How To Argue With Your Insurance Company
I've been encouraged to post my correspondence with my insurance company by my girl. This entire exchange took place back in September 2012, so enough time has passed that my insurance company (who I won't be naming) shouldn't mind.
I was given an insulting offer of $4,250 for my 1991 318iS, which the insurance company deemed a total loss. :(
I'll start with my reaction to the initial offer:
I then found a car advertised in another province for $16,000, which at the time was the only E30 in Canada in a similar condition to mine, though it had considerably less mileage... which was perfect for what I had planned:
You need to be firm and professional, and let them know you're well aware of your rights as their customer:
Keep the pressure on, and keep inundating them with supporting evidence:
In the end, I received an offer of $9,800 for the car, which back in 2012 was a tidy sum.
I hope to never have to go through this process again, but if I do end up doing so someday with this same insurance company I hope they pull my file and cut the bullshit to save everyone time. ;)
I was given an insulting offer of $4,250 for my 1991 318iS, which the insurance company deemed a total loss. :(
I'll start with my reaction to the initial offer:
[AGENT NAME],
You'll have to forgive the impassioned nature of this e-mail, as I trust you and I can work together to come up with a reasonable valuation for my vehicle that will allow me to find a similar replacement. I have had excellent relations with the people at [INSURANCE COMPANY] in the past, and from our conversation earlier this afternoon I expect that positive relationship with your company to continue.
I strongly disagree with my vehicle valuation (of $4,250), to the point where I find it insulting at best and completely fraudulent at worst, as just about the only accurate information it contains is the description of the make and model of my car.
The opening valuation summary alone destroys the integrity of the entire document with the following utterly ridiculous claim:
Odometer 268,812 km (Typical) 140,348 km (Actual) $195 (Adjustment)
128,464 km less mileage - nearly double the mileage on my car - is given a valuation adjustment of $195. I'm sure you'll agree that no reasonable person (or court) would find that in any way justifiable.
The "condition assessment" leaves me with the impression that the appraiser either did not actually look at my car, or was lazy to the point where he did not bother to enter any specific information into my valuation, leaving my car with a "typical" rating in every area (which from reading these description details should more accurately be called "beater").
I'm going to address these “descriptions” by providing you with actual pictures of my car interspersed with the "descriptions" provided in my vehicle evaluation (in red italics).
INTERIOR
My interior condition is easily a 9.5+ out of 10. My car still has an original windshield complete with the original engine break in procedures sticker from 1991. You would need to have me point the only tiny flaw in the interior of my car out to you, and even then you would have difficulty seeing it:
Seats - Moderate Wear
Seating surfaces split or cracked. 1 tear greater than 1 credit card. 4 or more burn marks or holes smaller than a dime. Considerable wear. Side panel seat padding flat. Portion of seams separated. Extreme odor or smoke damage that can't be removed with detail. Considerable fading or discoloration. Considerable sun or weather damage. Mold that can't be removed with a detail.
Carpets - Moderate Wear
4 or more burn marks or holes smaller than a dime. 1 tear greater than 1 credit card in size. Considerable fading or discoloration. Molded inserts separated from carpet. Sun or weather damage. Mold that can't be removed with a detail.
Int Trim - Moderate Damage
Deep scratches and wear. 1-2 gauges missing. Multiple control knobs missing. 4 or more burn marks or holes smaller than a dime. Multiple surface cracks no greater than 1 credit card in size. Considerable sun or weather damage. Missing speaker covers. Mold that can't be removed with detail.
Glass - Good
No obvious damage. Numerous small pits. Light scratches visible on close inspection.
Headliner - Good
No damage. Very negligible wear visible on close inspection. Soiling removable with cleaning. No fading or discoloration.
EXTERIOR
My exterior condition is easily a 9 out of 10. These pictures speak for themselves. Please note that I had temporarily removed my rear spoiler to properly detail the trunk lid, and I covered the factory mounting holes with painter's tape.
