Requesting Help on M20 Starter Wiring ("i" style to earlier "Eta" style)

[Ray McCooney]

I found myself traversing a flooded street here in Los Angeles a week ago after a heavy rainstorm. Half way down this street, of which had a greater depth to it than I had originally suspected, the engine on my car dies. This was immediately followed by a small cloud of white smoke coming from the portion of the engine closest to the windshield. I attempted to start the car, to which I was only rewarded with a smell that is reminiscent of the smell you encounter when an electric motor burns out. I figured the starter blew, so I had the vehicle towed home and I immediately purchased a brand new (reman.) starter. The starter I purchased is for 86 and older Eta's and my Eta is an August 87 production model. I thought little of compatibility issues as I had remembered that a few people here on the website had said that the Starters are interchangeable on the M20. Apparently the starter that I had on my motor was the same as an "i" starter, of which had three threaded posts for mounting the wires to. The new unit that i picked up only has two threaded posts (one of which is only for the field-winding strap) to mount to and I find myself a bit unsure as to where I should place the extra smaller gauge wire.

Some pic.'s of my situation:




As you can see I mounted the alternator cable and battery cable to one post, arranged in the same fashion as I had removed them. I believe the field winding strap was already attached to the solenoid, so my concern is the small gauge cable and where to mount it. In the pictures provided you can see that I mounted it directly onto the stater itself (upper left). I am not sure if this will work as my vehicle will still not turn over. The battery in my vehicle is fine (all lights still come on), I can smell fuel from around the intake manifold. I just assumed it was a wiring issue as when I turn the ignition to the first position I hear a click and then when I try to start the engine or turn it to the on position nothing at all happens.

I would truly appreciate any help or insight that can be offered. Thanks.

[e30Matt]

There HAS to be a third location for that small wire (the solenoid energize wire) to attach to -- unless the starter is designed for an externally mounted solenoid, which it SHOULDN'T be. Look on there for possibly a small blade type connection, as that may be the difference.

Without that wire connected the starter isn't getting 12V from the ignition switch to close the solenoid, hence your no-start condition.

[Ray McCooney]

There HAS to be a third location for that small wire (the solenoid energize wire) to attach to -- unless the starter is designed for an externally mounted solenoid, which it SHOULDN'T be. Look on there for possibly a small blade type connection, as that may be the difference.

Without that wire connected the starter isn't getting 12V from the ignition switch to close the solenoid, hence your no-start condition.

That is exactly what I had thought initially. However there is not another threaded post to attach to as there had been on my blown out starter, all there is (which is visible in Picture 1) is a small metal lead above the two threaded posts. I tried placing the smaller gauge wire on this lead originally before locking it down onto the starter itself. When I did such, the car would make a buzzing sound that seemed to be emanating from the underside of the car in the rear. When I moved the wire to the position it is currently in (on the starter itself) the buzzing sound is no longer made. If I place the smaller gauge wire on this lead there does not appear to be a way to lock it down or in place. Any suggestions?

[e30Matt]

Edit: Nevermind, totally missed that the pictures up there are the new starter already on the car.

If you can, get some help and probe that wire and make sure it only has 12V at the start position of the ignition switch.

[whowhatwhere]

What is that little blade connection for?

[Ray McCooney]

Edit: Nevermind, totally missed that the pictures up there are the new starter already on the car.

If you can, get some help and probe that wire and make sure it only has 12V at the start position of the ignition switch.

Correct. The new starter has already been installed, it's just that small cable that is the "kink" in the system. I'll have to see if I can pick a voltmeter and see what the numbers are. Thanks.

Anyone else encountered this problem when going backwards with respect to M20 Starter designs?

[Ray McCooney]

What is that little blade connection for?

That is what I am perplexed by. The remaining small gauge cable has a circular connection correlating to it connecting over a threaded rod. I don't see how the blade will relate with the small gauge cable.

[DaveSmed]

The starters are interchangeable as in they will fit and start the car. Your car has one particular style of connector, while the car the starter was built for has a different one. Your options are to modify the wire and make it work, or take the starter back and get a refund.

[Jordan]

The ring terminal you have grounded out is the 12+ to engage the solenoid. Cut the end off and crimp a blade terminal on and put it where it belongs.

[Ray McCooney]

The starters are interchangeable as in they will fit and start the car. Your car has one particular style of connector, while the car the starter was built for has a different one. Your options are to modify the wire and make it work, or take the starter back and get a refund.

You are certainly correct. I pretty much figured this out after install and at 3 in the morning, twas a lovely night/morning. Thanks for the insight.

[Ray McCooney]

The ring terminal you have grounded out is the 12+ to engage the solenoid. Cut the end off and crimp a blade terminal on and put it where it belongs.

Good man. I knew that the location that I had initially placed the smaller gauge cable looked incorrect from the get go, at 3 in the morning you tend to care less. I will have to explore this terminal modification that you have suggested. Thank you sir.