UUC's Wilwood Big Brake Sport Kit (11.75" rotor)

[bimma360]

Whos fast car... mine or his? :)

I think i'll take you up on that offer Rob. Funny thing is, my car is getting the swap done in Northern Jersey and i'll be taking 206 on my way home when i pick it up. I figure i'll be picking it up in 3 weeks at the earliest.

Thanks again,
Dave

[Fidhle007]

Now that's a good sales man...also a good excuse to get a ride in a fast car ;)

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!! You talking about salesmenship really cracks me up for some reason...

[BUDNUNTA]

I will definitely be able to give you an answer on that very soon... I have a set of those exact wheels on the way for my 332iS project car.

- Rob

Perfect, Hopefully it wont need spacers.





Hunter

[emi325i]

Actually, considering that Emi returned the parts without proper packaging and they were completely destroyed in shipping, I think it was nice of me not to refuse the return.

Completely destroyed?!? If I drove over a caliper or rotor with a UPS truck they'd still be intact! Which I exactly what I wanted to do to them after having spent money on 2 sets of wheels. If you're such a great engineer, you should have known exactly what size spacer I needed the first time I called you.

[Rob@UUC]

Completely destroyed?!? If I drove over a caliper or rotor with a UPS truck they'd still be intact! Which I exactly what I wanted to do to them after having spent money on 2 sets of wheels.

Considering that they were packed without any protective padding with loose hardware just thrown in the box, the kit showed up looking like someone had played hockey on concrete with all the parts. Can't make a UPS claim because the packaging was clearly to blame. Now I'm not saying your misplaced anger was the reason for this sub-par packing, I am assuming an honest mistake, which is why I was nice and did not refuse the return.

You are welcome.

If you're such a great engineer, you should have known exactly what size spacer I needed the first time I called you.

Please don't be ridiculous, insulting, and revise history all in one sentence. You asked me what wheels would fit with what spacers and I told you... but the manufacturer discontinued those wheels and replaced them with another design that you bought. Be realistic, don't blame me for that.

Okay, so it didn't work out for you. You got almost a full refund, I got a box of trash not even usable for a charity racecar, and you get to keep your wheels. You lose out how after I take the big hit? Does this sound reasonable to anybody?

- Rob

[LEANE30]

...tis the sad cost of doing business. write it off, you know he can't.

this thread wanders so far off path it is obsurd. Rob, do you guys have a downloadable, printable sizing guide? I AM PERSONALLY INTERESTED, i run a rare and old discontinued set of 15"X6" wheels, some have no personal margin for error, assumptions, alterations, or alternatives.

being the grounded engineer that you claim to be, providing such should not take more than 15-20 minutes TOPS with a laptop, a brake setup, and micrometer. perhaps this should become an industry precedent. paper cutouts do not damage wheels. ...improper, possibly negligent installment of the wheels onto new, unfamiliar brake profiles damages wheels. mistakes can be made. a paper cutout to confirm the "fitment of 15" wheels" or atleast SPECIFIC dimentions of the brake's complete profile may reduce the possibility of a 'mistake' being made by an individual who took the word of a merchant at face value, assuming fit uses implied for the given product sold.

a 15% restocking fee is complete bullshit. also, shipping costs for returning an unfit product for it's implied use should be covered by the seller. it is the duty of the seller under the statutes of the UCC to not mis-inform, even in an assumptive manner of the fit use of a mechantable product.

a returned item that does not show any manufacturing or original shipment damage, but was damaged by the buyer or shows damages cause directly by the buyer's negligent handling of returning a product via shipment or delivery (valid in course or not) should not be refunded, and shipment should not be accepted. if shipment were accidentally accepted, being a gratious company desiring to kindle good will, the seller could offer to return ship the damaged item along with a written statement for cause of refusal of the return, sighting the negligent act of the buyer in their method of returning the product (seller must explicitly inform of these practices and proper procedure at the time of the original sale).

that all being said, Emi and Rob, both of you should simply go your seperate ways and if there is an axe to bury, do it privately, not in public, public bickering only drives both of your reputations into the ground. Maybe both of you will in some manner or way alter your future behaviors due to this event. Take each of your preceived losses with the grain of salt that apparently you both possibly have some new-found personal wisdom you both need to implement.

