obama warned Trump not to hire Flynn. Flynn's business partners were also indicted for being agents of a foreign government. Flynn actually got off with basically a slap on the wrist (Robert Mueller recommended Flynn serve no jail time) only because he ratted out his fellow business partner criminals in a separate Turkey Investigation. If Trump would have just taken Obama's advice and not hired Flynn in the first place, he would have likely never gotten a special counsel and all the shenanigans that came with it! Boy, but it must be Obama's fault. How about do your due diligence and hire somebody uncomprimised for your National Security Advisor.

      There's another interesting wrinkle here the general media and Trump and Republicans and Democrats don't really talk about, which is what was the content? What did Flynn talk to the Russians about for Trump (and then try to cover up)? I think it's because the real "collusion" is with Israel. Why that isn't treated as a major scandal I have no idea. I'm guessing because our establishment politicians on both sides of the aisle, especially President Trump, are basically bought by Israel -- not to mention the Saudis-- but, please correct me if you have a different informed opinion.

      So that's why people aren't really paying attention to that, aside from record job losses, 100k plus people dead in a health crisis and now rioting everywhere. Large parts of the US are basically a tinder box waiting to explode and we have a President who is quick to turn people against each other and spout off conspiracy theories or sell snake oil instead of manning up.

      I tend to think your heart is probably in the right place on a lot of this stuff, and I can imagine it's easy to get angry listening to right wing radio and people like Dinesh D'Souza. D'Souza is a liar, a complete con-man, he is an illogical pseudoscientist. He's a convicted felon who should have done time, yet he barely got a slap on the wrist, and Trump pardoned him anyway! Reminds me so much of Flynn! with the fact that he broke actual laws, pled guilty to them, and also admitted that he knew what he was doing violated the law at the time he was doing it. Yet he later portrays himself as a victim and his conviction was only because of an evil Obama conspiracy! At least Flynn isn't an alleged wife beater and adulterer like D'Souza. But the fact that he is a racism denier and a slavery and colonialism apologist probably sours me more on him. Or maybe it's his asinine views on 9/11. Maybe his mocking of the Stoneman Douglas kids. You could go on and on, hard to pick just one! This guy is a hack & a despicable human being.


      Originally posted by marshallnoise
      IYou are a very confusing person to understand man. You sound reasonable and then you write a sentence like the last one that is really almost bi-polar.

      Unfortunately, you might get sick because I don't think the President has anything to apologize for in relation to the pandemic. No president would be looking good throughout this insane time we are going through.
      Ha! Well I am not looking for Trump to save me. President Bonespurs is only out to save himself, anyway. I do seriously have a problem with Trump apologists, though, ie. "No president would be looking good." Oh really? The country needs unity and clarity and consistency, always, but especially in times like this. It's just so simple to see this guy is incompetent and careless. Dangerous, insecure and hateful. Sure, there's a lot of Democrats that suck too, and I am all about that. But we can not equate the true lack of leadership of Donald Trump to any other in this dire time.
      Last edited by phillipj; 05-31-2020, 01:59 PM.
      1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

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        does this case ever get brought up in the "epstein did not kill himself" circles? seems like it shouldn't be overlooked.

        Comment


          that's coo.

          Comment


            Originally posted by mrsleeve View Post

            My state has 478 cases and 16 deaths in the state and I know for fact that the 2 in my county were people that were very ill with other things, as were a significant chunk of Italian deaths ( you know the people that were tracking the rona as a comorbidity factor / complication of more serious illness)
            Maryland has more than that EVERY DAY. A good friend of mine got sick with covid19. One day he felt a little sick, the next ok so he thought the nothing of it, the following he was in the ICU for 10 pretty scary days. Barely made it even though he was on a ventilator and whatever else the entire time. Another friend of mine is doing covid19 testing at a hospital. He's a phlebotomist, but now the majority of his job is covid19 testing. It is crazy anywhere populated, good for you that you live in the middle of nowhere. But 100k+ deaths is real, social distancing works, masks work, and it's still out of control now.

            Originally posted by mrsleeve View Post
            I would say the federal response has been about on par with what I would have expected no matter the leadership we have had in Washington
            Good to see you're still absolutely delirious. I leave P&R for years and miss nothing. Bush Sr, Clinton, Obama would have handled this effectively. Bush Jr, the absolute clown, would have mission accomplished his way to something halfway effective. There is no way you can honestly think that Trump is doing as good of a job as anyone else would have. Why is he literally the worst in the entire world at handling this? At least the USA is still number 1 in something. Instead of hitting this hard and quick the guy said light beams and bleach and "it'll go away on it's own, like a miracle."

