R3VLimited Forums

Go Back   R3VLimited Forums > General Forums > Off Topic Lounge > Politics and Religion

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-31-2017, 12:43 PM   #61
BraveUlysses
No R3VLimiter
 
BraveUlysses's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 3,779
because elderly poverty is fucking terrible, do you think states would ever bother to implement their own social security programs if it didnt exist for the entire country? how would it be handled if you moved from one state to another partway through your working life?

its okay we get it, you're gonna cash those social security checks.
BraveUlysses is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2017, 01:36 PM   #62
mrsleeve
I waste 90% of my day here and all I got was this stupid title
 
mrsleeve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NW MT
Posts: 15,382
^

you know as well as the rest of us that S.S.I. was NEVER intended to be a retirement plan/sole soruce of income, or was ever really designed to even be collected by the bulk of society
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusion View Post
If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
William Pitt-
mrsleeve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2017, 01:54 PM   #63
z31maniac
I waste 90% of my day here and all I got was this stupid title
 
z31maniac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 16,610
Send a message via AIM to z31maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsleeve View Post
^

you know as well as the rest of us that S.S.I. was NEVER intended to be a retirement plan/sole soruce of income, or was ever really designed to even be collected by the bulk of society
Hello there, it's obvious you are incapable of letting your faux right wing dogma operate in the real world.

All of you hard righties refuse to respond to what I said. NEWS FLASH it's because you can't defend it.
__________________
Need parts now? Need them cheap? steve@blunttech.com
Chief Sales Officer, Midwest DivisionóBlunt Tech Industries

www.gutenparts.com
One stop shopping for NEW, USED and EURO PARTS!

z31maniac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2017, 02:03 PM   #64
BraveUlysses
No R3VLimiter
 
BraveUlysses's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 3,779
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsleeve View Post
^

you know as well as the rest of us that S.S.I. was NEVER intended to be a retirement plan/sole soruce of income, or was ever really designed to even be collected by the bulk of society
no shit 1400 dollars a month isnt going to be a good sole source of income

and no shit again that the program had a higher ratio of contributors to collectors back when it started and average life expectancy was over 30 years less than it is today

both of these problems, in addition to z31's complaint that it's a 'ponzi scheme' (it's not) is to simply fund it better instead of trying to privatize it or cut benefits, simply remove the 200k ceiling and fund it well enough that it's no longer a problem.
BraveUlysses is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2017, 09:36 PM   #65
gwb72tii
No R3VLimiter
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: in the great PNW
Posts: 3,481
Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveUlysses View Post
no shit 1400 dollars a month isnt going to be a good sole source of income

and no shit again that the program had a higher ratio of contributors to collectors back when it started and average life expectancy was over 30 years less than it is today

both of these problems, in addition to z31's complaint that it's a 'ponzi scheme' (it's not) is to simply fund it better instead of trying to privatize it or cut benefits, simply remove the 200k ceiling and fund it well enough that it's no longer a problem.
My god I will have to partially agree with brave. Holy shit!

But your math is partially wrong. Life expectancy at SS start was close to normal retirement age, 62. At that time way more people paying in than getting benefits, less so today.

But Sleeve is spot on, as usual, SS was never a retirement plan. That has morphed over the years and now is a big par of most people's retirement funding.

The hardest part is people like maniac and brave. You all have a much longer life expectancy than older people, so your normal retirement age is going to go to 70+ years. It will be common for my kids generation to live and maniac to live way past 100 yrs.

And maniac, my kids went to public school. It's a great district education wise. We would have paid for private if necessary.

But yes, we conservatives are for some social programs that we approve of, like public schools where they work.

But most social pfograms don't work effectively. The ACA is a joke, except for the un-insureable, and there were better ways to solve that issue.
__________________
"Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country"
Marquis de Lafayette
gwb72tii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 12:15 AM   #66
LBJefferies
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: PNW
Posts: 1,690
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwb72tii View Post
My god I will have to partially agree with brave. Holy shit!

But your math is partially wrong. Life expectancy at SS start was close to normal retirement age, 62. At that time way more people paying in than getting benefits, less so today.

But Sleeve is spot on, as usual, SS was never a retirement plan. That has morphed over the years and now is a big par of most people's retirement funding.

The hardest part is people like maniac and brave. You all have a much longer life expectancy than older people, so your normal retirement age is going to go to 70+ years. It will be common for my kids generation to live and maniac to live way past 100 yrs.

And maniac, my kids went to public school. It's a great district education wise. We would have paid for private if necessary.