Rob, stop trying to make lemonade from lemons, that shit's fucking annoying. start a new thread somewhere, personally perhaps, about your project and the brakes your equiping it with if you want to blow more smoke up everyone's asses on behalf of UUC.

just calling it like i see it. lifes not fair, both of you shut up.

[Rob@UUC]

...tis the sad cost of doing business. write it off, you know he can't.

Which is exactly what I was doing until it got rubbed in my face. :roll:

But in all reality, there is no such thing as "write it off". The costs do indeed get absorbed as the proverbial "cost of doing business", lost and we move on. It's still a cost that is spent-and-gone money.

this thread wanders so far off path it is obsurd. Rob, do you guys have a downloadable, printable sizing guide? I AM PERSONALLY INTERESTED, i run a rare and old discontinued set of 15"X6" wheels, some have no personal margin for error, assumptions, alterations, or alternatives.

Working on it for the new calipers as detailed earlier. Fighting a small computer/software problem at the moment.

a 15% restocking fee is complete bullshit.

No, it's not. It's "industry standard", and in fact many companies have a "no returns, period" policy, even if defective. Some of the glossy "catalog" resellers explicity state "NO WARRANTY, EVERYTHING SOLD AS-IS".

UUC offers a minimum 1-year warranty on everything, with many items having a lifetime warranty. Even wear items like clutches are warranteed. The restocking fee is in our TOS on the website, and similar documents are in the materials of any legitimate company you will ever do business with.

I'll re-state this situation to clarify: EMI325i did not receive defective parts. He installed them and then tried a wheel that was not recommended as we had no data on it. It was his decision not to use spacers (very common, and even recommended for improved handling). The BBK was installed, fluid put in the calipers, and therefore not re-sellable. Most companies would have said, "sorry, you own it." That the only penalty was a small restocking fee, and that we even accepted the package with damaged contents is completely unheard-of. I am honestly shocked that Emi is still not thanking me for the refund, given that effectively nothing of value was returned. $743.75 out of my own pocket, just because he did not dry-fit the parts nor package them properly for the return shipment.

also, shipping costs for returning an unfit product for it's implied use should be covered by the seller. it is the duty of the seller under the statutes of the UCC to not mis-inform, even in an assumptive manner of the fit use of a mechantable product.

Product was 100% fit for intended use. Customer used non-approved wheels that I specifically told him I did not know if they would fit or not. Assumption of risk was purely his at that point.

We all like to protect the customer, and UUC bends over backwards to do that. Again, we're the ones that got the short end of the stick on this one.

a returned item that does not show any manufacturing or original shipment damage, but was damaged by the buyer or shows damages cause directly by the buyer's negligent handling of returning a product via shipment or delivery (valid in course or not) should not be refunded, and shipment should not be accepted. if shipment were accidentally accepted, being a gratious company desiring to kindle good will, the seller could offer to return ship the damaged item along with a written statement for cause of refusal of the return, sighting the negligent act of the buyer in their method of returning the product (seller must explicitly inform of these practices and proper procedure at the time of the original sale).

that all being said, Emi and Rob, both of you should simply go your seperate ways and if there is an axe to bury, do it privately, not in public, public bickering only drives both of your reputations into the ground. Maybe both of you will in some manner or way alter your future behaviors due to this event. Take each of your preceived losses with the grain of salt that apparently you both possibly have some new-found personal wisdom you both need to implement.

You are 100% right.

Rob, stop trying to make lemonade from lemons, that shit's fucking annoying. start a new thread somewhere, personally perhaps, about your project and the brakes your equiping it with if you want to blow more smoke up everyone's asses on behalf of UUC.

