S52 vs. Aluminum M52 with M3 cams

[m3_eater]

Hi all,

I searched this forum and other forums, google, etc. - and still did not find the info I was looking for.

Could someone please compare/contrast an otherwise stock but OBD-1 converted S52 to an aluminum block 2.8 M52 that has M3 cams (also OBD-1) when swapped into a 1991 E30 318is? Assume everything else equal, i.e. both with 3.5 euro hfm, custom exhaust, etc. What are the advantages and disadvantages of each? I've found a lot of discussion on the various engine choices for swaps, but none comparing these two options.

Thanks!

[amdspitfire]

nothing will beat the displacement of the s52.

[matt]

nothing will beat the displacement of the s52.

Turbos are nice too.

[SchnellerVert]

Alu blocks don't like FI.

[m3_eater]

Not really what I'm getting at. Sure, it's more HP and torque for an S52 - but I'm talking the whole picture: weight (and associated handling penalty), cost of parts, ease of finding parts, reliability, gas mileage, etc.

I want to buy/build a daily driver with great handling and reliability. Normally aspirated only. An M52 with M3 cams, euro hfm, and software (Turner, etc) looks to be about 270HP. An S52 with the same/similar mods, maybe 300HP. Is it worth the extra money? What about torque curve - does the S52 provide much more grunt from the displacement without having to rev so much? What else am I missing?

[amdspitfire]

Not really what I'm getting at. Sure, it's more HP and torque for an S52 - but I'm talking the whole picture: weight (and associated handling penalty), cost of parts, ease of finding parts, reliability, gas mileage, etc.

I want to buy/build a daily driver with great handling and reliability. Normally aspirated only. An M52 with M3 cams, euro hfm, and software (Turner, etc) looks to be about 270HP. An S52 with the same/similar mods, maybe 300HP. Is it worth the extra money? What about torque curve - does the S52 provide much more grunt from the displacement without having to rev so much? What else am I missing?

The weight savings is very minimal with the m52. Parts are all about the same for both engines other than the initial cost being ~1k less on the s52. Mileage will be slightly better with m52 but thats the cost of ~30hp less.

m52 with those mods will get you about 220rwhp, s52 will yield you closer to 250.

If you want an NA beast drop in a v8 or stick to the s52.

[Jason89i]

Not really what I'm getting at. Sure, it's more HP and torque for an S52 - but I'm talking the whole picture: weight (and associated handling penalty), cost of parts, ease of finding parts, reliability, gas mileage, etc.

the only difference is weight vs. torque. only you can answer "the whole picture." weight vs. torque is an ongoing debate. it comes down to a personal preference. just look at what the s14 guys say about the conversion.

i've had a "few" swapped cars. ive probabily logged nearly 100k miles in the last 5 years on swapped cars. only problems: (2) alternators, a starter, temp plug failure and some bolts coming loose.

here is a weight comparison of swapped cars......

http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=90486&highlight=weight

i can say that removing the a/c is very noticable in the swapped cars. but i never did weigh the black car that had a/c operational.

re: cost....they are all obd1 conversions....the cost difference is the motor. however, try finding a good alum m52. non-overheated ones are VERY tough to find....and cost more than an s52.

cheers, jason

[2002maniac]

The weight savings is very minimal with the m52. Parts are all about the same for both engines other than the initial cost being ~1k less on the s52. Mileage will be slightly better with m52 but thats the cost of ~30hp less.

you must have missed the part about the aluminum block

[BeirBrennerE30]

you cant beat the s52.... well unless you get an s54 or s62. But sticking with the m50 family the s52 your best bet. get a cf hood and delete ac and you save more weight then you would with the al-m52

[kylebes1]

Iron block all the way. The alloy blocks will bite you. If they get in the least be over heated (ie. hard day at the track) the head warps, pulls the threads out of the block and you are fucked hard all around.

Iron block s52 OBD1 is only bested by an Euro s50b32.

[madjurgen]

OBDI/II only applies to US motors.

[SchnellerVert]

Yeah they have EU I and EU II

[Jason89i]

Euro s50b32 with OBD1.

ha ha, now thats a good internet rumor to spread....... the engine management is a "little" more sophisticated than obd1 or 2. the m50tu has a single vanos with 8 degrees on / off switch. the euro s50b32 has DUAL vanos with seamless adjustability for up to +40 degrees on each cam. engine management controls advance and retard on each cam based on rpm, throttle position, blah blah blah.

back to the topic..... its all up to personal preference and purpose. what is the car going to be used for? whats your budget?

cheers, jason

[matt]

ha ha, now thats a good internet rumor to spread....... the engine management is a "little" more sophisticated than obd1 or 2. the m50tu has a single vanos with 8 degrees on / off switch. the euro s50b32 has DUAL vanos with seamless adjustability for up to +40 degrees on each cam. engine management controls advance and retard on each cam based on rpm, throttle position, blah blah blah.

back to the topic..... its all up to personal preference and purpose. what is the car going to be used for? whats your budget?

cheers, jason

8 degrees is not always a constant.

But yeah, euro motors have nothing to do with their US counterparts.

[kylebes1]

sorry i'm dumb