R3VLimited Forums

Go Back   R3VLimited Forums > E30 Technical Forums > 24V Engine Swaps > M50/52 & S50/52

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-14-2004, 04:28 PM   #1
Ryan Stewart
I Love Miatas
 
Ryan Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 8,978
Send a message via ICQ to Ryan Stewart Send a message via AIM to Ryan Stewart Send a message via Yahoo to Ryan Stewart
The comprehensive DOHC engine swap thread.

Since it appears that at the moment there are several of us who are doing the swap soon and several that have recently done the swap this thread is designed to let anyone throw thier .02 in. Post what you have, what you mean to get, anything funky you think you need, and (most importantly) any parts hookups you know of. Any issues that should be addressed should also be posted here, I'll start:

Three things you want to consider doing while the engien is out is replacing the water pump and thermostat housing with the aluminum parts. The plastic have been known to fail. Also the pre-10/95 S50s all had a possibility of valve spring retainer failure due to the way the retianers are mfgt. Any engine made on or after 10/95 has the updated retainers. If yours is before you might want to get the stock retainers and install them, the part # is the same but the way they are made changed. Also check the tightness of the oil pump bolts including the gear.

I currently have:

10/95 S50 and ZF tranny
s50 accesories and radiator
89 rad mounts AND M3 rad mounts
89 resevior
E36 M3 conforti CAI
E30 M3 driveshaft
E34 525i oilpan and sump
New cluster from Greg.

I plan on using the 320i booster with the 535i MC, 535i mounts and 320i tranny mounts.

I have sources for rebuilt brake components but am interested in new because I am a little under budget at the moment. If anyone has good sources let us know. I know Greg posted a price that seemed a bit low for the 320i booster so I will PM him on that one. also I was considering uprated engine mounts. What would be the best source for a uprated 535i mount? An S38 mount?

I am also considering just getting a new oilpump and sump while I am at it. Any reason not to?
__________________
Im now E30less.
Ryan Stewart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2004, 04:45 PM   #2
Beej '86 325es
R3VLimited
 
Beej '86 325es's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 2,627
Currently have:

9/95 M3 head
-port/polish
-high tension valve springs
-stainless steel valves
-heat treated keepers
-titanium retainers (will be swapping for OEM to make more streetable)

Still waiting on '99 Z3 engine miles to be shipped, the guy is being very lazy about it...it's been 3 weeks since I paid, I may have to file a claim with PayPal.

I'll be adding Schrick cams to the head, keeping the bottom end stock. Probably some 3.2L M3 exhaust manifolds if they fit the Z3 block (I don't see why they wouldn't). Will be using the M20 tranny since I just put in a new driveshaft anyway. Also, I plan to use the late E30 radiator/expansion tank as opposed to the M50 equipment.

Until I buy a house to work on it in, or have a shop install it for me, all I am collecting for the time being are actual engine parts. My landlord would have a hissy fit if I told him I was going to do an engine conversion in the garaged carport here.

It really helps to have the ETK to be able to see what parts I am missing. I will invest in a E36 & Z3 Bentley manuals whenever the Z3 engine comes.
__________________
-Brandon
'86 325es S50
'12 VW GTI Autobahn DSG
'03 540i M-Sport (sold)
'08 Jeep SRT-8 (sold)

For sale:
S50 TMS chip for Schricks
Beej '86 325es is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2004, 04:46 PM   #3
Wes325
E30 Addict
 
Wes325's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Charlotte, N.C.
Posts: 563
Send a message via AIM to Wes325
This thread is a great idea Ryan. It seems more and more people are becoming serious with the DOHC(M50/S50) engine swaps rather than just throwing a whim of a dream they had onto the forums. This is some very helpfull info that I saved a few months ago from Chuck Waits. Hope this can help.

