Ford, GM, or BMW V8 swap?

[jalopi]

From what I've read the SBF is the lightest (with aluminum heads. without it's 20-30lbs heavier than the LS)

All three swaps have to deal with the stupid brake booster problem and the issue with the drivers' side header hitting the steering shaft. So far, only the M6X and LS swaps have buyable drivers' side headers to clear the steering shaft... wrapping the exhaust around the front of the engine is not fun.

Cost wise would be: LS(by a decent margin)>Ford>M6X

Documentation of the LS is probably almost as good as the M6X now, so that's not a big concern.

Really depends on what you want to do with the car and if you're willing to take the necessary precautions to keep the LS from getting oil starved.

[jalopi]

So fun facts of the day/early morning:





Couldn't find any scale pictures for the m60 or the 302, but found a few numbers that matched other sources:

This guy says the m60 he weighed was about 385lbs. So.. what, 460 with the trans?

http://bmwv8capri.yolasite.com/m60-v8-specs.php

This dude says the 302 weighs about 379lbs (with aluminum heads) and I'm guessing (based off of how much I strained myself lifting the tranny) the T5 is about 80lbs. So 460ish.

http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?40,1890280

Now, it looks like vorshlag left the AC compressor and some other random shit on the LS1, so we'll lop 50lbs off of their figure and go with 550 or so. What people forget about the LS1 is even though the block is lightweight aluminum, the t56 is heavy as fuck. (also I'd say the LS block is pretty beefy, adding on weight) The numbers I've found for the t56 range from 125-145#s, which is acceptable for the amount of power they can put up with... but the weight savings of the aluminum block pretty much get thrown out the window due to the weight of the tranny. Granted, the weight is more centered so you're really not gonna throw the balance off too bad... but then again, with the other two engines you're pretty much rocking an m20 sans A/C stuff and a fiberglass hood or something.

Regardless of all this, I'd still go with a "LS" 5.3L truck engine - they're significantly cheaper than their 5.7L counterparts and the extra savings can be put towards valvetrain upgrades, a cam and fuel upgrades. With a supporting intake and exhaust, that setup is apparently good for something around 400 wheel. The cool thing is that you can buy pretty much all the swap parts for the LS now for a reasonable price, something that wasn't available when I started my v8 swap.

[The Dark Side of Will]

From what I've read the SBF is the lightest (with aluminum heads. without it's 20-30lbs heavier than the LS)

I have a hard time buying that the iron block/aluminum head Ford would be lighter than an aluminum/aluminum LS.

[e30_302]

The SBF block is tiny. A dressed LS1 w/o trans is a little over 400#.

[eurotrash]

Bingo sbf is a baby v8

[nrubenstein]

So fun facts of the day/early morning:





Couldn't find any scale pictures for the m60 or the 302, but found a few numbers that matched other sources:

This guy says the m60 he weighed was about 385lbs. So.. what, 460 with the trans?

http://bmwv8capri.yolasite.com/m60-v8-specs.php

This dude says the 302 weighs about 379lbs (with aluminum heads) and I'm guessing (based off of how much I strained myself lifting the tranny) the T5 is about 80lbs. So 460ish.

http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?40,1890280

Now, it looks like vorshlag left the AC compressor and some other random shit on the LS1, so we'll lop 50lbs off of their figure and go with 550 or so. What people forget about the LS1 is even though the block is lightweight aluminum, the t56 is heavy as fuck. (also I'd say the LS block is pretty beefy, adding on weight) The numbers I've found for the t56 range from 125-145#s, which is acceptable for the amount of power they can put up with... but the weight savings of the aluminum block pretty much get thrown out the window due to the weight of the tranny. Granted, the weight is more centered so you're really not gonna throw the balance off too bad... but then again, with the other two engines you're pretty much rocking an m20 sans A/C stuff and a fiberglass hood or something.

Regardless of all this, I'd still go with a "LS" 5.3L truck engine - they're significantly cheaper than their 5.7L counterparts and the extra savings can be put towards valvetrain upgrades, a cam and fuel upgrades. With a supporting intake and exhaust, that setup is apparently good for something around 400 wheel. The cool thing is that you can buy pretty much all the swap parts for the LS now for a reasonable price, something that wasn't available when I started my v8 swap.

Minor quibble: I'll bet the M20 still had the exhaust manifolds on, and that SBC didn't. That's a not insignificant weight spread.

[Bearmw]

Thanks for the info. What are the preferred ways to handle the booster issue? Are people still going boosterless? What is the preferred way to handle the header clearance on these?

[eurotrash]

Personally i had a stock manual setup with an adp plate on the sbf car. Now ive got a garagistic boxsetup so i can bolt in a wilwood pedal setup so nothing has to be customized to make everything work and i can match the proper master sizes. I think its prob the most expensive route but its also the cleanest. 5 series remote booster setup lets you retain the booster but you also have a bunch of work getting everything mounted and a big cluster behind the headlight. I preferred the harder pedal after i got used to it with the manual. Which setup you wanna go with just depends on your preferance for ease of pedal travel and cleanliness of install . I think this is also an issue that is pretty much the same across the board with all the swaps.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Minor quibble: I'll bet the M20 still had the exhaust manifolds on, and that SBC didn't. That's a not insignificant weight spread.

And mount arms, heater hoses... but yeah, small differences.

Also, the M20B27 came with the Getrag 265 which on the order of 20# heavier than the 260. (Although the back half of that transmission is so dirty it's hard to tell which one it is from the photo... it does have the early style crank sensors low on the left, which I *think* means 265)

[Earendil]

Minor quibble: I'll bet the M20 still had the exhaust manifolds on, and that SBC didn't. That's a not insignificant weight spread.

Based on the exhaust manifold gasket being visible in the picture, I'd place a large amount of money on your being right. For the record, I just ran downstairs and weighed my stock manifolds. They came in at 14 pounds 4 oz sans nuts and one stud.

The motor mount and bracket are also on the M20.

[LJ851]

And mount arms, heater hoses... but yeah, small differences.

Also, the M20B27 came with the Getrag 265 which on the order of 20# heavier than the 260. (Although the back half of that transmission is so dirty it's hard to tell which one it is from the photo... it does have the early style crank sensors low on the left, which I *think* means 265)

Only in an '82 M20 5 series....

All e30 had 260.

[IronFreak]

I think it all goes back to what Kaliboy said......why are you doing it. I was so close....I mean test fitting my motor and everything from putting an LS in my car....but I want track times. I was so afraid of what the balance of the car would be when I was done. I've dumped so much money and time into the suspension and chassis I folded.....Sold all the LS stuff. I now and back on board with a more fitting Bavarian setup that will keep the amazing balance these cars have.


That being said, if you need any LS advice.....I'm your man.

[DJP215]

Im going LS strictly for the huge amount of hp / reliability I am getting on such a tight budget.

[henryki]

A dodge 392 would be a monster in an E30. I was a porter at a dodge store and took out an srt8 challenger. Holy balls that thing is fast. Murcia.

[The Dark Side of Will]

I think it all goes back to what Kaliboy said......why are you doing it. I was so close....I mean test fitting my motor and everything from putting an LS in my car....but I want track times. I was so afraid of what the balance of the car would be when I was done. I've dumped so much money and time into the suspension and chassis I folded.....Sold all the LS stuff. I now and back on board with a more fitting Bavarian setup that will keep the amazing balance these cars have.


That being said, if you need any LS advice.....I'm your man.

What are you swapping in? M60?
I didn't think the M60 was any lighter than an aluminum LS... and the M60 carries its weight higher in the body than an LS, thanks to gigantic cylinder heads.