Painting Woes Whats goin on?

[colt325e]

We've tried painting my hood several times: Sealing, Primer Filling, and then Final paint and it Bubbles up and orange peels like no other. (did this about 3 times). We decided to start all over and Used air craft stripper to get right down to the metal, and did the same thing over. Same Result. In some spots it looks really good and then in other its just bubbly crap. Whats up?
Thanks

[Jordan]

The paints you are using are incompatible.

Duh.

Have someone that knows what they are doing (not you) do it.

[royalflush313]

Re: Painting Woes Whats goin on?

We've tried painting my hood several times: Sealing, Primer Filling, and then Final paint and it Bubbles up and orange peels like no other. (did this about 3 times). We decided to start all over and Used air craft stripper to get right down to the metal, and did the same thing over. Same Result. In some spots it looks really good and then in other its just bubbly crap. Whats up?
Thanks

what kinda primer and paint are you using? Like Jordan said, the paint is imcompatible, just like trying to super glue an epoxied surface, some things don't like each other.

[colt325e]

Have someone that knows what they are doing (not you) do it.

I didn't match the paint up with everything else, it was the people at a local paint shop, thanks.

[royalflush313]

Have someone that knows what they are doing (not you) do it.

I didn't match the paint up with everything else, it was the people at a local paint shop, thanks.

then maybe the paint shop guys gave you the wrong paint, or they made a mistake. Because sounds like you are prepping the surface well.

Reason orange peel happens is mostly because of insufficiently prepped surface and/or bad paint combination.

For example, spraying lacquer paint overtop of a polyurethane enamel coat would not work., however the opposite would work just fine.

When you buy your top coat, it should say somewhere on the can what type of primer should be used with it.

[sweetride01]

While the others I would think are definately right, make sure that where you are painting it is not too humid.

[808BMW]

Are your orange peel spots shaped like handprints? :P

I vote paint.

[colt325e]

Thanks for the feedback, we actually set up an air tight space with a (i forget which size) unit sucking out all possible dust and leftover stuff in the air and spraying it. I'll take in a piece tommorow and have them look at it.
thanks

[Madhatter]

When you prepped the surface, did you take the panels back to bare metal ? what ratio thinners are you using, speckled paint that lays like powder usually means it is too thick and isnt bonding to the primer. If it is instantly bubbling have you used a decent wash solution to remove all oil, dirt and grease from the surface? How much time are you leaving between passes (ie between coats)?

Edit: Ahhh, back to metal, two things i think you have done wrong.

1. Stripper like that is an alkali (caustic), you have to neutralise it when finished. generally it is as simple was washing well with water. If there is any stripper left anywhere on the surface nothing is going to bond to it. Get yourself a decent cleaner, wax, dirt, grease, etc, paint places will sell it.

2. When going to bare metal ordinary primer or primer filler isnt going to cut it, neither will bond to the metal, it will instantly peel when hardening. You need an etch primer for the first coat, it is designed to react with the metal so that it bonds to the surface. Once you have put down the etch primer (just one coat is all you need) and it has just gone off you want to put down a fresh coat of your normal primer right away. Once you are done you can pretty much paint anytime you want. If you have imperfections to fill in you can do so now, just dont sand back past the etch primer layer to the metal, you will have to spray more etch primer down if you do.

Edit: Some of you guys are real pricks when it comes to giving out advice, reguardless of how newbish the question is, or if someone has fucked up, if you have something to add you could atleast tell them where they went wrong instead of just a simple 3 line reply. Ridiculing people is pathetic, you come across as such a smart arse most of the time jordan, no wonder this place has a bad name, your standard comment is to treat someone like a child. Who cares if he fucked it the first time, or even the 10th time, if someone pointed him in the right direction he would be able to get it right, it is a simple mistake to make. That is the whole point of asking for help, not only finding the problem but being directed in how to solve it.

