Looking at LTW5 and Ecsta XS. Sanity check?

[Earendil]

Ladies and Gentlemen, I'm in the slow process of turning my E30 into a dedicated track rat now that I have a new daily driver.

I'm looking to switch what's left of the stock setup to something that will be solid on a track, and do so within reason and sanity. I know that the biggest thing holding me back is my own skill, but that is being taken care of separately :)

My car currently has 14" basketweaves, and every year I go to buy tires I'm more disappointed at my options for rubber. Now that I have no reason to drive my E30 on anything but sunny days, I'm looking at higher performance rubber. But it's darn near impossible to find high performance rubber in 14".

So in looking at wheels that will serve the track rat duty, a little autox, and fun summer days, I'm seeing pretty good things said about the D-Force LTW5. At just over 13lbs it seems reasonably lightweight, and at $105, the price looks reasonable as well.

However, most of the talk about this wheel is dated 2008. What are the 2011 opinions of this wheel? Do people think it will serve my purpose?

Assuming a 15" wheel, the talk around here appears to primarily revolve around three tires:
Dunlop Star Spec Z1
Kumho Ecsta XS
Hankook Ventus R-S3

The Hankook only comes in a 225/45, which from what I read might be overkill wide, and the height might put me kind of low for navigating the street with my suspension.

Both the Kumo and the Dunlop come in a 205/50/R15 and I read good things about both. However at Tirerack.com the Dunlup is $18 more per tire. Worth it? Hearing nothing but great things about both, I'd just as soon pay less. But I'm open to suggestions.

So could I get a sanity check on my conclusions? I'm also under the impression that this setup will require no fender modifications and no spacers. FYI, this is going on an 89' 325i with H&R sport and Bilstein sport.

My other course of action is to keep my basketweaves. But then I'm limited to the Dunlop Z1 Starspeck, which is the only one with a 14" option, exactly one option at 195/60. It also costs more than the 15" kumo, dangit.

Thanks for any advice or information!

[blefevre]

You are in the EXACT same situation as me. I bought LTW5's in the fall and am currently using them as my winter tires. I will be putting the track tires on shortly. My choices are the exact same three tires you listed. I can comment that the D-forces have stood up to a very hard beating on the pothole covered winter streets we have here. I am nothing but impressed and happy with my purchase.

As for tires, I am currently learning so I will most likely go with the star specs for the extra tread-wear, but the Kumho's will save me a little money which is attractive. I will be interested to see other peoples opinions.

[Brian D]

Are you ever going to do a wet track day, or will you ever drive the car in anything more than a foggy morning? The Dunlops are exceptional wet tires, the Kumhos suck*.

Also look into the Bridgestone Re-11 and the Yokohoma AD08.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/chartDisplay.jsp?ttid=118

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/spiderChart.jsp?ttid=118

*Full disclosure, I have not used the Kumho's, but I have heard enough from people I trust to feel that they are in no way good wet tires. I have had the Dunlops, and they were very good tires all the way around, for both street and HPDE use.

[nrubenstein]

Sanity check: You live a place where it rains more than once a year. You don't want the Kumhos. Been there, done that. Literally, the worst wet tire I have ever driven on. Stone cold, untreaded, heat cycled out r-tires have better wet driving characteristics.

I trashed mine at 50% worn because I just couldn't take it any more. If it never rains and it's always above 85, they are great tires. Otherwise, stay away.

[Eric]

Are you ever going to do a wet track day, or will you ever drive the car in anything more than a foggy morning? The Dunlops are exceptional wet tires, the Kumhos suck*.

Also look into the Bridgestone Re-11 and the Yokohoma AD08.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/chartDisplay.jsp?ttid=118

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/spiderChart.jsp?ttid=118

*Full disclosure, I have not used the Kumho's, but I have heard enough from people I trust to feel that they are in no way good wet tires. I have had the Dunlops, and they were very good tires all the way around, for both street and HPDE use.

I have driven my Kuhmo XS's in damp/wet conditions and in NORMAL driving, they are fine... not sure what it would be like if you pushed it though.

