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    #46
    Originally posted by TimeMachinE30 View Post
    This thread is different in a very healthy way.

    It calls out the need to stop being so blind and see what is really going on.
    I very much agree that this would be best; way more worthwhile!

    In that exact spirit, to elevate the discussion, I submit one story that is amazingly spun / misreported / propagandized is the current situation in Venezuela. This has all the echoes of Iraq and also our very dirty history with Coups and illegal militarized regime changes in surrounding South & Central America. I would urge people to look a little deeper on that.

    We are very much "being Played" by the President, by the GOP & Democratic leadership and by Corporate / mainstream news. They are not being honest about it.
    1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

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      #47
      Originally posted by phillipj View Post
      I very much agree that this would be best; way more worthwhile!

      In that exact spirit, to elevate the discussion, I submit one story that is amazingly spun / misreported / propagandized is the current situation in Venezuela. This has all the echoes of Iraq and also our very dirty history with Coups and illegal militarized regime changes in surrounding South & Central America. I would urge people to look a little deeper on that.

      We are very much "being Played" by the President, by the GOP & Democratic leadership and by Corporate / mainstream news. They are not being honest about it.
      And so, how much do we care about foreign affairs? In a Timothy Leary way.. Tune out, turn off?

      How much value do we put to these foreign affairs rather than our own domestic (both home nation and HOME). Really an argument to be made if we focused on both homes we could be better off, fulfilled.
      ACS S3 Build / Dinan 5 E34

      Comment


        #48
        Originally posted by TimeMachinE30 View Post
        And so, how much do we care about foreign affairs? In a Timothy Leary way.. Tune out, turn off?

        How much value do we put to these foreign affairs rather than our own domestic (both home nation and HOME). Really an argument to be made if we focused on both homes we could be better off, fulfilled.
        Well, this in our case does affect us nationally, through tax dollars and possibly another war.

        But you raise a possibly good point! -- one I think I've gradually stumbled to, unhappily. What's best might be to tune these things out. Ignore "the News". Ignore Complainers. Ignore the Angry people. Ignore anyone trying to scare you about a danger that is not Clear and Present.

        Surround yourself the best you can with good people in your local community that you can help and that can help you, that have your back. Focus on your family and what you can do to make you better, definitely don't go around telling other people what to think or do. There's no time for that.

        (In that spirit I'm leaving this thread!!)
        1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

        Comment


          #49
          The author says clapper and Brennan lied to Congress. Pretty much proven without argument
          Yes they did. In 2013, well before trump even announced his plans to run. They lied about the use of the patriot act. Something put in place by GB jr. Also of note is they were both appointed by GB jr. So nothing to do with trump. And neither was charged.

          The author says Obama admin officials unmasked us citizens which is proven fact
          Again, done under the patriot act. Years before Obama was in office. Not to say the practice didn't continue under him. But this had become standard practice before he was in office.

          The author says Clinton’s campaign hired a foreign spook to source Russian spooks to throw dirt on trump. Fact.
          Lawyer Marc Elias hired Fusion GPS, which subcontracted the work to Steele. Former head of Russian affairs for Mi6. Hillary campaign didn't know steele was the one investigating, steele didn't know it was for the Hillary campaign. Once elected, funding by Hillary campaign stopped. Then all data was handed over to British and US intelligence. Doing opposition research during a campaign in standard.

          Again, what your alleging is a giant conspiracy started years before trump announced his plans to run.

          What's more believable? A giant conspiracy involving thousands of people across multiple industries, government offices, all started years before the election. With no one talking mind you. Or that a guy with a proven history of lying and doing shady shit, is lying about doing shady shit?

          Mind you, I'm not looking for trump's head. If he didn't do anything, then leave him alone, if he did do something, send him to prison. But until charges are filed, no one knows.

          Comment


            #50
            Originally posted by CarpHunter View Post
            Yes they did. In 2013, well before trump even announced his plans to run. They lied about the use of the patriot act. Something put in place by GB jr. Also of note is they were both appointed by GB jr. So nothing to do with trump. And neither was charged.
            Correct they lied a lot whats your point, its what they do.



            Originally posted by CarpHunter
            Again, done under the patriot act. Years before Obama was in office. Not to say the practice didn't continue under him. But this had become standard practice before he was in office.
            But used with impunity against political rivals, under the O admin. Used as tool for finding people trying to blow up shit under JR's tenure, not saying there was not improperer use during 43's time in office, but definitely not to the extent the O man was using it.



            Originally posted by CarpHunter
            Lawyer Marc Elias hired Fusion GPS, which subcontracted the work to Steele. Former head of Russian affairs for Mi6. Hillary campaign didn't know steele was the one investigating, steele didn't know it was for the Hillary campaign. Once elected, funding by Hillary campaign stopped. Then all data was handed over to British and US intelligence. Doing opposition research during a campaign in standard.
            This is called "plausible deniability" and "degrees of separation" to keep people out of prison. This is being truthful, but also misleading at the same time, its why the "Opposition research" was "subbed out" redundantly so all parties involved have the ability to say they didnt know what the other hands were doing so they avoid the repercussions for making up a bunch of shit and still passing it off as fact.......



            Originally posted by CarpHunter
            Mind you, I'm not looking for trump's head. If he didn't do anything, then leave him alone, if he did do something, send him to prison. But until charges are filed, no one knows.
            On this point we agree on, why isnt Hillary there already then ? ;)
            Last edited by mrsleeve; 02-20-2019, 02:19 PM.
            Originally posted by Fusion
            If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
            The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


            The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

            Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
            William Pitt-

            Comment


              #51
              Originally posted by phillipj View Post
              Well, this in our case does affect us nationally, through tax dollars and possibly another war.