Body - Moderate Damage
Small dents or a dent greater than 1 credit card in size up to the size of this Condition Book. Surface rust on one or more panels. Small isolated spot or spots rusted through less than 1 credit card in size. Considerable hail damage, including repairable hail damage. Poor quality repairs on 1-2 panels.
Paint - Moderate Damage
Visible oxidation or fading. Discoloration that can't be buffed out. More than 3 scrapes or large scratches up to 6 credit cards in length or diameter. Extensive chipping. Checking on 3 or more panels. 1 primer area. Obvious mismatched paint on 1 panel. Poor quality complete vehicle repaint.
Ext Trim - Moderate Damage
Corrosion or rust on more than 3 items. 1-3 items broken. 1-2 minor items missing. More than 3 tears or cracks up to 6 credit cards in length or diameter. Holes in cladding. Large tears or cracks. Mismatched items. Scrapes or peeling paint on chrome and bumper covers.
MECHANICAL
There was nothing - absolutely nothing whatsoever - wrong with any mechanical or electrical aspect of my car. The low mileage alone could attest to this fact, but the religious service history firmly supports it, and when I took this car to car shows and had passengers familiar with these cars ride with me they were astounded at how perfectly it drove. An older gentleman even remarked that my car brought him back in time to the car he purchased new from the dealership. Everything worked, from the perfect motor and gearbox to the original power antenna.
Engine - Minor Work
Belts or accessories disconnected, need replacement or possibly not working. Corrosion noticeable. Extensive oil or fluid leakage. Pooling in compartments.
Transmission - Minor Work
Transmission requires slight to moderate work but still drives. Clutch slipping. Extensive oil leaks.
TIRES
The wheels on my car - which I will remove as discussed - are a special European only factory BMW wheel, and the tires are a newly purchased matching set of performance tires with less than 1,000 km of mileage on them.
Front Tires Good Tires are in good condition. 30-79% of tread remains.
Rear Tires Good Tires are in good condition. 30-79% of tread remains.
Finally, we arrive at the selection of replacement vehicles, and yet again the information provided is of absolutely no value.
Three of the listed cars appear to be high mileage beaters from Quebec, which I'm sure you're aware is the worst province to buy a 20+ year old rust prone car from. I actually telephoned the numbers provided, and was able to speak (in French) with a man claiming to be one of the previous owners of one of the listed cars. He confirmed that the car in question had (translated) "some rust" which I later discovered included "several rust holes" and "a poorly repaired floor and strut tower". The fourth car is a car from Ontario with 280,000 km on it, and at a $3,000 list price was probably not far off a total project car.
To add one final insult, the appraiser suggested a 1992 BMW 318is would be a suitable replacement for my car, even though it is worth about a third of the value and is a completely different model (one which now enjoys a far less enthusiastic community of buyers).
As discussed, I will provide you with the results of my research into actual comparable vehicles which are currently available.
With warm regards,
Paul.
You'll have to forgive the impassioned nature of this e-mail, as I trust you and I can work together to come up with a reasonable valuation for my vehicle that will allow me to find a similar replacement. I have had excellent relations with the people at [INSURANCE COMPANY] in the past, and from our conversation earlier this afternoon I expect that positive relationship with your company to continue.
I strongly disagree with my vehicle valuation (of $4,250), to the point where I find it insulting at best and completely fraudulent at worst, as just about the only accurate information it contains is the description of the make and model of my car.
The opening valuation summary alone destroys the integrity of the entire document with the following utterly ridiculous claim:
Odometer 268,812 km (Typical) 140,348 km (Actual) $195 (Adjustment)
128,464 km less mileage - nearly double the mileage on my car - is given a valuation adjustment of $195. I'm sure you'll agree that no reasonable person (or court) would find that in any way justifiable.
The "condition assessment" leaves me with the impression that the appraiser either did not actually look at my car, or was lazy to the point where he did not bother to enter any specific information into my valuation, leaving my car with a "typical" rating in every area (which from reading these description details should more accurately be called "beater").
I'm going to address these “descriptions” by providing you with actual pictures of my car interspersed with the "descriptions" provided in my vehicle evaluation (in red italics).
