Doing clutch, need to remove starter?

[Earendil]

I can't find a definitive answer, and my shit don't match any of the pictures/diagrams

So, I'm pulling the transmission. I have everything removed and am down to just the transmission. I was following the Pelican parts article on the subject, which says to pull the starter off.

Pelican wasn't detailed on how one should do this so I looked up what the Bentley says about it, and Bentley doesn't say anything about needing to pull the starter.

From the pictures, I've made the following assumptions:

1. The starter is held on by the same bolts that hold the transmission to the engine, that is the only reason that they need to be removed.

2. I only have a single bolt holding my starter to the transmission/engine, either by design or because there is a bolt missing :curse:. This picture shows two, but I can NOT find the top right one for the starter. The bottom left one is easy. The RealOEM diagram only shows one bolt though, and it's in the location that I can find mine.

My other point of confusion is all this talk of having either a bolt and nut for the starter, or a "threaded starter" with only a bolt and no nut. In feeling/looking at mine, I appear to have neither. I have a nut on the starter side, but there is NOTHING on the transmission side. Do some transmissions have a stud coming out of it that slides through the engine and then the starter slides onto? I don't know if that's the least bit descriptive...

In the end though, I suppose I just want to know how to get my transmission off without @#$%ing up my starter, and I can't find anything written that describes this with something that matches what I'm looking at.

Bonus: My car is a 325i but with an ancient Getrag 260 out of one of the first 325e. Real OEM shows these as having the same starter, but it also shows a different setup than Pelican and the Bentley.

Bonus 2: I gotta get this right, because once I start there is little room for on-the-fly correction... I'm dropping the transmission solo

[bimmerteck]

The starter is normally held on by 2 etorx bolts(like used on the transmission) and occasionally a bracket behind the starter bolted to the block, although I've seen many that have not had the bracket reinstalled after their first starter replacement. I use a rachet, 36" 3/8 extension, and the proper etorx bit to remove the starter. If there isn't enough room to get the extension in above the transmission unbolt the transmission cross member and lift the front of the motor. If you starter isn't threaded you'll want a 2nd set of hands in the engine bay to hold a wrench on the backside of the starter. (those hands can also help guiding the extension/socket onto the correct bolts since you can't really see them from under the car.)

[Earendil]

The starter is normally held on by 2 etorx bolts(like used on the transmission) and occasionally a bracket behind the starter bolted to the block, although I've seen many that have not had the bracket reinstalled after their first starter replacement. I use a rachet, 36" 3/8 extension, and the proper etorx bit to remove the starter. If there isn't enough room to get the extension in above the transmission unbolt the transmission cross member and lift the front of the motor. If you starter isn't threaded you'll want a 2nd set of hands in the engine bay to hold a wrench on the backside of the starter. (those hands can also help guiding the extension/socket onto the correct bolts since you can't really see them from under the car.)

So, does the starter need to be removed (taken out of the engine compartment) in order to remove the transmission? Or is just unbolting it from the transmission enough?
i.e. if it's still attached by the bracket, can I leave it attached to the bracket and thus leave the starter in the same relative position to the block?

In looking at pictures of the Getrag 260, it doesn't look like the starter has anything to do with the transmission as removed from the engine.

[bimmerteck]

I usually leave it laying on the block with a bungee wrapped around it to keep it from pulling on the wiring. Unhook the battery during your clutch job as well, b/c those large gauge wires going to the starter are hot (with 12v+) and can do some damage in a hurry if grounded!

Removed from bay- NO

Unbolted from trans and block-YES

[Farbin Kaiber]

Sounds like you are posting on a forum about one bolt.


I think the masses will say pull the damn bolt, wiggle that starter out, and yank that damn trans. It couldn't add anymore time to a clutch job than repeatedly pressing f5 ITT.

[Earendil]

Sounds like you are posting on a forum about one bolt.

And the discontinuity between What I'm seeing, DIY articles, and the Bentley.

I think the masses will say pull the damn bolt, wiggle that starter out, and yank that damn trans. It couldn't add anymore time to a clutch job than repeatedly pressing f5 ITT.

Sure it could, especially if I bust something. I'm as much doing things without breaking stuff, as I am about doing them quickly. Not to mention doing them right
And as I said, I'm likely dropping this solo. The one thing I won't be able to say is "shit, hold this while I unhook/bolt/wiggle that". I'm also currently at work. I'm not sitting in front of my car with a laptop waiting for a response so I can continue

But thanks for your advice.

[Earendil]

I usually leave it laying on the block with a bungee wrapped around it to keep it from pulling on the wiring. Unhook the battery during your clutch job as well, b/c those large gauge wires going to the starter are hot (with 12v+) and can do some damage in a hurry if grounded!

Removed from bay- NO

Unbolted from trans and block-YES

Thanks for the response. Out of curiosity was your starter "threaded", or did you have to use two wrenches to remove yours?

I'm still rather puzzled by having a nut on the starter side, and nothing on the transmission side. Hopefully it'll all make sense what I "yank" the transmission out and little pieces of metal start raining down :)

[Farbin Kaiber]

If you think you might "bust" something while doing a clutch depending on removing the starter, you are WAY over-analyzing the job.

[Earendil]

If you think you might "bust" something while doing a clutch depending on removing the starter, you are WAY over-analyzing the job.

Likely, I've been accused of such things before. I'm an engineer :)

[bimmerteck]

The starter on my m50's is threaded. Out of the probably 60 or so I've done, I would say 2/3 or so were threaded by this point, as were all the replacement's I ordered through my parts supplier. I did occasionally run into one that stuck on the alignment dowel but cleaning the dowel on the trans with a piece of scotch bright while it's out and a applying a dab of anti-seize fixed those right up. Once I encountered an alignment dowel that had somehow been bent by a shadetree and ended up having to enlarge the alignment hole in the starter by about 2/64 with a drill bit so it would fit over the damaged dowel.

While you can technically do the job with one person, the second set of hands would be well worth buying a friend lunch and a six pack of brew.

[Farbin Kaiber]

Likely, I've been accused of such things before. I'm an engineer :)

Ok, totally understood now. I was just saying that from the viewpoint of "if it is a maintenance item, or wear item, chances are, it's removal isn't going to cause ANY catastrophic failure, or safety concern". Best of luck with your clutch job.

[Earendil]

The final answer is that my Starter does use 2 bolts and 2 nuts, however one bolt and one nut were completely absent from the car :hitler:

So, mystery solved, and everything came down okay... I think. We'll know when I put it back together this coming weekend :)