You lost me there. I shouldn't mention a personal project? It's not even a "company project" because it's useless for any exposure and not really for any testing... it's basic E30 stuff that we've all seen before, almost boring - except I want to put it together, I think it's cool. Thought I would share a little enthusiasm with fellow E30 enthusiasts.

Seriously - to be candid with you guys, there's no money in E30 parts. Anything that I design or build for E30s is because I think it's fun. Our business manager wants to shoot me for wasting time, money, and resources on this stuff. Anything that I offer for E30s is a duplicate of what I want for my own mini-monster E30, and that's it.

See y'all at the track!

- Rob

[Fidhle007]

Just FYI, Massive has downloadable PDFs on their website of their brake kit profiles. Not wanting to get in the middle because I have dealt with Rob through my shop and would like to not burn any bridges I don't have to but I felt I should mention it.

[emi325i]

Rob, on page 1 of this infamous thread you claimed that I mounted or may have mounted the rotor hats backwards.. As it turns out six months later, I returned the product and it was trashed... You failed to mention that earlier.

Rob, they say you catch more bees with honey for a reason. If you had just taken it back without implying (and continuing to imply) that I'm retarded and admitted partial fault, this thread would have looked entirely different, and you would've sold a few more kits.

I'm really sick of this thread. it should be closed. How do I go about doing that?

[Rob@UUC]

Rob, on page 1 of this infamous thread you claimed that I mounted or may have mounted the rotor hats backwards.. As it turns out six months later, I returned the product and it was trashed... You failed to mention that earlier.

Yes. It's called "being a gentleman" and not crying over spilled milk.

Rob, they say you catch more bees with honey for a reason. If you had just taken it back without implying (and continuing to imply) that I'm retarded and admitted partial fault, this thread would have looked entirely different, and you would've sold a few more kits.

Reality time. Re-read my explanation previously. My only fault was in taking it back at all, in hindsight. You get a refund, and you trash the product on this messageboard. I let you return a product that was perfectly good... your wheel vendor changed specs, that should have been your blame all along.

- Rob

[emi325i]

I didn't trash your product. I actually mentioned that it was well put together and had some engineering advantages over Massive's kit.

I criticized the way you falsely advertised and handled the sale. You keep blaming me, the wheel vendor, UPS, then me again.. You were never a gentleman, you are cocky. If you were a gentleman, you wouldn't have falsely advertised the product, and you would've advised all your customers to stick to 16 inch wheels, since you aren't sure what fits.

[Rob@UUC]

We'll ignore those who revise history.

To answer BUDNUNTA's question, "do they fit under 15" Kosei K1 wheels?"

Yes, with a 15mm spacer for comfortable clearance. 12mm may work, but 15mm is advised.

This size spacer is required because the design of the K1 wheel puts an inner-barrel reinforcing rib right at the outer-face corner of the caliper.

Inside of the wheel looks like this, note the rib near the spokes:



Another view of the rib:



With a 15mm spacer, the wheel is moved outwards so the rib clears the caliper. Comfortable space:



Close-up view:



Obviously a huge amount of clearance at the spokes:




I've gotten inquiries about using the forged Superlite caliper as used in other companies' kits. Besides having no advantage in design and actually weighing more, the Superlite, as I have just compared, requires 5mm more spacer to fit. If one were to use an unnecessarily thick rotor, that would make the problem even worse.

Hope that helps!

- Rob

[Fidhle007]

Wouldn't a thicker rotor provide more cooling benefit in race situations though?

[Rob@UUC]

Wouldn't a thicker rotor provide more cooling benefit in race situations though?

Total waste beyond a certain thickness. Thermal capacity is dictated mostly by rotor face thickness, not total width. With ducting (as racecars usually have), the vent pathway of a normalized-width rotor is sufficient and exceeding it is pointless.

- Rob

[Fidhle007]

How wide is optimal then? I've noticed BMW has increased the width of their rotors drastically over the years and they usually seem to have reasons for everything. I could see a 2" being too much rotating mass to make a difference but aren't e36 M3 rotors almost 1.5" thick?