How can I improve my semi-custom setup?

[nomsg]

I'm running a Nakamichi CD-400 HU with rewired lines to stock speakers ('Premium' factory 6 speakers).

Actually sound quality is decent so I was wondering how much improvement I would get with component fronts, an amp (4-channel?) and subwoofer? Also, what are your opinions for:

- components: Focals or A/D/S?
- amp: Nakamichi or A/D/S? (Already ran a pre-amp RCA line to the trunk)
- subwoofer: ???

TIA.

[smonkbmw]

dunno what kind of ear you have but focals are almost brutally bright, like mb quarts. i havent heard ads. i prefer diamond audio. same for the amp. eclipse for the sub is pretty tough.

[KenC]

a/d/s/ products are really nice. the older stuff before they were bought out by directed is really top notch quality.

[Kruzen]

I run A/D/S 345cs components up front powered by a 600.4 PPI amp and then two 10" dual's powered by a 800x2 dual amp and honestly it sounds impeccable, people can knock my cheap sub all they want but my system sounds fantastic to the ear of anyone thats been in my car

[StereoInstaller1]

how much improvement I would get

What kind of imrovement might be a better question. The E30 I worked on yesterday showed a big improvment when I changed his antenna...

Do you find you often turn the treble up? Want a little more highs? Try removing your stock premium tweet, taking the tweet out of the sail panel and remove the thin layer of felt that lives over the tweeter (between the tweet and the sail panel) then re-assemble. I assure you that you will be amazed at the difference in the high end.

You could also pull off the wire mesh that covers the tweet, but you will likely replace the tweet someday, anyway.

Another big difference is to replace the passive crossovers with a better design, using better parts. The front crossovers are way worse than the speaker...which is why if anyone ever had the nuts to use an Alpine "Bass Engine Pro" deck in "TriAmp" mode, they would be absolutely shocked. Tri-amping means no passive crossovers, so no loss of signal purity between the amp and the speaker...but the amp has to be crossed over before the amp, electronically.

Luke

[nomsg]

Thanks gentlemen. I hadn't realize that about the Focals and most reviews I found on A/D/S are also positive, even the newer stuff.

What kind of imrovement might be a better question.

Good point... I guess my original question was - would the improvements justify putting $600-800 or so more into my current setup? What are your opinions as an audiophile (something I'm not).

That said, I am looking for a bit more bass (not thumping). Sounds like I should try subs in the trunk first, which means using a 2-ch amp? I assume replacing the passive crossover wouldn't give me more bass?

As you can tell, I have limited knowledge on this stuff.

Thanks again.

[StereoInstaller1]

OK, so a more defined approach, with a bit more education.

In a cabin the size of an E30, considering the miserable placement and accoustics, 4) 5 1/4" speakers really don't do a whole bunch for bass.

When I recommend someone starting a system in their car, I like to see people get the minimum required to make their ears happy.

If I were you, I would do a small 4 channel amp. I would run 2 channels to a single 10" sub and the other 2 channels to a pair of seperates in front. The stock fronts are actually quite good...add power first.

The main reason for adding a sub is not so much getting big fat boom, but instead, taking the strain of attempting to make bass off of the front speakers, which cannot make bass anyway.

If you should decide that the small 4 channel is inadequate, you could easily change to using the 4 channel for the mids and highs, then add a dedicated sub amp...so you won't replace anything, simply add more.

There are so many decent amps out there these days, most of which are made in China or Taiwan. Don't shy away from that, though...all of the American giants have theirs made in China anyway, but with a "Product of the USA" sticker on them. Read between the lines carefully!

Luke

[nomsg]

If I were you, I would do a small 4 channel amp. I would run 2 channels to a single 10" sub and the other 2 channels to a pair of seperates in front. The stock fronts are actually quite good...add power first.

Thanks Luke... what do you think of this JL pair - 10W3v3 sub & 300/4 amp?

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_subs.php?series_id=24

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_amps.php?amp_id=254

Or would the 10W1v2-4 sub and A4300 amp be sufficient?

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_subs.php?series_id=15

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_amps.php?amp_id=402

With more power, do I need to worry about blowing out the stock fronts?

Tom.

P.S. Has anyone ever told you that your sig is mesmerizing and disturbing at the same time!?!

[StereoInstaller1]

P.S. Has anyone ever told you that your sig is mesmerizing and disturbing at the same time!?!