E30 M50 ENGINE CONV PARTS LIST

"1. E30 88' radiator, I used the e36 unit with the lower mounts raised
2. E30 88' radiator over flow tank
3. E30 M20 fan, poss. w/clutch
4. E28 533i motor mounts w/ 5mm spacers or e28 m5 mounts with out spacers
5. E34 throttle cable
6. E21 brake booster w/ modified shaft, to 15mm or 325IX/e32 735 without mod to the shaft
7. E34 M5 or 25mm brake master cylinder w/ additional brake line used for the 325ix booster
or a e32 735i with the modified 320i booster
8. E30 325 trans X-member
9. E28 m5 or two 320i trans mounts/ which are cheaper
10. E30 M3 driveshaft or i used the front of the e36 mated to the rear of my e30 M3 have it rebalanced
11. E30 diff. w/ 3:25 ratio or E28 533i w/ 3:25 LSD
12. E30 318 ECU mount
13. E34 oil pan
14. E34 oil pickup
ect. ect.
15. E36 m3 exhaust manifold
16. M50 radiator hoses
17. E36 M3 Motronic
18. OBDI intake manifold
19. OBDI throttle body boot
20. E36 alloy mounting arms
21. OBDI wiring harness DO NOT BUY silver label ?413? motronic, it has EWS (security),
it can only put into original chassis
22. the engine harness and the ECU are all E36 M3.
On the standard E30 with M20 engine fitted, you have the large round plug (C101) up on the firewall next to the brake booster.
This plug has 2 parts. One half is connected to the car wiring, and the other is connected to the engine harness.
When the M20 was removed, the engine side of the plug was removed with the engine. Now I have the S50 half of the plug in its place. Although similar in appearance, it will not plug directly into the E30 half of the plug.
I removed the E36 engine half of the plug, and replaced it with an E30 one. This then allows the 2 parts to screw back together. All you need to make sure is that you have the correct wires connected to each other. Its not just pin 1 to pin 1 and pin 2 to pin 2 etc (although some of the wires do actually connect this way).
This plug connection is the only point where the E30 & E36 wiring interface with each other. The rest of the E36 M3 engine harness is totally self contained.

23. the exhaust from the downpipe to the muffler is all custom made

This is not a complete list but damn close if you need any additional info feel free to email or call me at
INTERNATIONAL AUTO
770-745-0501
my name is Chuck Waits, and we are open from 8 to 5pm EST"
________
Yamaha XV750

Last edited by Wes325; 01-22-2011 at 12:39 PM.
Wes325 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2004, 09:15 AM   #4
NickP
Wrencher
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NYC / Toronto
Posts: 257
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wes325
7. E34 M5 or 25mm brake master cylinder w/ additional brake line used for the 325ix booster
or a e32 735i with the modified 320i booster

21. OBDI wiring harness DO NOT BUY silver label 413 motronic, it has EWS (security),
it can only put into original chassis
7. I'm running the iX booster with the e34 M5 MC and didn't need to fab up the extra brake line - I believe this is only necessary with e30 M3's

21. Don't worry too much about this, Turner now sells an EWS disabling chip. You're going to want to upgrade to bigger injectors and the Euro HFM anyways
NickP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2004, 10:02 AM   #5
nando
Moderator
 
nando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: bellingham, wa
Posts: 32,673
I'd like to know how using the Getrag transmission affects the engine posistion. mainly because I'd like to build one of these:





I'd like to keep the geometry of the front drivelines close to the same as stock (if not raise the front diff up a little bit). I know everything else is different, but the ix getrag is pretty much the same as any other E30, except for the output shaft.
nando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2004, 10:14 AM   #6
aaron_silva
E30 Mastermind
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 1,784
Send a message via AIM to aaron_silva
Re: The comprehensive DOHC engine swap thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan Stewart
I am also considering just getting a new oilpump and sump while I am at it. Any reason not to?
Might as well. Good pm. That would suck to have it quit on you right after the swap. I would recommend either putting locktite on the sprocket nut or welding it on. These have been known to back out.

With the 325iX brake booster, is it necessary to get the new master cylinder?