              But you raise a possibly good point! -- one I think I've gradually stumbled to, unhappily. What's best might be to tune these things out. Ignore "the News". Ignore Complainers. Ignore the Angry people. Ignore anyone trying to scare you about a danger that is not Clear and Present.

              Surround yourself the best you can with good people in your local community that you can help and that can help you, that have your back. Focus on your family and what you can do to make you better, definitely don't go around telling other people what to think or do. There's no time for that.

              (In that spirit I'm leaving this thread!!)
              Read Amusing Ourselves to Death by Neil Postman.

              The decline began with the telegraph. In short order, one could learn of what was happening a week's train ride away..... And so we became amused in things which didn't have any purpose... Today we know what car snooky drove to meet with her boy toy while seeing that Kardashians are totally raving over a purse all the while ignoring the friends, family and brother and sisters there with us.
              ACS S3 Build / Dinan 5 E34

              Comment


                #52
                There’s no correction for McCarthyism and fearmongering.

                This is a pretty good self analysis of the press and it’s coverage of "Russiagate" now that we know there will be no collusion or treason or obstruction of justice indictment of anyone.

                https://taibbi.substack.com/p/russia...imes-a-million
                “There is nothing government can give you that it hasn’t taken from you in the first place”
                Sir Winston Churchill

                Comment


                  #53
                  Glad to see both sides of the political spectrum are represented on the forum. Now we just need a libertarian thread.

                  Comment


                    #54
                    Originally posted by e30RS View Post
                    Glad to see both sides of the political spectrum are represented on the forum. Now we just need a libertarian thread.
                    oh we've already got more than just D v R, believe me.
                    past:
                    1989 325is (learner shitbox)
                    1986 325e (turbo dorito)
                    1991 318ic (5-lug ITB)
                    current:
                    1985 323i baur (project to resume soon...)
                    2013 ninja 300 (way more fun than a car)

                    Comment


                      #55
                      Originally posted by decay View Post
                      oh we've already got more than just D v R, believe me.
                      Why D v R? Why versus? That is the problem. The lie has been taken as truth.

                      I pondered this today. A barber shop, and I believe history would support many public places, were a place to converse. Public oratory, Roman days of yore, paideia... now everyone is huddled with their phone reading likely biased pieces. perhaps reading is antisocial. Then the thought of public discussion in such a place could erupt into bitter feuds more likely than a decent conversation. It is not that I believe the people in the shop were indecent people, but we as nation are unable to be decent in ideology and our sharing of our views.

                      Truly, a death of public discourse.
                      ACS S3 Build / Dinan 5 E34

                      Comment


                        #56
                        Originally posted by TimeMachinE30 View Post
                        Why D v R? Why versus? That is the problem. The lie has been taken as truth.
                        because humans are primates. tribal creatures. D v R is just one manifestation of that nature.

                        present an external threat to the power balance of the current "us vs them" dynamic, and you can utilize that instinctive response to accomplish goals like #buildthewall.
                        past:
                        1989 325is (learner shitbox)
                        1986 325e (turbo dorito)
                        1991 318ic (5-lug ITB)
                        current:
                        1985 323i baur (project to resume soon...)
                        2013 ninja 300 (way more fun than a car)

                        Comment


                          #57
                          so where's the outrage at being lied to all these years from the libs here? and anyone else that believed the likes of CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC?
                          “There is nothing government can give you that it hasn’t taken from you in the first place”
                          Sir Winston Churchill

                          Comment


                            #58
                            Originally posted by decay View Post
                            because humans are primates. tribal creatures. D v R is just one manifestation of that nature.

                            present an external threat to the power balance of the current "us vs them" dynamic, and you can utilize that instinctive response to accomplish goals like #buildthewall.
                            ^^#buildthewall is a fantastic example, thank you


                            It's unfortunately how each "side" maintains power. There is no incentive to work together for the good of the people when the people are not the first priority.
                            1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

                            Comment


                              #59
                              Originally posted by gwb72tii View Post
                              so where's the outrage at being lied to all these years from the libs here? and anyone else that believed the likes of CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC?
                              https://megaphone.link/PPY8705930022

                              ^^Jeremy Scahill does an excellent job on all this in this weeks Intercepted Podcast. You would like it gwb72tii!! he has Matt Taibbi on (starts about 5-10 mins in) who you recently linked to in one of your posts (probably unknowingly); he is an excellent, very progressive investigative journalist and writer who, along with the Intercept, has been calling Russiagate a mostly 'nothing burger' from the get go-- instead they have been trying to hold the Trump Administration -- as well as the Neoliberal Democrats-- accountable for all the obvious, actual wrongs - ie. all the real 'collusion' with Israel and Saudi Arabia, as well as so many other countless blunders you can't even count them anymore.

                              >>Just because a lot of us despise Trump for very real reasons doesn't mean we were ever ok with Establishment Democrats never taking ownership of why they lost the election, and we were never okay with the mainstream TV-news media orgy over Trump for ratings and their orgy speculating Russia spy conspiracies so that they never had to do any real reporting. They are all pathetic, truly none of them are on our side.
                              1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

                              Comment


                                #60
                                I love watching this YT channel Smarter Every Day, and it's nice to see someone going straight to the sources to find more information about fooling the social media giants software so that fake news and videos can capture the attention of those oblivious:

                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PGm8LslEb4

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