INTERIOR
My interior condition is easily a 9.5+ out of 10. My car still has an original windshield complete with the original engine break in procedures sticker from 1991. You would need to have me point the only tiny flaw in the interior of my car out to you, and even then you would have difficulty seeing it:
Seats - Moderate Wear
Seating surfaces split or cracked. 1 tear greater than 1 credit card. 4 or more burn marks or holes smaller than a dime. Considerable wear. Side panel seat padding flat. Portion of seams separated. Extreme odor or smoke damage that can't be removed with detail. Considerable fading or discoloration. Considerable sun or weather damage. Mold that can't be removed with a detail.
Carpets - Moderate Wear
4 or more burn marks or holes smaller than a dime. 1 tear greater than 1 credit card in size. Considerable fading or discoloration. Molded inserts separated from carpet. Sun or weather damage. Mold that can't be removed with a detail.
Int Trim - Moderate Damage
Deep scratches and wear. 1-2 gauges missing. Multiple control knobs missing. 4 or more burn marks or holes smaller than a dime. Multiple surface cracks no greater than 1 credit card in size. Considerable sun or weather damage. Missing speaker covers. Mold that can't be removed with detail.
Glass - Good
No obvious damage. Numerous small pits. Light scratches visible on close inspection.
Headliner - Good
No damage. Very negligible wear visible on close inspection. Soiling removable with cleaning. No fading or discoloration.
EXTERIOR
My exterior condition is easily a 9 out of 10. These pictures speak for themselves. Please note that I had temporarily removed my rear spoiler to properly detail the trunk lid, and I covered the factory mounting holes with painter's tape.
Body - Moderate Damage
Small dents or a dent greater than 1 credit card in size up to the size of this Condition Book. Surface rust on one or more panels. Small isolated spot or spots rusted through less than 1 credit card in size. Considerable hail damage, including repairable hail damage. Poor quality repairs on 1-2 panels.
Paint - Moderate Damage
Visible oxidation or fading. Discoloration that can't be buffed out. More than 3 scrapes or large scratches up to 6 credit cards in length or diameter. Extensive chipping. Checking on 3 or more panels. 1 primer area. Obvious mismatched paint on 1 panel. Poor quality complete vehicle repaint.
Ext Trim - Moderate Damage
Corrosion or rust on more than 3 items. 1-3 items broken. 1-2 minor items missing. More than 3 tears or cracks up to 6 credit cards in length or diameter. Holes in cladding. Large tears or cracks. Mismatched items. Scrapes or peeling paint on chrome and bumper covers.
MECHANICAL
There was nothing - absolutely nothing whatsoever - wrong with any mechanical or electrical aspect of my car. The low mileage alone could attest to this fact, but the religious service history firmly supports it, and when I took this car to car shows and had passengers familiar with these cars ride with me they were astounded at how perfectly it drove. An older gentleman even remarked that my car brought him back in time to the car he purchased new from the dealership. Everything worked, from the perfect motor and gearbox to the original power antenna.
Engine - Minor Work
Belts or accessories disconnected, need replacement or possibly not working. Corrosion noticeable. Extensive oil or fluid leakage. Pooling in compartments.
Transmission - Minor Work
Transmission requires slight to moderate work but still drives. Clutch slipping. Extensive oil leaks.
TIRES
The wheels on my car - which I will remove as discussed - are a special European only factory BMW wheel, and the tires are a newly purchased matching set of performance tires with less than 1,000 km of mileage on them.
Front Tires Good Tires are in good condition. 30-79% of tread remains.
Rear Tires Good Tires are in good condition. 30-79% of tread remains.
Finally, we arrive at the selection of replacement vehicles, and yet again the information provided is of absolutely no value.
Three of the listed cars appear to be high mileage beaters from Quebec, which I'm sure you're aware is the worst province to buy a 20+ year old rust prone car from. I actually telephoned the numbers provided, and was able to speak (in French) with a man claiming to be one of the previous owners of one of the listed cars. He confirmed that the car in question had (translated) "some rust" which I later discovered included "several rust holes" and "a poorly repaired floor and strut tower". The fourth car is a car from Ontario with 280,000 km on it, and at a $3,000 list price was probably not far off a total project car.
