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    M50NV stopped running with no warning

    The M50NV (production date 3/92) in my E30 LeMons racer quit running last weekend in the middle of a race at Sears Point. The engine has been in the car for a few years and thousands of race miles with no problems until now. The car had raced all Saturday and was running great. About an hour into Sunday's racing the car suddenly lost about half its power. I limped around the track and the moment I got into the pits, the car stopped running and never fired again.

    We did some diagnosis in the pits and here's what we came up with:
    • Fuel is getting to the fuel rail - a fuel pressure gauge is plumbed into the hose between the hard line on the chassis and the fuel rail and the pressure was normal.
    • There seems to be spark. We pulled a spark plug, connected the coil to it, and grounded the plug to the strut tower and the plug fired (apparently the coil doesn't need to be grounded?)
    • There are no obvious vacuum/air leaks. We double checked that the big hose that connects to the underside of the intake manifold was connected, as I had a problem with that in the past
    • We swapped on a spare MAF (just plugged it in, didn't connect it to the air inlet hoses) with no change
    • We swapped in a spare DME with no change. Stupid question - does the DME case need to be grounded to work?
    • We checked the crank position sensor based on the specs in the Bentley manual and it tested fine. I don't remember the actual readings we got and I'll likely check them again to be sure, but the sensor is only about 2 years old.
    • We tried to check the cam position sensor, but the Bentley manual doesn't have any specs on it. We found some specs online and determined it was likely bad (again, don't remember what readings we got). I wasn't the person who looked up the cam sensor specs online but I have a feeling we may have been looking at the VANOS version which is a different design IIRC.


    At that point we searched everywhere for a replacement cam position sensor but couldn't find one available in the area (the NV sensor is different than the VANOs version and only fits 1.5 years of production) so we packed it up and went home. I bought a new sensor and installed it yesterday but it still doesn't run. Oddly, I pulled the fuel pump relay to clear the cylinders of fuel (just in case it was flooded) and when I did this, the engine actually did sputter and try to run for a few seconds, but the moment I touched the throttle it died. This happened a couple of times and seems to be repeatable.

    The wiring harness contains the bare minimum number of wires to run (the engine has been in 3 other cars before mine and I basically duplicated how it was in the donor LeMons racer I pulled it from), so the check engine light doesn't work, which I think means I can't do a stomp test to check codes? The car is currently being stored at my mom's house 30 miles away, so I won't have time to do any further diagnostic work right away but wanted to type this out while it was fresh in my mind to get some opinions.

    Is there anything obvious here that I'm overlooking? Where's the best place to start diagnosing the problem based on what I've found so far? Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by LTDScott; 03-30-2015, 06:54 AM.
    The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.

    #2
    Nada?
    The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.

    Comment


      #3
      I was going to suggestion the CPS even if it's reading within the acceptable range. When installing my swap I checked mine and it tested at 505ohm and I believe the functioning range was 500-550. I replace it and fired 2nd try....however I was not getting fuel or spark.
      91 318is M50 swapped
      05 Honda Pilot

      24V swap thread
      http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=302524

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by LTDScott View Post
        The M50NV (production date 3/92) in my E30 LeMons racer quit running last weekend in the middle of a race at Sears Point. The engine has been in the car for a few years and thousands of race miles with no problems until now. The car had raced all Saturday and was running great. About an hour into Sunday's racing the car suddenly lost about half its power. I limped around the track and the moment I got into the pits, the car stopped running and never fired again.

        We did some diagnosis in the pits and here's what we came up with:
        • Fuel is getting to the fuel rail - a fuel pressure gauge is plumbed into the hose between the hard line on the chassis and the fuel rail and the pressure was normal.
        • There seems to be spark. We pulled a spark plug, connected the coil to it, and grounded the plug to the strut tower and the plug fired (apparently the coil doesn't need to be grounded?)
        • There are no obvious vacuum/air leaks. We double checked that the big hose that connects to the underside of the intake manifold was connected, as I had a problem with that in the past
        • We swapped on a spare MAF (just plugged it in, didn't connect it to the air inlet hoses) with no change
        • We swapped in a spare DME with no change. Stupid question - does the DME case need to be grounded to work?
        • We checked the crank position sensor based on the specs in the Bentley manual and it tested fine. I don't remember the actual readings we got and I'll likely check them again to be sure, but the sensor is only about 2 years old.
        • We tried to check the cam position sensor, but the Bentley manual doesn't have any specs on it. We found some specs online and determined it was likely bad (again, don't remember what readings we got). I wasn't the person who looked up the cam sensor specs online but I have a feeling we may have been looking at the VANOS version which is a different design IIRC.


        At that point we searched everywhere for a replacement cam position sensor but couldn't find one available in the area (the NV sensor is different than the VANOs version and only fits 1.5 years of production) so we packed it up and went home. I bought a new sensor and installed it yesterday but it still doesn't run. Oddly, I pulled the fuel pump relay to clear the cylinders of fuel (just in case it was flooded) and when I did this, the engine actually did sputter and try to run for a few seconds, but the moment I touched the throttle it died. This happened a couple of times and seems to be repeatable.

        The wiring harness contains the bare minimum number of wires to run (the engine has been in 3 other cars before mine and I basically duplicated how it was in the donor LeMons racer I pulled it from), so the check engine light doesn't work, which I think means I can't do a stomp test to check codes? The car is currently being stored at my mom's house 30 miles away, so I won't have time to do any further diagnostic work right away but wanted to type this out while it was fresh in my mind to get some opinions.

        Is there anything obvious here that I'm overlooking? Where's the best place to start diagnosing the problem based on what I've found so far? Thanks in advance.
        unplug cam position sensor, it will run with none connected. OBD S52 will also run decent with no cam position sensor connected, no airflow meter connected. just needs crank, water temp

        If you don't have a CEL; its time to wire one. Or find cool friend with BMW diagnostic plug reader; its built into the engine harness
        Last edited by Wanganstyle; 04-14-2015, 12:08 PM.
        OBD1 M54/M52TU swap as a M50b25

        Z4 non powered steering rack fits e30



        Euro e46 2005/6 320d 6mt gearbox into E30 with M20 hardy and beck 1985 327s engine

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Wanganstyle View Post
          unplug cam position sensor, it will run with none connected. OBD S52 will also run decent with no cam position sensor connected, no airflow meter connected. just needs crank, water temp

          If you don't have a CEL; its time to wire one. Or find cool friend with BMW diagnostic plug reader; its built into the engine harness
          It definitely didn't run with the original cam sensor disconnected, or the new one connected, so I guess I can rule that out.

          I'll probably have to do some re-wiring to help with diagnosis. Sadly I just don't have the time to work on this now so the car is going to stay dormant for quite a while.
          The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.

          Comment


            #6
            Did you try firing it on brake cleaner/starter fluid? At least it will let you know if the coils are firing yes/no. If no spark then crank sensor signal is not allowing output from ecu to coilpax. Coils always have power and ground; just trigger grounded when crank signal is processed by functioning ecu

            If anything could be chosen to randomly cause engine to die electronically it would be a crank position sensor
            OBD1 M54/M52TU swap as a M50b25

            Z4 non powered steering rack fits e30



            Euro e46 2005/6 320d 6mt gearbox into E30 with M20 hardy and beck 1985 327s engine

            Comment


              #7
              FYI I never resolved this and posted a continuation thread here:

              https://www.r3vlimited.com/board/sho...d.php?t=425367
              The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.

              Comment

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