It is possible?: Modified front subframe to run stock E36 oil pan

[nrubenstein]

E36 24v sump right? Once TinyT confirms he can do it for me I will get my hands on one.

Yes.

[Wishno87]

I checked and the standard M50 sump is the same height as the S54 sump. Just as an FYI (because I wasn't 100% sure and didn't want to claim that it was without checking).

E36 24v sump right? Once TinyT confirms he can do it for me I will get my hands on one.

[LJ851]

How about using an unmodified e36 pan and massaging the firewall to allow the engine to move back far enough to clear the rack? Proper suspension geometry, better weight balance, and an OEM oil pan.

[nrubenstein]

I checked and the standard M50 sump is the same height as the S54 sump. Just as an FYI (because I wasn't 100% sure and didn't want to claim that it was without checking).

[Wishno87]

Alright standard E36 it is then. Probably a lot cheaper too then. I will look into the E36 cross brace. Thanks for the info!

PS: I will have your paypal for the clock out today after I visit the bank.

[Wanganstyle]

Right now my sump hangs almost two inches lower than the steering rack disregarding the input spindle area. If I could make the sump and the subframe at the same hight then I would gain quite a bit of ground clearance. Its not super slammed but when I had my car at the hight I wanted with 16s it was hardly drivable but with an M20 it was perfectly fine. For now I have just decided to get taller tires


Wanganstyle: So I would not even need a skid plate of any sort then? I was going to get a cross brace anyway so I thought I could kill two birds with one stone.

So you think If I go this way I should install an S54 sump instead of a E36 sump?

look at posted photograph. s54 or s52 (normal m50 sump) is completely on top of the X brace. you would have to bust through oem x brace or shoot a rock through it to break the pan lol

snoop around the e36m forums. nobody i know has broken an oil pan lol

my e36m was lowered on coilovers and tucking 18"s into the fenders. the one incident of ground item contact happened on a tarmac rally road (2 way 1 lane), I hit a rock with my sway bar. Nothing even touched the oem X brace or X member.

nobody has a skid plate for e36m installed, I have never even heard of such a product lol perhaps for RALLY :D

there is no reason to buy an aftermarket cross brace- the BMW OEM one is about as good quality a cross brace as in existance. Mason make great stuff!!- buy his strut bars and trunk V brace. I had his clutch pedal and braces on my e36m.

e30 directly takes a e36 front X brace- write up is on suspension section of this forum :)

if your e30 is built for racing use, then add the s54 sump. it could save you money in the long run.

if your e30 is a dd/hpde/play toy, then the standard e36 sump is just fine. I did a season worth of events on stock e36m with s52 stock, it had no issues.

Adding a baffle plate to Standard M50/52/s50/s52 E36 rear sump is also a popular modification, many companies sell it.

[Wishno87]

I'm not sure what the point is unless your super super low. My E34 pan on the euro S50 and VAC oil pan baffle have been just fine on track. My oil pressure is pegged the whole time and never drops. I guess more oil capacity would help with cooling, but how much more oil does the E36 pan hold?

Right now my sump hangs almost two inches lower than the steering rack disregarding the input spindle area. If I could make the sump and the subframe at the same hight then I would gain quite a bit of ground clearance. Its not super slammed but when I had my car at the hight I wanted with 16s it was hardly drivable but with an M20 it was perfectly fine. For now I have just decided to get taller tires


Wanganstyle: So I would not even need a skid plate of any sort then? I was going to get a cross brace anyway so I thought I could kill two birds with one stone.

So you think If I go this way I should install an S54 sump instead of a E36 sump?

[Wanganstyle]

^Thanks! This is what I wanted to hear. Building up my M52 wont be in full swing for a couple more months so im willing to wait but Im glad someone sees the opportunity here.

By E36 front X member do you mean the subframe or the factory cross brace? If I can get this rear sump thing to work I would like to get a mason engineering front cross brace and make an integrated skid plate out of it if clearances allow.

e36 crossmember = the item the engine, steering rack mounts on.

why do you need an aftermarket X brace or skid plate for rear sump lol that is silly

a slammed e36m will hit front sway bar first, then hit X brace. rear sump Oil pan is covered by so many things (even s54) that it has minimal; chance of hitting anything, if it hits something you will have totaled your complete car - not only a broken oil pan lol

OEM e36M3 X brace fits on the E30 even with M20 engine lol (this is my e30 eta, M20 engine and g260 never been out of the car. if you look at the M20 rear engine cover brace that bolts to block and bellhousing of transmission, that is where the e36 rear sump oil pan lives.



when the OEM e36M3 x brace is installed in a E36M (with rear sump) the X brace protects the sump!!!

here my old e36m+s54 engine swap+ OEM x brace. Clears everything 100% even with big fat catless s54 euro headers!
this car is also ran e46m header+midpipe (1+2) mated to oem e36m rear muffler.

[Wanganstyle]

~1 more quart for normal e36 pan
~2 more quarts for s54 pan. its the 3 pick up points of s54 pan + ability to run the higher pressure oil pump that is attractive for racing.

[Eric]

I'm not sure what the point is unless your super super low. My E34 pan on the euro S50 and VAC oil pan baffle have been just fine on track. My oil pressure is pegged the whole time and never drops. I guess more oil capacity would help with cooling, but how much more oil does the E36 pan hold?

[Wishno87]

^Thanks! This is what I wanted to hear. Building up my M52 wont be in full swing for a couple more months so im willing to wait but Im glad someone sees the opportunity here.

By E36 front X member do you mean the subframe or the factory cross brace? If I can get this rear sump thing to work I would like to get a mason engineering front cross brace and make an integrated skid plate out of it if clearances allow.

[Wanganstyle]

Read his one year update. Wishno gets shit done.

I think it is doable but I think the people with the skills to do it haven't had the motivation or seen the need to re-address this problem.

It is do-able.

People are working on it.

results will be showcased when stuff is trackworthy, proven.

adding a e36 front x member with its rack is should be ok with some modifying, adding front sway bar mounting ala e36 is ok - BUT the question is how to make it durable / easy to install /idiot proof etc.



currently tiny-t's modified S54 oil pan and X member will directly Plug and play with any M50, M52, s50, 52.

the s54 oil pan is direct pnp to all of these engines.

one should be able to ask him to modify a M50/52/s50/s52 oil pan to clear his X member also, similar work would need to be preformed.


if your goal was to have upgraded oil capacity in a rear sump position - BMW has done this for you already; they designed the GT oil sump/pickup kit back in 1995 to be modular and fit onto racing s50b30's, the sump was OEM for all s52b32 and S54b32.


s54b32 oil pan/pickup/pump is a common upgrade to track going E36's

[Wishno87]

Pretty much an enclosed cross brace right? I like that idea. All E36 24V pans are the same correct?

[nrubenstein]

The S54 pan is around the height of the subframe. IIRC a little above. I'll pull out the non-M pan to compare height and get back.

That said, even if you had to run a plate of some sort, it'd still be way better. AND you could make it structural by connecting to the control arm mounts. Way more interesting than tying the frame rail together in a place that basically doesn't matter.

[Wishno87]

I actually have a message in to him right now (he is TinyT) about a standard E36 pan, but there's no reason why he wouldn't. If anything, it should be easier. The S54 pan has a built in windage tray.

That would be great. Do you happen to know if a E36 pan in an E30 would sit higher than the subframe or pretty close? That would be excellent to be able to eliminate the heavy skid plate all together.