Chattering noise from head after a track day

[cabriodster87]

anyone know a definate or at least probable cause for on at EXACTLY 2krpm-ish.

ive heard it on "good" m20's. wrote it off as normal.

After my last oil change /valve adjustment mine was doing the "smooth until 2k then rattle like hell". (for example, a derelict shopping cart wheel that is having a seizure.) lol I thought maybe i had miss adjusted the valves due to worn eccentrics.

Took the cover off and all the valves were set to .014!, and every thing was blazing hot, so let it set overnight and came back to recheck and they were all where i had set them at a very tight .010 some might say its a loose .009. My observation: Condition only occurs at operating temp. No foreign material in oil

Yesterday was a top down 50 deg day and i heard it rattling coming in my driveway, so that's it i've had it. First thing is a belt and tensioner inspection while i wait on a set of valve eccentrics. I will warm it up on the ramps and listen to the dummy distributor and oil pan for clues. I will find out what is causing this "Illness" if its the last thing i do.

Thank you, Nevets


EDIT: This makes sense because i went tight this last adjustment and never had this problem before:http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/show...8&postcount=22
so it wont do it when cold, and i thought the valves were excessively hot when i pulled the cover.

EDIT: Readjusted valves cold .010, they were all at around .009 like i thought. A test drive produced no 2k valve chatter, what a difference, not as much power but quiet valves are welcome. YaY

[5Toes]

Mine just started doing this too. I have been babying it, keeping it under 3000 revs. But only 30 miles on it

[7pilot]

To me , a light tapping within a small range of engine speed, says...Spun rod bearing.

m

[Gruelius]

nah no oil cooler. i had a blown out oil pressure sender for a while.

[jlevie]

Are you running the stock oil cooler? Seems some people "upgrade" to a larger oil cooler for track use and end up with low oil pressure. Kaboom.

Unless you do something wrong, an upgrade of the oil cooler will have no affect of oil pressure.

[priapism]

Are you running the stock oil cooler? Seems some people "upgrade" to a larger oil cooler for track use and end up with low oil pressure. Kaboom.

[Gruelius]

anyone know a definate or at least probable cause for on at EXACTLY 2krpm-ish.

ive heard it on "good" m20's. wrote it off as normal.

[Ceeker]

I have found the inherent issue with M20s is rocker arm adjustment neglect, coupled with the natural sound of fuel injectors. it can make an awful racket if not done correctly or at all. Can make the car run like shit and can over shadow other noises such a loose bearings.
If you're gonna take the motor out, and spend 300 on another used engine. Why not take that 300.00 and put it towards parts to rebuild yours properly. This way you'll have assurance it was done, and done correctly without anymore surprises. I mean if you've been through 2 motors already, another job will be 3. That is a lot of work and down time. might as well take it out, and have a spare in case. You can do a partial rebuild on the cheap. just check tolerances and gap to make sure they aren't excessive. I had excessive bearing lash on my 318is so rather then pull the motor, my buddy dropped the oil pan and pulled the main bearings from underneath and replaced them. all in a few hours work.

[jlevie]

lol, that poor guy. I think he'll probably have something to share eventually. I mean, he's been through 3-4 motors now?

It is more than that, but to be fair at least two and probably three of Ranger's motor swaps weren't because of anything he did. And another was from a severe overheat in a winter enduro race when the engine lost all coolant. Because of the cold air flowing over the tstat housing, the temp gauges never budged. The best preventative for that sort of failure is to monitor cooling system pressure with a 3-4psi pressure switch and turn on a warning light on loss of pressure.

The latest in Ranger's engine is a week spent at Metric Mechanic building another engine. The MM folks allowed him and another Spec E30 racer to participate (and learn) during the engine builds. That was pretty righteous of MM.

Junk yard engines, even sub 150k mile ones, are a roll of the dice unless you can hear the engine run, check the oil pressure. and get good compression and leak down results. I have three sitting in my garage right now. All of the engines had less than 100k on them. One engine has low oil pressure, another has poor leak down numbers, and one was good enough to use in a Spec E30. Granted I didn't pay much for those engines, but there was a good bit of labor involved in getting them and installing them in the car only to find out they weren't usable. For a track or race car it would have to be an emergency for me to run a used engine now. A properly rebuilt engine is the way to go.

[JGood]

ive got the same symptoms, at exactly ~2k i get a ticking noise, regardless of wot or full vac engine running or not. cars been going fine for 5k kms tho, hasnt been getting worse, my mates 325i mtech 2 with low k's does it too. are you sure its not just valvetrain noise amplified due to oscilations or someshit? i had a really loud tick when my exh gasket was blown out, i think it may have happened again too.

Not sure, I swapped in a 99k mile m20 with a crank scraper and called it a day.

I got a stethoscope and narrowed the noise down to the bottom end. Has to be a bearing or the oil pump. Blowing the motor at a track day = $200 track day + $300+ tow home + $300 engine = $800+. Not worth the hassle IMO.

[ldsbeaker]

I think mine's been doing that for about 3-5k miles. I parked it.
I'm not really into trying to control a car that suddenly has a holey block.
New engine going in.

I'll be sure to check for play at the bearings and try to document/video results.

[Gruelius]

ive got the same symptoms, at exactly ~2k i get a ticking noise, regardless of wot or full vac engine running or not. cars been going fine for 5k kms tho, hasnt been getting worse, my mates 325i mtech 2 with low k's does it too. are you sure its not just valvetrain noise amplified due to oscilations or someshit? i had a really loud tick when my exh gasket was blown out, i think it may have happened again too.

[Dave]

lol, that poor guy. I think he'll probably have something to share eventually. I mean, he's been through 3-4 motors now?

anyone interested in a new glyco main bearing set? standard size, for later M20 blocks. Been sitting in my garage for 5 years now..

I think he is closer to 6 or 8.

[nando]

That is probably the higher percentage play. You can go over to the SpecE30 site and see what things people have done - scrapers and the Paul Poore oil pan seem to be the things that work. Even on old junkyard motors.

Whatever you do, if you go to the SpecE30 website looking for advice on oil issues, do NOT listen to anything by Ranger.

lol, that poor guy. I think he'll probably have something to share eventually. I mean, he's been through 3-4 motors now?

anyone interested in a new glyco main bearing set? standard size, for later M20 blocks. Been sitting in my garage for 5 years now..

[Dave]

That is probably the higher percentage play. You can go over to the SpecE30 site and see what things people have done - scrapers and the Paul Poore oil pan seem to be the things that work. Even on old junkyard motors.

Whatever you do, if you go to the SpecE30 website looking for advice on oil issues, do NOT listen to anything by Ranger.