            For the love of this country, remove your head from where it's blind and deaf and look at the world around you in full sunlight.
            Last edited by Kershaw; 06-01-2020, 06:18 AM.
            AWD > RWD

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              ^a co workers dad died from covid.
              but i still think everyone everywhere is going to eventually get it.

              there was a high school graduation party in my neighborhood nobody wearing a mask maybe 60ppl.
              plus the protesters looting everything being so close only wearing masks to hide their identity. it's a done deal.

              Comment


                Originally posted by Kershaw View Post

                Maryland has more than that EVERY DAY. A good friend of mine got sick with covid19. One day he felt a little sick, the next ok so he thought the nothing of it, the following he was in the ICU for 10 pretty scary days. Barely made it even though he was on a ventilator and whatever else the entire time. Another friend of mine is doing covid19 testing at a hospital. He's a phlebotomist, but now the majority of his job is covid19 testing. It is crazy anywhere populated, good for you that you live in the middle of nowhere. But 100k+ deaths is real, social distancing works, masks work, and it's still out of control now.



                Good to see you're still absolutely delirious. I leave P&R for years and miss nothing. Bush Sr, Clinton, Obama would have handled this effectively. Bush Jr, the absolute clown, would have mission accomplished his way to something halfway effective. There is no way you can honestly think that Trump is doing as good of a job as anyone else would have. Why is he literally the worst in the entire world at handling this? At least the USA is still number 1 in something. Instead of hitting this hard and quick the guy said light beams and bleach and "it'll go away on it's own, like a miracle."

                For the love of this country, remove your head from where it's blind and deaf and look at the world around you in full sunlight.
                10/10, I missed nothing avoiding this thread/forum like the plague. They either must be doing insane mental gymnastics to try to reconcile how irrefutably poor Trump's "leadership" has been during his entire presidency, or they consciously relish the schadenfreude of watching their fellow Americans suffer, 100,000+ people die (so far, it's going to get worse), 34 million jobs gone in 2 months, and the cities burned to the ground.

                I'm sorry I looked because I had hope something might change, but now it's obvious it doesn't matter what happens. Party over Country, no matter what the cost.

                The only thing that we can do is vote. Hopefully, some of the anger misspent burning things and looting can be redirected to something productive and kick his ass to the curb where it belongs.
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                  Originally posted by nando View Post

                  The only thing that we can do is vote. Hopefully, some of the anger misspent burning things and looting can be redirected to something productive and kick his ass to the curb where it belongs.
                  I would imagine those same minds are smoking their brain away, masturbating to themselves on youtube while mom yells at them to turn down the tv.


                  On a good note, my city is starting to open back up. We have never been more busy, but alas my coworkers are liberals, thinking it's too hard to work in these tough times, unable to put out the same number of jobs. Meanwhile the owners are also trying to take advantage of the situation. They were hoping we could cut out 4hrs a day on Fridays so that we could claim unemployment, meanwhile giving us time off and a bigger check to take home. Seriously sickening, and now to find out any cash payments get gutted in quickbooks after the invoice is printed, so that all cash in our drawers can be deposited in our owners pockets tax free. I generally support my bosses, but this is the end. I will be going independent once again like I was for 10years. I have no problem being smart about our laws, but actively trying to avoid taxes and have employees paid for unemployment when we are quite well off? No, seriously fuck that socialist mindset.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Kershaw View Post

                    Maryland has more than that EVERY DAY. A good friend of mine got sick with covid19. One day he felt a little sick, the next ok so he thought the nothing of it, the following he was in the ICU for 10 pretty scary days. Barely made it even though he was on a ventilator and whatever else the entire time. Another friend of mine is doing covid19 testing at a hospital. He's a phlebotomist, but now the majority of his job is covid19 testing. It is crazy anywhere populated, good for you that you live in the middle of nowhere. But 100k+ deaths is real, social distancing works, masks work, and it's still out of control now.
                    Well well well, here you go, proving my primary point for me yet again.... Different areas, and populations dont need to have the same kinds of responses or (restrictions if you like), due to a whole host of factors, population density and geographic location proxcimal to areas of greater rates of infection being BIG ones.

                    I am sorry your friend contracted the virus, and it hit him harder than most. Does he have other heath/personal issues that might have compounded the infection? I have never said that using common sense is not a effective means at keeping ones risk of contracting any type of infectious illness much lower. You know like washing your hands, and keeping your distance from people that might be ill, or limiting your trips out when a bug is going around.... All shit you should be doing when a lot of people in your area are contracting the common seasonal flu, or noro virus or any other easily passed infection anyway.