Disturbing? Yes. Mesmerizing? Yes. Same time? No.

Hahaha.

Anyway, personally, I am not a big fan of JL. It isn't the gear, it is just fine. It is the company...they are one of the few left that enforce quarterly minimums, that actually send spies to check up on your pricing...just a bunch of pirates. The "/" stuff is great, but the other stuff is the same chinese stuff that everyone else sells...so why pay JL prices?

I personally have taken "v2" woofers out, replaced them with Infinty "Reference" woofers and was amazed by how much better the bass sounded. Infinity is another chinese crap brand...how come they outperform the JL? Izzit because they are whores? YES! (you bitches better have mah money!) I remain unimpressed with JL.

If I were gonna spend BIG bucks, I would look at Milbert, Butler, Steg.

Less than HUGE money, Arc is my favorite, followed closely by Brax. Arc is the new Zapco...just the shit. There is nothing like the old school Orion/PPi stuff anywhere today. No real Amurrican made HP.

M Class Memphis is about the best sounding chinese stuff I know. Massive is really nice too, as is Exile. None of the above sound as good as the Arc stuff, but 2/3rds the price.

Stock speakers? Shoot man..feed them a 35WX4 amp for the front, a 35WX2 for the rear and add a single 10" sub powered by 350 RMS watts, carefully set up.

They can handle a ton of power if they are fed right. Sounding damn fine, too.

The trick is in the crossover. I would do those 3 amps from a AudioControl 6XS, but with all junk amps and be thrilled. Ask James C...he heard my car on shit-hole Kicker "Impulse" and Sherwood amps!

I will take a $100 WalMart deck fed into a $400 6XS over ANY $1000 deck, any day. Even if using $50 amps from WalMart! (OK, maybe not quite that far...but $69 amps would be OK!)

Luke

[smonkbmw]

ok captain kream nothing to say about my Diamond Audio suggestion?

[StereoInstaller1]

ok captain kream nothing to say about my Diamond Audio suggestion?

I told you before...Resident President, not Kaptain Kream!

Diamond is good shit too. I just don't like paying top dollar for chinese made stuff. AFAIK, all Diamond is Chinese, except the TDX woofers.

Luke

[smonkbmw]

i didnt know that. interesting, they front as being us made.

[nomsg]

Ok... master Luke, I found an ARC 10D4 and JL 250/1... how is that for starters? I believe that mono amp should be sufficient? For the fronts, the HU is already pumping 47Wx4 (no RMS rating) so I'll leave them for now except maybe to run them (and sub) across a 6XS as you suggested.

Tom.

[StereoInstaller1]

Ok... master Luke, I found an ARC 10D4 and JL 250/1... how is that for starters? I believe that mono amp should be sufficient? For the fronts, the HU is already pumping 47Wx4 (no RMS rating) so I'll leave them for now except maybe to run them (and sub) across a 6XS as you suggested.

Tom.

OK, great start. Gonna build your own box? A decent table saw is really all you need. I use an air stapler, because no matter how carefully you pre-drill, you will split MDF with screws. Use a top quality "yellow" wood glue, spread evenly and thinly across the entire mating surface of each piece of wood.

Fine choices in product, but the 6XS is only gonna be necessary after you amplify your mids and highs. It will do just about nothing in this phase of your system.

i didnt know that. interesting, they front as being us made.

http://www.diamondaudio.com/company/index.cfm?page=facilities

Shows their 65,000 sq.ft transducer manufacturing facility in Guangzhou
170,000 sq. ft turnkey assembly facility in ShenZhen, both quite certainly in China.

Diamond pisses me off because they act like their shit don't stink.

I have had more noise issues with their amps than any other. Well, anything except Kicker.

I have had dozens of woofer failures from dumb shit, like too short of tinsel leads. Tons of roasted coils too, but that is idiot salesmen. Don't sell Diamond to boomers! (duh)

I also do not like the fact that their woofers require more power to play a decent volume than most. I don't like seeing 82db/1W/1M on anything.

Just ranting. Don't get me wrong, they make great shit, just not the amazing end-all, be-all shit they seem to portray.

/rant

Luke

[smonkbmw]

roger that (sorry to the OP for being so OT). but can you reccomend anything else that sounds remotely close to the HEX series diamond components with the silk tweeters? everything ive ever heard is way to harsh to me.