But yes, we conservatives are for some social programs that we approve of, like public schools where they work.

But most social pfograms don't work effectively. The ACA is a joke, except for the un-insureable, and there were better ways to solve that issue.
Life expectancy has plateaued. Actually it's slightly dropping in the US due to obesity and such. They think we might have hit some sort of natural limit actually. Maybe it will go up again but it looks like life expectancy is going to be more or less the same for years to come.
LBJefferies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 07:34 AM   #67
BraveUlysses
No R3VLimiter
 
BraveUlysses's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: WA
Posts: 3,779
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwb72tii View Post
But most social pfograms don't work effectively. The ACA is a joke, except for the un-insureable, and there were better ways to solve that issue.
the aca sucks but that's because it's an effort to make a market based system with patient protections and little cost controls

the GOP sucks at figuring out how to fix healthcare, and their pursuit of a repeal with no real solution is proof of it.
BraveUlysses is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 10:27 AM   #68
mrsleeve
I waste 90% of my day here and all I got was this stupid title
 
mrsleeve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NW MT
Posts: 15,382
Quote:
Originally Posted by LBJefferies View Post
Life expectancy has plateaued. Actually it's slightly dropping in the US due to obesity and such. They think we might have hit some sort of natural limit actually. Maybe it will go up again but it looks like life expectancy is going to be more or less the same for years to come.
yes the western life style and diet are playing into this a lot. I think if we were to see a shift in lifestyle and less shit in our food in general you would see that Plateau pushed up higher.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusion View Post
If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
William Pitt-
mrsleeve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 11:23 AM   #69
gwb72tii
No R3VLimiter
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: in the great PNW
Posts: 3,481
Quote:
Originally Posted by LBJefferies View Post
Life expectancy has plateaued. Actually it's slightly dropping in the US due to obesity and such. They think we might have hit some sort of natural limit actually. Maybe it will go up again but it looks like life expectancy is going to be more or less the same for years to come.
Perhaps, but certainly not a permanent status quo.

Age related diseases will mostly be treatable in the next 10 years, and being able to control those diseases will lengthen life spans dramatically. Cancers are no longer going to be a death sentence.
__________________
"Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country"
Marquis de Lafayette
gwb72tii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 11:37 AM   #70
mrsleeve
I waste 90% of my day here and all I got was this stupid title
 
mrsleeve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NW MT
Posts: 15,382
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwb72tii View Post
Perhaps, but certainly not a permanent status quo.

Age related diseases will mostly be treatable in the next 10 years, and being able to control those diseases will lengthen life spans dramatically. Cancers are no longer going to be a death sentence.
I am not so sure about this, I really think the expensive cancer treatments we have today are going to be status quo for a long time due to the fact there is so much money to be made from them. (one palliative treatment for my mother was 12k) I think its one of the down sides of the double edged sword that is for profit medical technology in general.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusion View Post
If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
William Pitt-
mrsleeve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 02:12 PM   #71
gwb72tii
No R3VLimiter
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: in the great PNW
Posts: 3,481
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsleeve View Post
I am not so sure about this, I really think the expensive cancer treatments we have today are going to be status quo for a long time due to the fact there is so much money to be made from them. (one palliative treatment for my mother was 12k) I think its one of the down sides of the double edged sword that is for profit medical technology in general.
Too many smart people working on the treatments/cures sleeve to remain locked up for profit motives.

Bill Gates is one, and besides, if I could offer a genetic based treatment that got rid of your melanoma, how many other people do you think would beat a path to my door?

I just heard a lecture on medical knowledge and technology. Medical knowledge (my numbers are suspect but you get the drift) doubled from 1875 to 1950, doubled again by 2000. doubled again by 2010, again by 2015, and is now doubling every 180 days, all due to tech.
__________________
"Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country"
Marquis de Lafayette
gwb72tii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 09:07 PM   #72
LBJefferies
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: PNW
Posts: 1,690
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwb72tii View Post
Too many smart people working on the treatments/cures sleeve to remain locked up for profit motives.

Bill Gates is one, and besides, if I could offer a genetic based treatment that got rid of your melanoma, how many other people do you think would beat a path to my door?

I just heard a lecture on medical knowledge and technology. Medical knowledge (my numbers are suspect but you get the drift) doubled from 1875 to 1950, doubled again by 2000. doubled again by 2010, again by 2015, and is now doubling every 180 days, all due to tech.
Moore's law
LBJefferies is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2004 - 2020 R3VLimited LLC