FYI, the paints are fine, the same problem occurs when stripped to bare metal, it wouldnt make any difference if it was an acrylic or an enamel, the problem lies in the prep work of the initial surface. Even if you spray something like an enamel over an acrylic it isnt going to craize and bubble back past the primer. The paint shop probably didnt anticipate someone going back to bare metal, most people dont bother.

[BlackE30]

Edit: Some of you guys are real pricks when it comes to giving out advice, reguardless of how newbish the question is, or if someone has fucked up, if you have something to add you could atleast tell them where they went wrong instead of just a simple 3 line reply. Ridiculing people is pathetic, you come across as such a smart arse most of the time jordan, no wonder this place has a bad name, your standard comment is to treat someone like a child. Who cares if he fucked it the first time, or even the 10th time, if someone pointed him in the right direction he would be able to get it right, it is a simple mistake to make. That is the whole point of asking for help, not only finding the problem but being directed in how to solve it.

:up:

[BMW BMXER]

I sprayed automotive paint on cheap generic primer once and it lifted the paint right off. Sucked.

Madhatter seems to have good suggestions.

[e30Matt]

Funny how two of the youngest members on the board are already taking a stand against Jordan. :)

[royalflush313]

Madhatter, good info, but you didn't really provide anything new. The thread could've stopped right after when Jordan said that the paint is probably imcompatible. (now im being self-contradictory )

nways, if you read the initial post, he suggest that he tried the painting process without going to bare metal, and the problem was happening. If the surface was not properly cleaned, best result will not come about - however it would not go as far as "bubbles up and orange peel like no other".
It's almost defenetely the paint imcompatibility.

FYI, the paints are fine, the same problem occurs when stripped to bare metal, it wouldnt make any difference if it was an acrylic or an enamel, the problem lies in the prep work of the initial surface. Even if you spray something like an enamel over an acrylic it isnt going to craize and bubble back past the primer. The paint shop probably didnt anticipate someone going back to bare metal, most people dont bother.

paint in itself are fine. But two paints of opposing interests are not fine together.

[Madhatter]

No it couldnt have, it has nothing to do with the paint and everything to do with the primer.

nways, if you read the initial post, he suggest that he tried the painting process without going to bare metal, and the problem was happening. If the surface was not properly cleaned, best result will not come about - however it would not go as far as "bubbles up and orange peel like no other".
It's almost defenetely the paint imcompatibility.

Not true at all, if there was even a hint of any contaminant on the surface it will lift clean off like he said. Oil and other distilate substances are the worst, even wax from people who polish their vehicles will cause it (even after you have sanded the surface you still push it around the bodywork). If you even bothered to understand my reply you will see i questioned the ratio of thinners to paint, too little and it will go down like powder, too much and it wont cure. I also asked about prep work on the surface to make sure it was clean first. Especially in cases like this where you are spraying over existing paint you really have to use a good cleaner to make sure there is nothing left on it, some of the cheap solvent based ones leave a residue behind which will mess everything up again.

Let me ask you a question, how can the paint be incompatible when pretty much all primer is identical reguardless if you are laying an enamel or an acrylic? You are starting with a new surface of primer, you arent spraying right on top of existing paint. I would put my money on it being a contaminant when spraying over the old coat, and then when stripped to bare metal an etch primer wasnt used. There is no problem at all in spraying an acrylic over an enamel surface, the paint has nothing to do with it, it is all in the primer. If you dont layer it correctly, it wont bond when it cures and it will seperate along with anything you sprayed above it.

Funny how two of the youngest members on the board are already taking a stand against Jordan

Im on other forums he frequents and it is the same thing all the time, i was a member here once before but i lost my free email account and i cant retrieve my password.

[Jordan]

Madhatter:

With all respect to you that you feel is due.. you are wrong.

The base coat paint he is using is not compatible with the primer he layed down. End of story. Very common place when you don't know what you are buying.

Colt325e:

Go back to the shop where you bought that shit and explain to them what the issue is. Make them correct the problem out of THIER pocket.