OBDI or OBDII price range help

[nes85er]

im doing the m52 swap, and im currently stuck in the OBDI or OBDII decision. What most bimmer dudes are doing nowadays is doing OBDI conversions for the increase power, and im currently leaning towards going that road. Then there is OBDII, i would like to do it just cuz the m52 was originally made with OBDII and not a lot of people have m52 obdII e30s.

but the MAIN reason i cant decide which system to go for is: how much money am i looking to spend between the two systems!!!???
im definitely going to go with whatever system is less expensive! thats for sure.

so if you guys have some input on the price range, it would be great to hear it!

thanks.

[h0lmes]

Well youre gonna save money by going m50 over m52. If you have your heart set on an m52 then the cheaper route would probably be to keep it obdII, however, I have no idea what goes into making an e30 obdII compatible so dont quote me on that.

[Jason89i]

....... cheaper route would probably be to keep it obdII, however, I have no idea what goes into making an e30 obdII compatible so dont quote me on that.

if your not sure or dont have relative experience, dont give advice.

check out the engine management systems. there is a lot of differences between obd1 and 2. ews key rings, dme's need programing - not just a chip, exhaust air pump, blah blah blah.

[FredK]

There is one guy on r3v who put an M52 in his E30 with the OBD-II electronics. He does not have the secondary air pump installed, nor is it an absolute requisite to install it in order for the engine to fire or run properly. It's just an emissions device that likes to crap out on you. :) The OBD-II engines also have four O2 sensors, two of which are absolutely necessary for proper engine feedback, and two downstream units that you can run without (IIRC).

The OBD-I swap is not THAT expensive. I'm thinking you should pick up a donor engine somewhere, like an M50 with higher miles but in good cosmetic shape but with a blown headgasket or something. That way you can take all of the electronics from it. I'd estimate the donor engine costing around $300 (if blown) to $500 (maybe not blown), plus the cost of a DME, around $150. If you try to source each part individually you will end up paying way more.

If you are willing to perform the due diligence in sourcing parts and cross referencing which parts are the same between M50 and M52s, you should be able to pull this swap off. You must also have the financial resources to do the swap. You're looking at around $2500 to do a swap with a M52, and that's being optimistic.

[nes85er]

There is one guy on r3v who put an M52 in his E30 with the OBD-II electronics. He does not have the secondary air pump installed, nor is it an absolute requisite to install it in order for the engine to fire or run properly. It's just an emissions device that likes to crap out on you. :) The OBD-II engines also have four O2 sensors, two of which are absolutely necessary for proper engine feedback, and two downstream units that you can run without (IIRC).

The OBD-I swap is not THAT expensive. I'm thinking you should pick up a donor engine somewhere, like an M50 with higher miles but in good cosmetic shape but with a blown headgasket or something. That way you can take all of the electronics from it. I'd estimate the donor engine costing around $300 (if blown) to $500 (maybe not blown), plus the cost of a DME, around $150. If you try to source each part individually you will end up paying way more.

If you are willing to perform the due diligence in sourcing parts and cross referencing which parts are the same between M50 and M52s, you should be able to pull this swap off. You must also have the financial resources to do the swap. You're looking at around $2500 to do a swap with a M52, and that's being optimistic.

hey thanks for information, very helpful.
Well, i actually have EVERYTHING already dropped in the car so im just faced with the OBDI or OBDII beef. and right now im in about $1000 spent on the swap (ive gotten extremely good deals)
i talked with that one dude that put the m52 OBDII and he gave me some good info also...like, parts that i absolutely need to make the whole OBDII thing happen.
The problem right now has been finding those parts, and i havent gotten prices from the stealership yet(im very scared lol).

So right now i pretty much want to know a close estimate of the amount of cash im going to be spending on the OBDII parts or a whole OBDI conversion. If the money difference is A LOT! then ill be going with the less expensive route, but if i see the prices are not THAT different im going OBDI.

Thanks for the info!!

[Super Eurobeat]

hey guys, what is an OBD?

[h0lmes]

if your not sure or dont have relative experience, dont give advice.

check out the engine management systems. there is a lot of differences between obd1 and 2. ews key rings, dme's need programing - not just a chip, exhaust air pump, blah blah blah.

Think about it for a second, if you have a complete m52 and you drop it into an e30 then all you really need to do is figure out the obdII electronics. If you want obdI then you're going to spend almost a grand buying m50 parts and modifying others. I find it ironic that you call me out but your post contributed nothing to this thread.

[nes85er]

Think about it for a second, if you have a complete m52 and you drop it into an e30 then all you really need to do is figure out the obdII electronics. If you want obdI then you're going to spend almost a grand buying m50 parts and modifying others. I find it ironic that you call me out but your post contributed nothing to this thread.

yeah, guess what, i went for OBDII i JUST ordered the parts.(yeah, cheaper than OBDI).

the parts arrive in 8 days. they only had the antenna ring stock so i got that on hand.

[Jason89i]

..... I find it ironic that you call me out but your post contributed nothing to this thread.

i find it ironic that you gave bad advice on something you no nothing about.

all i am saying is that if you have looked into the electronical systems, dont give advice on something your not familiar with.

