Global Warming is over.

[z31maniac]

That was not the point or a even a correlation, and you know it, stop being so purposefully obtuse.

Edit: Both of you

Irony. You're good at it.

[cale]

That was not the point or a even a correlation, and you know it, stop being so purposefully obtuse.

Edit: Both of you

You mean like turning a topic of numbers and facts into a philosophical debate about whether or not it's "worth" addressing anyways?

[mrsleeve]

nope....

Climate changes, Via natural forces from 1 extrem to another, I have never said we as a species dont have an impact, its the OH NOES the worlds going to end and "everything" is going to die part that I have issues with...... Its like the tree in the woods when it falls. It sill makes noise even if there is no human there to hear it.

[cale]

Point towards claims of "everything is going to die" as you put it.

As I said above, which you failed to address, the issue is time and adaptation of species failing to keep up with it. If you want to call others purposefully obtuse, you must first accept you're essentially a kid standing in the corner covering his eyes thinking no one sees him by ignoring the single greatest issue with the direction you chose to go.

[mrsleeve]

making the metal leap that I was conflating Global CO2 levels during the time of the reptiles, were a result of their burning of trees and fuel...... All while rightfully knowing that was not the point being made, is being purposefully obtuse...

You climate change types, all have the addituide that everything is going to die off if we do.... 99% of all species that has existed on this rock are no longer here, its the fate of all life. We are no differnt to think otherwise takes a lot of hubris, and that we are some how special in that regard, I just dont see it that way.

Climate has always been ever changing here, long periods of stability are not the norm but the outliers in the geologic records sometime large changes only took a few decades, and some with a large cataclysmic event as a catalyst occurred in only a few years.

Like I have always said, its not that we dont have an effect we can and do, there is far more we dont understand or have even been witness to when it comes to weather cycles and patterns on this ball of dirt, that is driven by a unstable fusion ball in our cosmic living room that we know even less about or its long running cycles and its subtle effects on our long term weather patterns. To just automatically attribute all climate changes to our activity is a bit naive, Correlation does not always mean causation and 30 years of highly accurate data that we have now, is like trying to predict the outcome of WWII by looking a 1 photograph of the German army setting off from the front gate headed for the autobahn on the way to Poland in August 2 weeks before the invasion officially got underway on Sept 1.....

[cale]

You climate change types, all have the addituide that everything is going to die off if we do.... 99% of all species that has existed on this rock are no longer here, its the fate of all life. We are no differnt to think otherwise takes a lot of hubris, and that we are some how special in that regard, I just dont see it that way.

Broad brush strokes to avoid addressing individual points being made. No one here is saying this is cataclysm, they including myself are pointing towards a changing climate resulting in greater issues for people around the world vulnerable to change, ie. coastal people, poorer areas with already questionable agriculturally stability and those most effected by catastrophic weather patterns. And of course, the flora and fauna at the mercy of the climate. Sure we may be able to shift our bread belt in NA to current sub-arctic reasons, but the transitional period is going to be an absolute bitch. Many do not have the technological and economical benefits we do.

99% of those species did not exist at the same time as us, and they're extinctions were of natural causes. To suggest that because events have occurred naturally that we should excuse controllable extinction is asinine. Are you also suggesting if we have the capability to influence cosmic impacts that we should just let it happen because, hey, it's happened before?

Climate has always been ever changing here, long periods of stability are not the norm but the outliers in the geologic records sometime large changes only took a few decades, and some with a large cataclysmic event as a catalyst occurred in only a few years.

Again, there is a difference between natural and anthropogenic causes, we can prevent one. If half the population of the world gets thrown into a period of famine a century or two from now, are you just going to throw your hands in the air? To suggest there is no reason to fix our screw ups is incredibly irresponsible.

Like I have always said, its not that we dont have an effect we can and do, there is far more we dont understand or have even been witness to when it comes to weather cycles and patterns on this ball of dirt, that is driven by a unstable fusion ball in our cosmic living room that we know even less about or its long running cycles and its subtle effects on our long term weather patterns. To just automatically attribute all climate changes to our activity is a bit naive, Correlation does not always mean causation and 30 years of highly accurate data that we have now, is like trying to predict the outcome of WWII by looking a 1 photograph of the German army setting off from the front gate headed for the autobahn on the way to Poland in August 2 weeks before the invasion officially got underway on Sept 1.....

Way to say a lot without actually saying anything. Your intentionally being vague because you lack the knowledge to be specific. Climate models do include the sun's influence, every calculation in climate science requires the impact of the sun because without it, we'd be a ball of ice. All greenhouse gases are at the mercy of the sun, and just like phrases such as "settled", the only people suggesting otherwise are deniers too ignorant to actually research the efforts made. If you think the sun isn't accounted for, then you're only proving how little effort you've made to actually learn about this topic.

[E30 Wagen]

I have never said we as a species dont have an impact, its the OH NOES the worlds going to end and "everything" is going to die part that I have issues with......

This common complaint from deniers is so annoying because it misrepresents our entire position. And it doesn't help when figures like Ben Shapiro wildly claim that the Left's solution to global warming will end up collapsing the economy. As if the endeavors of scientists, engineers and entrepreneurs working on clean energy, pollution reduction, and economic viability isn't innovation, merely a panic response that's only succeeding to undermining the infrastructure of civilization.

Forget about arguing over CO2 levels or the nihilism toward earth's ever fluctuating climate. The benefits of optimizing energy use and reducing harm to the environment should be obvious to everybody. The great lesson I learned from working in manufacturing is the importance of continuous improvement. It pays, literally, to always monitor your actions and your resources in order to analyze what could be improved. And first on the list was always safety and making sure nobody was getting hurt. Consider what happened during the industrial revolution - factories taking no responsibility for their worker's safety or their manufacturing waste. People got seriously hurt, and the rampant pollution eventually started poisoning and killing people, something we still see happening today. In the manufacturing world, failing to collect and analyze data, failing to innovate, failing to care about workers and the effects of poisoning the environment all have well-documented negative consequences. Seems reasonable then to try and protect our only habitat in the same way.

[z31maniac]

Guys, sleeve is never going to budge on this because his livelihood depends on the oil and gas industry. Period.

[marshallnoise]

Guys, sleeve is never going to budge on this because his livelihood depends on the oil and gas industry. Period.

I think it has more to do with having common sense.

Good attempt as shutting down debate.

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[cale]

I think it has more to do with having common sense.

Good attempt as shutting down debate.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

Even better attempt at thinking you can dumb the topic down with common sense being your only source of knowledge. Maybe next Thanksgiving you can be at the adult table.

[marshallnoise]

Even better attempt at thinking you can dumb the topic down with common sense being your only source of knowledge. Maybe next Thanksgiving you can be at the adult table.

Says the fella now issuing insults as a debate method.

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[cale]

This was never a debate of facts and evidence when it comes to some people, I tailor my responses given the opposition.

[marshallnoise]

This was never a debate of facts and evidence when it comes to some people, I tailor my responses given the opposition.

Ahh, you still don't sound any smarter.

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[mrsleeve]

Guys, sleeve is never going to budge on this because his livelihood depends on the oil and gas industry. Period.

My skill set serves many many industries, oil and gas just pay the best for the least amount of headache.... u can jump to aerospace, nuke, power house, and many many other industries......

[cale]

Sort of like every time you've entered an AGW thread thinking maybe this time your recycled arguments would prove valid.