                    Originally posted by Kershaw
                    Good to see you're still absolutely delirious. I leave P&R for years and miss nothing. Bush Sr, Clinton, Obama would have handled this effectively. Bush Jr, the absolute clown, would have mission accomplished his way to something halfway effective. There is no way you can honestly think that Trump is doing as good of a job as anyone else would have. Why is he literally the worst in the entire world at handling this? At least the USA is still number 1 in something. Instead of hitting this hard and quick the guy said light beams and bleach and "it'll go away on it's own, like a miracle."

                    For the love of this country, remove your head from where it's blind and deaf and look at the world around you in full sunlight.
                    Where in ANY FUCKING POST on this topic have I inferred let alone outright said the Trumpsters response is classified as "good".... While I may have attempted to draw Phills attention to Gov Como's antics on TV everyday, or alluded the Gov's of MN and MI refusal to give up "emergency power", or make rules arbitrarily to shine a little light on the counterparts of where his remarks seemed to be directed. That was in no way a de-facto positive let me find my MAGA hat endorsement of mine, of the job the trumpster has/is doing in regards to the pandemic.

                    You seem triggered mayhaps you actually read my post for what it says, and keep your personal thoughts and assumptions of what you "THINK" I meant out of it
                    Originally posted by Fusion
                    If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
                    The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


                    The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

                    Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
                    William Pitt-

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                      Now Trump is saying he will invade the states with the federal military.

                      Yikes.
                      AWD > RWD

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                        They hate big government. Until they don't.

                        What happened to complaining that the government wouldn't let people get a haircut? Talk about oppression! ;)
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                        Bimmerlabs

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                          Originally posted by Kershaw View Post
                          Now Trump is saying he will invade the states with the federal military.

                          Yikes.

                          You know as well as I, that is not going to happen and that the potus cant do that

                          Originally posted by Fusion
                          If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
                          The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


                          The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

                          Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
                          William Pitt-

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                            Originally posted by mrsleeve View Post


                            You know as well as I, that is not going to happen and that the potus cant do that
                            In theory, a President cannot start a war either, but they sure can send troops to wherever to do whatever the they want them to do for 60 days, and issue more limited strikes against targets as deemed desirable with zero actual oversight or checks. Clearly, any deployment of military forces to do basically anything more than assist local police forces on an extremely limited basis, or to respond to a declared state of emergency on US soil are generally illegal, but in such a case of illegal deployment it's likely that a simple injunction would not stop or recall forces.

                            Ultimately, in such a case this decision to follow or reject an order to act beyond established precedent on US soil would fall on the shoulders of unit commanders at all levels. It should also be remembered that all officers are taught to distinguish between a lawful and unlawful command, although that education is not as comprehensive as it probably ought to be.

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                              I ran into a convoy of Humvees and MRAP looking things and armed troops on my way to stupid Lowes to pick up some plywood. Venice Blvd. two blocks from me is shut down in a section because the National Guard has now made my local police station it's "base." I have Police Helicopters wap-wapping over my head daily, and unfortunately that's normal for around here. Seriously, no one who lives here wants more, or any, military coming in, the police are already militarized enough.

                              Trump threatening in his national address to deploy the military in States, then saying he's an ally to peaceful protestors yet simultaneously having forces in riot gear gas 100% peaceful protestors outside the White House, then marching over for a photo shoot with a bible as a complete prop will go down as an all timer in American History. Highly disturbing. Authoritarian spectacle.
                              Last edited by phillipj; 06-04-2020, 03:07 PM.
                              1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

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                                Originally posted by mrsleeve View Post


                                You know as well as I, that is not going to happen and that the potus cant do that
                                I'm curious whom you think would stop him? Not saying he'll do it, but hypothetically, who's gonna stop him. It's certainly not republicans, or evangelicals, or conservatives. I don't think the left would have the power politically to do anything, it would all be blocked by republicans anyways.

                                Not being a dick, but let's be honest. Based on how republicans have reacted to everything else, I just don't see them doing anything to stop him should it come to it. The impeachment trial would probly be the clearest example of how'd they react.

                                How bout you personally? How would you react? Again, not being a dick, actually curious. Mainly since it would be going against your own side of the isle.

                                Ultimately tho I don't see him doing something like that. Not due to a power's or constitutionality issue, but simply cause he's lazy. He wants all the power, but non of the responsibility that goes with it, nor does he have the work ethic to actually put in the work.

                                Outside of that, it's pretty sad these are legitimate issues that need debate. Personally I'm more curious to see what he'll do come election. The railing against mail in voting is just laying ground work to delegitimize the outcome should he lose.

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