help me start this m50 (long)

[EtaSport]

Is there more than 1 m50 crank position sensor? The bentley states that there should be a resistance rating of 1280 +/- 10%.

According to mitchell repair manual it should be between 490 and 590. The one that came with the car was 560, but it was mangled horribly and its condition was questionable. We went to the dealer to get a new sensor and this one read 520 ohms.

I also read in the bentley that while cranking the ecu looks only at the CPS for its cylinder identification. There is a brand new sensor there, and I even verified camshaft orientation by removing the valve cover and checking timing marks (Was told the motor had never been opened up, came out of the car running and sat). So, all is well.

Here is what I have verified:
Everything powered by the main relay (red/white) is getting 12 volts, this includes ecu, coils, fuel injectors, maf, fuel pump, etc.

All 6 fuel injectors are putting fuel into the cylinders as all 6 plugs are wet with fuel.

There is spark, I removed a coil pack and attached a spark plug to the end and had a strong arc to the electrode.

The motor cranks fine, and strong, not too slow. There are no intake restrictions, and the motor pulls vacuum through the IAC with the throttle plate closed, just as strong as my m20, so there is compression.

CPS, cam sensor, tps, vanos, iac, are all correctly connected. All fuel injectors are correctly connected and all coil packs are wired in order. Good ground for the coils, and good ground shield/resistor.

ECU was questionable, but VAC motorsports put it in a car and it ran fine. Red lable 413, cant be ews because there is spark and fuel.

There is no o2 sensor connected, and currently there are 1 or 2 errors in the c101/x20 connector. The diagnostic connector isnt working when I plug the code reader in.

When cranking, you can smell the fuel, and the motor pops violently, and will shoot flames out of the manifolds and this is all it does. Obviously this means the ignition event is not occuring at the right time, if there is a flame from the exhaust then there is combustion with open exhaust valves.

How could it be out of time? What would cause it to not fire when it's supposed to? You cant put the toothed sensor wheel on wrong can you?

The car has not run yet, but I was able to pull codes for all 6 fuel injectors (with the x20 connector wired a different way), but I checked the injector function with info from a diagnosis procedure for the code that was flashed, grounding the injector at the ecu plug revealed perfect operation. Even swapped 6 known good injectors in. My only next steps were to wire the c101/x20 connector correctly, then verify once more all sensors are plugged in correctly, then plug an o2 sensor up.

[permit]

You might (not sure how this would happen since you have an OBD-I motor), but you might have the wrong crank-toothed-wheel-thing (say, from an OBD-II car). I believe there's a hole that matches up with a small bump to assure it goes on correctly, so I doubt you have it on wrong. Make sure you motor wasn't pieced together at a junkyard with random stuff...because then they might have given you the OBD-II one.

[EtaSport]

So there is an obd2 wheel for the front crank? You should know since you had an obd2 motor. I had actually thought of this because I believe the guy he [my friend, its his car] got the motor from, used all the intake/harness equip. for an obd1 swap, and the guy who sold the motor was unable to verify that the wheel had been changed.

I read in the bentley that obd2 takes readings from the back of the crank, but maybe there are just two versions? This would explain a lot.

[permit]

There are two versions--if you compared the OBD-I/II next to each other, you'd see the TDC mark are different distances apart from the large gap on the wheel.

[EtaSport]

I'll have him look into getting another wheel, or at least finding one to compare it to.

[Jason89i]

There are two versions--if you compared the OBD-I/II next to each other, you'd see the TDC mark are different distances apart from the large gap on the wheel.

that is really new to me. ive worked on a few obd conversions and have never seen the "other" timing wheel. i have seen obd2 motors without any timing wheel, but never a different timing wheel. (obd2 gets its crank timing signal from the rear. there is no use for the front timing wheel.)

Is there more than 1 m50 crank position sensor? The bentley states that there should be a resistance rating of 1280 +/- 10%.
.

bentley is wrong. 540 ohms is what your looking for.

My only next steps were to wire the c101/x20 connector correctly, then verify once more all sensors are plugged in correctly, then plug an o2 sensor up.

i would recommend fixing all your known problems before going any further.

When cranking, you can smell the fuel, and the motor pops violently, and will shoot flames out of the manifolds and this is all it does. Obviously this means the ignition event is not occuring at the right time, if there is a flame from the exhaust then there is combustion with open exhaust valves.

How could it be out of time? What would cause it to not fire when it's supposed to? You cant put the toothed sensor wheel on wrong can you?

.

yes, i would agree with your diagnosis. it sounds like the timing is off. pull the timing wheel. there is an alignment sleve for one of the bolt holes, so the timing wheel can only go on one way.....but, if the sleve is gone, it can be put on incorrectly (ive heard of some real doozies.)

align the TDC marks on the alignment wheel (you will need a mirror to see the alignemnt marks if the thermostat housing is still on), pull plug #1 and see if you are even close to tdc.

also check the that the main crank bolt is tight. i did have a main crank bolt come loose, sheering the key, allowing the timing wheel to be misaligned. highly doubt thats the problem, but it is a possibility.

also double check the HFM is going in the right direction. the big arrow shows direction of air flow.

cheers, jason

[permit]

that is really new to me. ive worked on a few obd conversions and have never seen the "other" timing wheel. i have seen obd2 motors without any timing wheel, but never a different timing wheel. (obd2 gets its crank timing signal from the rear. there is no use for the front timing wheel.)

The same thing happened to me during my OBD-II --> OBD-I swap, so I do know that they are different. That's why everything works properly, just not at the right times.

[PeaveyBassist]

If you have fuel and/or spark it can't be the crank sensor. Without the crank sensor it would do neither. Like they all said... check the timing wheel.

Will