Another rear subframe thread.

[FredK]

Bump this up, I just reinstalled my subframe with newly installed stock rubber bushings.

The bushings dropped out of the bushing carriers around 1/4". Doesn't the metal flange need to be flush with the bottom of the bushing carrier? It sort of dropped out when I started tightening the 22mm nut to the bushing mounting post.

Any ideas?

[xLibelle]

you forgot the washer?

...digging up my emails with patrick and IE

[xLibelle]

like this but 1/4" ? if so, then you need to order 33 33 1 127 496 called a stopper.
it sits above where the "C" is in the picture.

[FredK]

Thanks for the picture xLibelle. I removed the washer from the old bushings and I put them on the new bushings.

Anyway there is a gap just like the arrow shows in your picture. I don't understand why it should be any different, because I'm using Febi subframe bushings.

[xLibelle]

you need to take them back off the car and do some measuring.
measure the cup depth and see if that is even close to the cylinder that will go inside it. my guess is, its too long.

[FredK]

I pulled the subframe and the aluminum cylinder was around the same height as the bore it's supposed to fit in, especially with the thick washer.

The only thing I can think of is that the bushing was installed with some soapy water, and by putting the jackstands on the subframe, forced the subframe to ride up on the bushings before the soapy water dried up.

I pulled the bushings back into their bores so that there is no protruding material and the flange was butted against the bottom of the subframe. I then reinstalled the subframe. Pure joy. At least this time I dropped it really quickly and reinstalled it quickly.

I'm going to let the bushings settle overnight, and hopefully they won't budge when I set the car back down again. Otherwise I'll just drive my car off a cliff. :mrgreen:

[Mike325]

There seems to be a metal cylinder still inside my subframe. There are also two little "leadge" type things at the bottom of my subframe bushing holw that looks like it is connected to the cylinder in the subframe. I pulled the bushings out and it was all rubber. Do the bushings have a metal outer skin over the rubber?

[xLibelle]

yes. i believe there is a metal cylinder

fred, when the car sits on its own feet, the springs will actually hold the subframe down, away from the car and result in a correct look. this should be a regular position for the subframe, but i havent been able to figure out what body/suspension motion or drive torque that will manipulate the subframe mount points in a vertical fashion.

IE bushings tend to be the same, but not as bad as you describe. since these are two-piece, they tend to seperate under force(jackstand under subframe). i got a little picky and had some discusion about design size with IE. to which i learned, if you dont like it, make it your self.

soapy water or not, they will move if given the room. otherwise its a design factor. but really, since the weight of the car at the wheels, combined with the oposite direction of the springs, the subframe is forced towards the ground so they might be fine anyway.

[FredK]

Thanks for the explanation!

Initially when I removed the old bushing, one of the bushings was situated with a gap, and the other sat flush with the bottom of the subframe. Oh well.

Mike, the bushing hole should look like this (picture from Simon S's writeup):



You might have the remnants of the bushing sleeve still in the subframe. That would look like this:



Check out page 3 of this thread for more pics courtesy of Simon S.

http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=49944&page=3&highlight=subframe+bushing

[Mike325]

Ah, ok, so the feet things and everything are not supposed to be there. Any tips on getting them out? I love you FredK.

[FredK]

Sure, just heat the exterior of the bushing housing with a propane torch for a short while. Stick a prybar underneath the bushing's lower flange, bracing the prybar against the subframe beam. Pry up, and the metal piece should come free.

I guess you could also try using a sawzall or body saw and cut the bushing so you can collapse it, but it's pretty fast using a torch too.

[BUDNUNTA]

Heres a pic of a complete Bushing(used,came out in one peice)
For reference


Hunter

[Mike325]

Thanks. I still have a metal cylinder in my subframe that is the exact shape as the bushing. Your bshings don't have the metal around them. This is why I am confuesed as to if these come out or not. It really looks like it does though.

[xLibelle]

its supposed to come out. i dont know what hunter has pictured.
as fred suggested, i used a sawzall and collapsed the cylinder and pushed it out

[Nick325is]

I had a shop press what was left of that metal cylinder out of the subframe as well as do the diff mount and my rear wheel bearings for 150.

Fred,
I am very interested to hear about your issue with your subframe when you raise/lower the car. I installed the powerflex race subframe bushings and when I place the subframe on jackstands it actually moves vertically alittle. When the car is placed back on the ground everything returns to normal. Everything was assembled correctly so the only thing I can assume is that the 2 piece bushing seperates alittle when the car is raised.


-Nick