Think about it for a second, if you have a complete m52 and you drop it into an e30 then all you really need to do is figure out the obdII electronics. If you want obdI then you're going to spend almost a grand buying m50 parts and modifying others. ........

obd2 IS A LOT OF WORK, has a lot more difficulties, yields less horse power, and is very difficult to modify in the future. unless you have strict emissions or referees to deal with, why would you choose obd2?

as far as cost.....if you piecemeal all the parts, it will cost a lot either way. your best bet.....find a whole m50 and strip it of electronics. (and no its not that easy with the obd2.)

cheers, jason

[FredK]

Converting over to OBD-I need not be an expensive ordeal as Jason and I mentioned. There's probably no difference in the ultimate level of power attainable by either management system, except that the OBD-II intake manifold has very narrow runners, which runs into efficiency problems at high engine speeds.

Nevertheless, the M52 is a powerful engine even stock, and is plenty of reliable, torquey power for almost anyone. A maxed out engine can produce as much as 200 whp, and this includes S52 cams, CAI, M50 manifold, and free flowing exhaust. I believe this is what a bimmerforums member (torquey) did, and he used the stock Shark software ($350). It's pretty much knocking at the doors of a bone stock S50.

Good luck with your project. If you spend enough time, and get a helping hand from someone who's installed the OBD-II electronics into an E30, you can definitely get it to run. 8)

[nes85er]

Converting over to OBD-I need not be an expensive ordeal as Jason and I mentioned. There's probably no difference in the ultimate level of power attainable by either management system, except that the OBD-II intake manifold has very narrow runners, which runs into efficiency problems at high engine speeds.

Nevertheless, the M52 is a powerful engine even stock, and is plenty of reliable, torquey power for almost anyone. A maxed out engine can produce as much as 200 whp, and this includes S52 cams, CAI, M50 manifold, and free flowing exhaust. I believe this is what a bimmerforums member (torquey) did, and he used the stock Shark software ($350). It's pretty much knocking at the doors of a bone stock S50.

Good luck with your project. If you spend enough time, and get a helping hand from someone who's installed the OBD-II electronics into an E30, you can definitely get it to run. 8)

yeah OBDI doesnt have to be THAT expensive, but right now i was looking for the cheapest route since i need to spend money on school as well, and i need to be using that car in a few weeks already :D

but yeah, right now im just waiting to receive the parts (the dealership said about 7 days) they only had the antenna ring on hand, so thats the only thing i have right now.

[Bennetts22@aol.com]

obd 1

I can sell you the stuff you need for obd 1 minus the dme for 225.00

[nes85er]

I can sell you the stuff you need for obd 1 minus the dme for 225.00

where were you man just a few days ago!!!???? I already ordered the OBDII parts.
BUT ill get back to you on that.
what kind of dme was the obdI communicating with?

[jrez]

OBD2 wiring - yup, a bit more involved than powering up an OBD1 harness.

Main items being the EWS2 system, vehicle speed input, and triggering the DME for A/C control. Im still working on the A/C thing. I'll post when its done.

Power output - I always read this on the internet, but I've never seen a comparison between the two(obd1- 2) All I hear is "obd 1 makes way more power than OBD2".
Guys on the e36 boards are posting dyno charts showing around 220-225 whp, with s52 cams, m50 intake, and programming, cold air intake, euro 540 MAF, etc.
If an obd1 m52 is making way more than that, I want to see the dyno chart.

As for obd2 giving problems, name one. I can't, and drive mine daily and on regular 4+ hour trips. ZERO issues with it, as it's all factory(the harness).
So again, who's had what issues? This falls into the "obd1 = more power" category as far as i see it.

My two cents

[Jason89i]

OBD2 wiring - yup, a bit more involved than powering up an OBD1 harness.

Power output - I always read this on the internet, but I've never seen a comparison between the two(obd1- 2) All I hear is "obd 1 makes way more power than OBD2".
Guys on the e36 boards are posting dyno charts showing around 220-225 whp, with s52 cams, m50 intake, and programming, cold air intake, euro 540 MAF, etc.
If an obd1 m52 is making way more than that, I want to see the dyno chart.

i dont know of any obd1 m52's that have dyno charts. sorry.

most people complain about the obd2 intake manifold (good for low torque, but restrictive on high rpm's.)

all i am saying is....... its not cheap or easy to get hp out of an obd2 car. programing isnt as cheap / readily available like a chip.......you still want the obd1 intake.....want a track pipe? better fake the ecu to "think" the rear o2 sensors are working when there not.....the list goes on.

also, for a newbe, the obd1 system is simple. and a lot of people have done it. there's a lot more information out there for him.

As for obd2 giving problems, name one. I can't, and drive mine daily and on regular 4+ hour trips. ZERO issues with it, as it's all factory(the harness).
So again, who's had what issues? This falls into the "obd1 = more power" category as far as i see it.

not trying to start a debate. just trying to help someone (who appears to be a newbee) make an educated decision. it sounds like he wanted easiest / cheapest / quickest route. i still say obd1.

never said it wasnt reliable. ive never owned an obd2 car....so i cannot comment on reliability of obd2. however, i have owned (4) e30 m/s50/2 obd1 cars in the last 4 years. very reliable. ive logged nearly 85k miles on converted cars......street and track. wonderful little packages.

cheers, jason