To add one final insult, the appraiser suggested a 1992 BMW 318is would be a suitable replacement for my car, even though it is worth about a third of the value and is a completely different model (one which now enjoys a far less enthusiastic community of buyers).
As discussed, I will provide you with the results of my research into actual comparable vehicles which are currently available.
With warm regards,
Paul.
[AGENT NAME],
I was actually successful in my search for a truly comparable vehicle to my car:
[LINK]
This car has nearly 100,000 km less mileage than my car (the difference worth about $175 according to your appraiser, which I gladly pay for out of my own pocket), but it appears to be in very similar condition. I was not able to find any other contenders (1991 BMW 318is in excellent condition with 140,000 km or less mileage) currently for sale anywhere in North America at this time.
With warm regards,
Paul.
I was actually successful in my search for a truly comparable vehicle to my car:
[LINK]
This car has nearly 100,000 km less mileage than my car (the difference worth about $175 according to your appraiser, which I gladly pay for out of my own pocket), but it appears to be in very similar condition. I was not able to find any other contenders (1991 BMW 318is in excellent condition with 140,000 km or less mileage) currently for sale anywhere in North America at this time.
With warm regards,
Paul.
[AGENT NAME],
As I indicated in my recent voicemail message, I am revoking my permission to take my car from [AUTO BODY SHOP] until we resolve this matter to my satisfaction.
I understand you are paying storage fees, so if you could please contact me at [PHONE NUMBER] as soon as possible it would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
Paul.
As I indicated in my recent voicemail message, I am revoking my permission to take my car from [AUTO BODY SHOP] until we resolve this matter to my satisfaction.
I understand you are paying storage fees, so if you could please contact me at [PHONE NUMBER] as soon as possible it would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
Paul.
[AGENT NAME],
Here are some additional cars I've found which were just recently listed:
[LINK]
This car has much higher mileage than mine, is a year older, has a different motor, and has new paint. This car is rust free due to the recent paint, and as such I would value it at about $7,500.
[LINK]
This car is in very similar condition to mine (I've spoken with the seller). Though the motor swap adds value for some due to the increase in power, it detracts value for others due to the lack of originality in a special car like this one. The car has quite a bit more mileage than mine, but despite the mileage I believe it is well priced and should sell quickly at $13,500.
From the additional reading I've done and experts I've consulted, it would appear there is a possibility that my car has a bent frame due to the location and severity of the impact (surprising given it was in a tight parking lot), so I would prefer replacing the car as long as I receive a fair amount for it from your company which enables me to do so (I'm now estimating it is valued accurately at $12,000 plus taxes). Again, I understand your costs are mounting due to storage and rental fees, so please get in touch with me at [PHONE NUMBER] as soon as you are able.
I look forward to speaking with you soon,
Paul.
Here are some additional cars I've found which were just recently listed:
[LINK]
This car has much higher mileage than mine, is a year older, has a different motor, and has new paint. This car is rust free due to the recent paint, and as such I would value it at about $7,500.
[LINK]
This car is in very similar condition to mine (I've spoken with the seller). Though the motor swap adds value for some due to the increase in power, it detracts value for others due to the lack of originality in a special car like this one. The car has quite a bit more mileage than mine, but despite the mileage I believe it is well priced and should sell quickly at $13,500.
From the additional reading I've done and experts I've consulted, it would appear there is a possibility that my car has a bent frame due to the location and severity of the impact (surprising given it was in a tight parking lot), so I would prefer replacing the car as long as I receive a fair amount for it from your company which enables me to do so (I'm now estimating it is valued accurately at $12,000 plus taxes). Again, I understand your costs are mounting due to storage and rental fees, so please get in touch with me at [PHONE NUMBER] as soon as you are able.
I look forward to speaking with you soon,
Paul.
I hope to never have to go through this process again, but if I do end up doing so someday with this same insurance company I hope they pull my file and cut the bullshit to save everyone time. ;)
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