Aaron
__________________
2008 Audi S4 Avant
aaron_silva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2004, 11:25 AM   #7
cheades
Mod Crazy
 
cheades's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: NW Wa
Posts: 629
Another option for the oil pump is to safety wire (drill hole through bolt below nut and put wire through the hole) it on just in case you want to be able to take it back off later rather than welding it on. Great post, does everybody agree that the akgmotorsports wiring diagram is the one to use? Also does anyone know the wiring difference between the US and euro M3 motors?

Craig
cheades is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2004, 11:45 AM   #8
rs4pro3
R3V Elite
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Posts: 5,808
Send a message via AIM to rs4pro3 Send a message via MSN to rs4pro3
Ya I would replace the oil pump. When I was in the dealer the other day asking about a used E34 M30 oil pump I got they said the E36's are the only cars that have ever come in with oil pump problems.
__________________
85 325e 2.7 ITB'd stroker
rs4pro3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 07:51 AM   #9
aaron_silva
E30 Mastermind
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 1,784
Send a message via AIM to aaron_silva
When using the getrag 260 for the tranny, can you use the e30 ltw flywheel? Those with the aluminum flywheel, does it make driving the car a pain? What clutch should you use?

Thank you.

Aaron
__________________
2008 Audi S4 Avant
aaron_silva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 09:17 AM   #10
Beej '86 325es
R3VLimited
 
Beej '86 325es's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 2,627
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaron_silva
When using the getrag 260 for the tranny, can you use the e30 ltw flywheel? Those with the aluminum flywheel, does it make driving the car a pain? What clutch should you use?

Thank you.

Aaron
From what I understand, there are several options for flywheels you can use. I hear you can use the M20 flywheel if it is shaved down. Also, I hear the E30 M3 flywheel will work. I will probably go with the UUC flywheel and clutch kit for the M50.

Someone please confirm that my info is correct.
__________________
-Brandon
'86 325es S50
'12 VW GTI Autobahn DSG
'03 540i M-Sport (sold)
'08 Jeep SRT-8 (sold)

For sale:
S50 TMS chip for Schricks
Beej '86 325es is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 01:24 PM   #11
Brew
No R3VLimiter
 
Brew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Braintree, MA
Posts: 3,057
I need to know which flywheel to use also. I'm using the getrag 260.

I'm picking up my M50 this sunday! 92' Non-Vanos.
__________________
'91 318is
Brew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 02:10 PM   #12
Ryan Stewart
I Love Miatas
 
Ryan Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 8,978
Send a message via ICQ to Ryan Stewart Send a message via AIM to Ryan Stewart Send a message via Yahoo to Ryan Stewart
Aaron my understanding is the master cylinder doesnt HAVE to be changed its just a nice upgrade while you are in there. The booster only has to be changed to make room for the rather large plenum.
__________________
Im now E30less.
Ryan Stewart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 07:35 PM   #13
Bryson
E30 Fanatic
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: SLO, La Jolla, CA
Posts: 1,490
Send a message via AIM to Bryson
m20 flywheel works with an m20 (or same sized) clutch. An alu m20 flywheel does not make driving a pain at all, the car will rev all over the place, it's glorious. Some people insist that either the m20 flywheel or the e34m50 oil pan need to be shaved down in order to work together, however, I have used both a stock m20 flywheel and aluminum m20 one with no problems
use red loctite on the oil sump sprocket, if you go that route, which I would reccommend
__________________
Bryson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 09:28 PM   #14
kylebes1
R3VLimited
 
kylebes1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Georgia
Posts: 2,804
Send a message via AIM to kylebes1 Send a message via MSN to kylebes1
got a question about mounting the m50. Project ORCA(got it for a fall back) has a custom fabbed plate that acts as a spacer and to move the hole more outward(i thnk), is this necessary?

I got a brand new 320i booster for 120 ish at Advance Auto Parts
kylebes1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2004, 10:24 PM   #15
Ryan Stewart
I Love Miatas
 
Ryan Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 8,978
Send a message via ICQ to Ryan Stewart Send a message via AIM to Ryan Stewart Send a message via Yahoo to Ryan Stewart
but who is making it for that price?
__________________
Im now E30less.
Ryan Stewart is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2004 - 2020 R3VLimited LLC