High Compression S52

[gobuffs]

Euro s50b32's dont put down that much more power stock, than a USs50/s52 with cams, bolt ons and exhaust. Either way, unless you want to mod a euro motor, you will have similar end results. And the nice part of US motors is that so many parts are shared with the m50's, so they are cheap and plentiful.

OP, are you stuck on the NA, or would you be willing to run SC?

A S50B32 will put down about 275 RWHP with STOCK reliability.

[MIKe30]

Euro s50b32's dont put down that much more power stock, than a USs50/s52 with cams, bolt ons and exhaust. Either way, unless you want to mod a euro motor, you will have similar end results. And the nice part of US motors is that so many parts are shared with the m50's, so they are cheap and plentiful.

OP, are you stuck on the NA, or would you be willing to run SC?

I'm pretty stuck on n/a. I'd rather stay away from any kind of boost. I know the arguement can be made that boosted motors (at least i've seen a million threads, articles, etc pro-turbo) can be more reliable - but i believe that is only with REAL F'IN GOOD and, more often than not, extensive tuning.

Sure more compression will be good for more power... but it doesn't perform miracles. Only engine builders (and crooked dyno operators) can do that.

Think of it this way (M20B25 vs M50B25TU)... Going from 8.8:1 to 10.5:1 is only good for about 40whp (in conjunction with a TON of other changes to increase mass flow and optimize engine management) so would you expect a similar compression bump to yield another 40whp on an already tuned up S52 with no other changes except tuning?

Again, sorry if I sound like I'm trying to discourage you, because I think you're on the right track. I just don't want you to be disappointed when you don't make 300whp.

No, don't take my rebutals (sp?) or questions the wrong way - I APPRECIATE HONESTY, and almost more importantly correct answers. You seem to be one of the more knowlegeable (again, sp?) forum users and I am always interested in your thoughts on my questions.

I don't expect it to perfrom miracles and and I don't expect 300whp. That is s54 territory. I understand I'm not interested in dumping $10k into a serious high compression set-up, but if i can raise the compression a little bit along the way of what I already have to do, then why not?? It's not like I have a completely good motor ready to drop in, it's going to need some machining at the very minimum. Hopefully it doesnt need anything else and any other work performed will be by choice ;)

Like I said i don't expect a 300whp monster motor, but if i did raise the compression or slightly bore it out, I would most certainly expect at least more than the run of the mill cam'd s52.

Isnt the rule of thumb 10rwtq/1.0pt bump in compression all other things equal? Doesnt seem worth it on a street motor.

Not sure bud, somebody here should know

A S50B32 will put down about 275 RWHP with STOCK reliability.

Even stock parts break.

[gobuffs]

Even stock parts break.

sure they do, but stressed parts break faster. IMO (and my opinion only), and taking your words saying you want to use pump gas, you don't want to go any higher than stock compression. Bumping compression puts you over 11.5 most likely. The S52 is showing itself as being very hard on HGs. But in the end it is your money, do as you wish (the risk/reward just ins't there for me as far as increasing the compression most likely).

There are proven formulas out there and not one bumps compression that I am aware of. The IP front runners are putting out 270 RWHP.

[MIKe30]

sure they do, but stressed parts break faster. IMO (and my opinion only), and taking your words saying you want to use pump gas, you don't want to go any higher than stock compression. Bumping compression puts you over 11.5 most likely. The S52 is showing itself as being very hard on HGs. But in the end it is your money, do as you wish (the risk/reward just ins't there for me as far as increasing the compression most likely).

There are proven formulas out there and not one bumps compression that I am aware of. The IP front runners are putting out 270 RWHP.

I dont think any increase in compression will result in 11.5 or greater. I believe you can achieve any compression you want using different combinations of block decking, head milling, custom HG's, pistons, etc.

I'm NOT bent on upping the compression. I would definately like to. I'm looking at it as just a bonus. If (and HOPEFULLY) I don't need new pistons and can get away with just a hone, I would keep my pistons and just get what i need (just rings i think). BUT, if it's going to be at the machine shop and I can bump my comp by decking the block or milling the head a little bit - even just 11.1:1 - why not? I can only imagine it would result in some noticeable gains, albeit nothing dramatic.

paging pierced30!

[e30polak]

Might as well do ITBs while your at it!

If I would build a custom stroker s52 with ITBs, but I'm not...

An obd1 s52 with sunbelt cams, 24# injectors, 3.5" hfm, ltw flywheel, pullies, headers, head work, and tuning will yield around 270whp. That is plenty in an e30, especially if you run more aggressive gearing. If you get bored of all this, a stage 1 or 2 s/c kit is plenty reliable, or even a 75 shot of NOS.

Otherwise do what I wish I would've: m50 nv turbo/ supercharged m52 :-D

[PiercedE30]

Yea, I wouldn't go much over 11.5:1 if you don't have access to 93 octane. If you are worried about head gaskets, get another block and bore it to 85.5mm or 86mm. You'll lose a little bit of displacement, but not enough to really affect anything. Cams are going to play a HUGE role in your power output. Bigger valves won't really do much since you will lose a little bit of air intake velocity, but it will flow a little better on the top end. If you want the best flowing exhaust, get a set of Kromer Kraft headers. From what I have read, they make all of their power before the collector, as long as the rest of the system isn't restrictive. Get a set of Sunbelts and CUSTOM tuning and you will be making some serious power.

[matt]

There are proven formulas out there and not one bumps compression that I am aware of. The IP front runners are putting out 270 RWHP.

The IP front runners are definitely not running stock compression.

[madjurgen]

Are you implying there's cheating going on in CR :shock:

[matt]

You're allowed to deck the block and head.

[gobuffs]

You're allowed to deck the block and head.

the rules allow you to deck the head and block for trueness only...any decking shouldn't affect compression that much.

[rThor432]

Are you implying there's cheating going on in CR :shock:

Haha. No no no.. that never happens.

[Stu]

"I know he's cheating because I'm cheating and he's beating me!" -Club Racer

[matt]

I'm sure some people are cheating. I am not accusing anyone, and I don't have any specific knowledge of any cheating.

Of course, the best way to cheat in club racing is, and will probably always be, to drive faster than everyone else.

[MIKe30]

Yea, I wouldn't go much over 11.5:1 if you don't have access to 93 octane. If you are worried about head gaskets, get another block and bore it to 85.5mm or 86mm. You'll lose a little bit of displacement, but not enough to really affect anything. Cams are going to play a HUGE role in your power output. Bigger valves won't really do much since you will lose a little bit of air intake velocity, but it will flow a little better on the top end. If you want the best flowing exhaust, get a set of Kromer Kraft headers. From what I have read, they make all of their power before the collector, as long as the rest of the system isn't restrictive. Get a set of Sunbelts and CUSTOM tuning and you will be making some serious power.

there's 93 almost everywhere here in pa (well, at least eastern pa)


I need to find a shop in the area that is A) able to do the tuning and B) good at it.

[PiercedE30]

Have you thought about ICS? Are you even close to them? I know they are up in that area.