Another Ground Control C.O question

[dlmrun2002]

After cutting down stock spring perches and leaving enough of the weld to hold the G.C. coilovers, do I need to weld this metal piece for the coilover to sit on that came with the kit? Thanks..
DLM

[2002maniac]

no, the weld will hold it just fine.

[dlmrun2002]

thanx bro...

[e30vert]

If you are not going to use the metal rings let me know and I may be interested in buying them from you. I may cut my strut tubes so I may need them.

[dlmrun2002]

will do....don't think I'm gonna use them since I have the struts,co's all assembled..

[e30vert]

PM me when you decide.

[Vedubin01]

I welded mine in and used the stock weld as the base for the welding. That way I would not have any issues.

I had an issue with the adjustable camber plates from GC. Are you using them? If not no biggie, if so Ill have a write up going up soon and the great customer service I got from Jay at GC to fix the problem.

Issue,



the fix!

[e30vert]

More Ground Control Questions

Very interested to see what the issue was and I have a few questions about the Ground Control Coil Over install.

1988 325 vert
Currently running :

H and R sport Springs (vert specific rating)
Bilstein Sport struts/shocks
Ground Control Rear Shock Mounts
Stock strut mounts up front


Would like some more adjustability so I just picked up a set of

Ground Control Coilovers
Eibach Springs -
Plan on reusing the Bilstein Sport struts/shocks for now - May go Koni SA top adjust in future

Q1: Where is a decent deal on the Koni SA's?
Q2: Since one cannot get to the top of the rear shocks in a vert how can you adjust the damping on the rear shocks and what model to go with?

Q3: With my set of Coilovers there were these 2 little sleeve /spacers *see first picture - that were included that appear to slide into the Ground Control Camber plates. My assumption is these can be used if one has a different diameter front struts shaft and should be used to take up any slop that would be present if the diameter of the shaft is smaller than that of the standard camber plate sphereical bushing. Am I correct and if so do these sleeve spacers go in at the top or the bottom of the camber plates when assembling?


Thanks for the info in advance.

Also, I have 450 and 650 rates for the springs.

Looks like some pretty bad cracks there. I will be using the Ground Control Camber plates as well. Do I need to contact Jay in advance to use the soultion that he provided for you before mine end up looking like that?

[Vedubin01]

hey,

I have been trying to get some picture of the final outcome but my card reader is acting up and not working.

The problem I had was the following. In the instructions listed by Ground Control they give you the option to cut the strut tower to give you full adjustment. With out doing this will not give you full adjustment on the camber plates. They give you a pattern to cut from. See picture of the sharpie marks and my cuts are inside. I aligned my car with factory bmw specs or as close as one could get. This is where the problem sits. The plates are meant to run a more aggressive negative camber. Me I wanted the option to adjust later if needed but chose a more stock setting. With this it puts stress in a area not reinforced by the strut tower. See pic1 above on right side of plate. Being aluminum and not steel, it lead to cracks in the material and not a bend. Total failure would have lead the strut to push through and into the hood of the car. Causing total failure of the suspension. (side effected)

I contacted Jay though the GC website and asked him if they had, had this problem in the past. The answer was no. They worked that day with me to come up with a solution to correct this. Hence the backing and top plate shown in Pic2. This is designed like their E36 style setup. Reinforcing the top and bottom of the camber plate. They made and sent this to me free of charge and next day air. Jay at GC was super helpful and as fast as I could email him he was emailing back. AMAZING customer service by GC in my book.

The only issue is the top plate sould be cut a bit to allow full adjustment. Something that a dremel could do in a matter of minutes. This is the picture I can not extract from my camera at this time. Now I am running a more aggressive camber and will have it to the alignment shop in the following days due to a failure in my steering rack! SUCKS!


You ask about adjustment on the Koni yellows. In my rears I do not have top adjustment. The collar of the strut rotates to tighten or loosen the dampener. Adjustment can be made by jacking up the car and turning the strut collar.