[Earendil]

Are you ever going to do a wet track day, or will you ever drive the car in anything more than a foggy morning? The Dunlops are exceptional wet tires, the Kumhos suck*.

Sanity check: You live a place where it rains more than once a year. You don't want the Kumhos. Been there, done that. Literally, the worst wet tire I have ever driven on.

That is some good info! Yes, I stated that I didn't not need to drive them in the rain. When I said that what I was thinking was that I have a DD to get from point A to point B. However I do not own a truck or a trailer and do not intend to for a while, so the track rat will be driven to any events it attends. My exact location actually sees a lot of sun, 20 miles away they get 14 inches of rain a year. BUT, The closest tracks are in Portland, OR and Seattle, WA, so yes, the car might be seeing a few wet roads

And I'd rather the "summer" tires I own not be deadly in the wet!

Also look into the Bridgestone Re-11 and the Yokohoma AD08.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/chartDisplay.jsp?ttid=118

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/spiderChart.jsp?ttid=118

Wow. Great links! I didn't know tirerack had charts like that! It looks like the Bridgestone and Yokohoma are a few shiny pennies more. But I like options when shopping :)

Any opinion on 205/50 vs 225/50?
It looks like shooting for 225 really limits the tire options, as most of the ones mentioned are only offered in 205/50 when looking at a 15" wheel.

[blefevre]

There are only good tires in 205/50 and 225/45. You can get the toyo R888 in 225/50 if you want to pay for them.

[Brian D]

I have 205 street tires on right now. I greatly prefer the feel of the car with these over 225/50's. With the 225's the car felt "sloppy" during cornering to me, as if the tire was moving around between the road and the wheel more. With an 8" rim I'm sure the 225's would be great, but with a 7 I'd stick with a 205.

[BraveUlysses]

I'll let you know how the XS's perform on a wet track day...got an event 3/19 in Portland, could rain, could be dry.

[Earendil]

I'll let you know how the XS's perform on a wet track day...got an event 3/19 in Portland, could rain, could be dry.

Will you be running them on an E30 or other? And is the event the CSCC event at PIR? Perhaps I'll scoot down there that weekend and check out there performance from a different view :)

[BraveUlysses]

Bingo! I'll be there in my red 318iS with some other BMW owners

[Wh33lhop]

15x8 c1s, 225/45 rs3s. Why people willingly limit themselves to 15x7 I will never know.

205/50 and 225/45 are almost identical height-wise, and the rs3s I have have just as much grip in the wet as my old 195/60r14 all seasons did in the dry.

[mRodiek]

Im in this exact same debate right now...

Anyone have some experience with the BF Goodrich G-Forces?

[Earendil]

15x8 c1s, 225/45 rs3s. Why people willingly limit themselves to 15x7 I will never know.

205/50 and 225/45 are almost identical height-wise, and the rs3s I have have just as much grip in the wet as my old 195/60r14 all seasons did in the dry.

Limit themselves? Would I be correct in saying that you can't fit a 15/205/50 to a 15x8? Doesn't a 15x8 call for a 225 tire? And aren't most 15" tires sitting at 205? Please correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm learning as fast as I can here. But it would seem that 15x8 would limit my tire selection?

I am now starting to considering the Pro Race 1.2's. Somehow I missed them in the first pass looking for wheels. However they are only offered in 15x7 so I'll be awaiting a good argument for going 15x8.

I like the look of the C1. Are they a direct fit? It would seem that some fender rolling might be in order.


In the end, I'd rather spend money on track time than on wheels and tires. But I don't really care to be out there on 14" and whatever is available this year in a 195/60 :(

[lcoleman]

Anyone have some experience with the BF Goodrich G-Forces?

I run them, due to their combination of great behavior at the limit and reasonable wear. They are excellent DD/dual-purpose tires, but not as fast as the more serious "ST" tires listed in the OP. Of those, it'd be Star Specs or RS3s all the way. Don't think you could go wrong either way.