The pieces that you speak of is the spacers that drop down the strut tube to allow proper fitments of the shock and collar of the spring perch. I thought this was odd myself but it works well. I have not had any problems with them. The strut tube is longer to the shorter shocks used in the front of the shock tubes.

Any questions feel free to ask. Not an expert by no means but enjoy my setup every day I drive.

The setup I run is the 440-750lb springs....

[e30vert]

I would like to be as close to stock alignment as well and wonder if I should order the plates from Jay? Do the spacers need to be used in all cases? I think that I may not cut my strut tubes and reweld them unless there is a real added benefit besides being able to drop the car on the ground?

Do the spacers go on top or on the bottom of the camber plates? I have no instructions so I need to know stuff like this. I also did not get any bump stops so I think I may order them and cut them in half so I have less of a bump stop , but so I still have them.

Thanks for the reply.

[Vedubin01]

I would like to be as close to stock alignment as well and wonder if I should order the plates from Jay? Do the spacers need to be used in all cases? I think that I may not cut my strut tubes and reweld them unless there is a real added benefit besides being able to drop the car on the ground?

Do the spacers go on top or on the bottom of the camber plates? I have no instructions so I need to know stuff like this. I also did not get any bump stops so I think I may order them and cut them in half so I have less of a bump stop , but so I still have them.

Thanks for the reply.

the plates should be added if you cut the STRUT TOWER, not the tubes. If you do not cut the tower then you will not need to add the extra backing as pictured above. According to Ground Control themselves. The spacers in your picture are used if you do not cut your strut "tubes" They go in the bottom of the strut tube before your strut goes in. Then build from there.



Below is the email I got from Jay explaining this..... then followed by the follow up letter...


Letter 1 from GC

We are going far beyond just a replacement, which I hinted at earlier. If
you bolt in the new camber plate as-is, I am concerned that it eventually
will fail too. Look at the attached pic.

What has happened is that the strut tower has been cut (racing style) more
than it needs to be, and when the dealer aligned it (NON racing style), it
left the back edge of the plate unsupported. therefore it was allowed to
flex and therefore fail. This is the downside of the high strength
aluminum alloys is that they eventually crack later instead of bending
earlier.

I am making you a stainless steel reinforcement (based on our e36 part)
that will support the plate where the sheet metal was cut too far, as well
as a new girdle that will support from underneath. Adding these new parts
to both sides, in addition to having the car aligned to a more radical
spec than was intended for a housewife from New Jersey, will prevent this
from ever happening again.

I have already got our machinist and myself working on these parts and I
expect them to leave tomorrow NEXT DAY air so that you will have them on
Wednesday. You can install these and align the car yourself by the way.

Jay




Letter 2



Hi Neil,

I was saying the strut TOWER was cut, not the strut tube. That is done
when you slide the camber plate back for more positive caster. It is not
necessary or desirable unless you are adding more caster, and in the case
where you are going to have close-to-stock alignment, I would not
recommend cutting the strut towers.

So, whats done is done and the directions specifically say "Trimming is
not required for any car" , HOWEVER, I think you should align the car to a
more aggressive spec anyways. It makes the car drive MUCH better (M3!),
and has practically no effect on tire wear, even on the highway. I would
say 99% of our customers trim the strut tower to allow the strut to slide
back like an M3.

If you had gone ahead and added more caster (slid the plate backwards)
than the plate would be supported and I am sure it would have been OK
forever. When you do go ahead and reinstall the parts, you will want to
add caster (this makes it like an M3 which is what everybody wants to do).

Don't worry about this, when you get the new parts you will have a setup
with no worries, and I hope I convince you to try the more aggressive
alignment to see what you've been missing.

Realistically it will be a good thing the the strut towers were cut
because I think once you drive with the car aligned like I am
recommending, you will not wanna go back.