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    What do you think about this.

    College campuses, especially at public universities, are places where all ideas should be expressed and debated. No speech ever should be stopped or punished because of the viewpoint expressed. Of course, there must be rules to regulate the time, place and manner of such expression to preserve order and even to make sure that speech can occur.

    These general principles are unassailable, but their application to recent events at the University of California, Irvine, has attracted international attention. Israeli Ambassador to the United States Michael Oren was invited by several sponsors, including the law school (of which I am dean) and the political science department (of which I am a member) to speak at the university on Feb. 8.

    Prior to this event, campus officials heard rumors that some members of the Muslim Student Union planned to disrupt the ambassador's speech by having a series of students yell so that he could not be heard. One after another they would rise and shout, so that as each was escorted away, another would be there to make sure that the ambassador did not get to speak. When asked, the officials of the Muslim Student Union denied any plans to do this.

    Unfortunately, this is exactly what occurred. After the first disruptions, the audience was admonished that such behavior was not acceptable within the university and that those who engaged in such conduct would be arrested and face student disciplinary proceedings. Despite these warnings, 11 individuals rose and shouted so that the ambassador could not be heard. At one point he left the stage, but thankfully was persuaded to return and deliver his address.

    Eleven individuals were arrested, and those who are UCI students are facing disciplinary action. In the last week, I have been deluged with messages from those saying the disruptive students did nothing wrong and deserve no punishment, and also from those saying that the students should be expelled and that others in the audience who cheered them on should be disciplined.

    Both of these views are wrong. As to the former, there are now posters around campus referring to the unjust treatment of the "Irvine 11" and saying they were just engaging in speech themselves. However, freedom of speech never has been regarded as an absolute right to speak out at any time and in any manner. Long ago, Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes explained that there was no right to falsely shout "fire" in a crowded theater.

    The government, including public universities, always can impose time, place and manner restrictions on speech. A person who comes into my classroom and shouts so that I cannot teach surely can be punished without offending the 1st Amendment. Likewise, those who yelled to keep the ambassador from being heard were not engaged in constitutionally protected behavior.

    Freedom of speech, on campuses and elsewhere, is rendered meaningless if speakers can be shouted down by those who disagree. The law is well established that the government can act to prevent a heckler's veto -- to prevent the reaction of the audience from silencing the speaker. There is simply no 1st Amendment right to go into an auditorium and prevent a speaker from being heard, no matter who the speaker is or how strongly one disagrees with his or her message.

    The remedy for those who disagreed with the ambassador was to engage in speech of their own, but in a way that was not disruptive. They could have handed out leaflets, stood with picket signs, spoken during the question-and-answer session, held a demonstration elsewhere on campus or invited their own speakers.

    At the same time, I also disagree with those who call for draconian sanctions against these students or of punishment for a larger group. Only the students who were actually disruptive should be punished. Whether there will be criminal prosecutions is up to the Orange County district attorney. Within the university, the punishment should be great enough to convey that the conduct was wrong and unacceptable, but it should not be so severe as to ruin these students' educational careers.

    As a matter of 1st Amendment law, this is an easy case. It would be so no matter the identity or views of the speaker or of the demonstrators. Perhaps some good can come from this ugly incident if the university uses it as an occasion to help teach its students about the meaning of free speech and civil discourse.

    I would like to hear your guys opinion. This is also the one of many videos of what happened.

    #2
    I'll read this shit tomorrow but i'm so fucking drunk irght now i caan't even think about drinks right now

    1992 BMW 525iT Calypso
    2011 Jeep Wrangler

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      #3
      I think they should have sat down and stfu. Free speech doesn't mean you can sit there and be a complete fucking d bag.


      "Its preparations are concealed, not published. Its mistakes are buried not headlined. Its dissenters are silenced, not praised. No expenditure is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed."

      John F. Kennedy

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        #4
        Originally posted by UNIQETA View Post
        As a matter of 1st Amendment law, this is an easy case. It would be so no matter the identity or views of the speaker or of the demonstrators. Perhaps some good can come from this ugly incident if the university uses it as an occasion to help teach its students about the meaning of free speech and civil discourse.
        I fully agree with this. I believe they do need to be admonished in some way in order for them to pay for their completely unacceptable actions, but at the same time, their actions did not warrant the dismissal from their school.
        -Erik
        '16 Focus 2.0L - '99 Protegé DX 1.6L POS (Sold) - '87 4runner 22R-E (Sold) - '86 Schwarz S50 (Sold) - '02 WRX Wagon (sold) - '07 Impreza 2.5i (sold) - '91 Alpine M52 (Sold) - '89 Alpine 325is (Sold)


        Originally posted by 87e30
        I just want to dance with some beezies

        Comment


          #5
          To the OP;

          What would you do/How would you feel if this type of spasmodic behavior was done to you/someone you admire and wanted to hear speak?

          What kind of misnomer do you think these selfish 11 Muslim's have now given the rest of the courteous and mature Muslim's currently attending UCI who disagree with the content of the speakers material?

          How would you defend the Muslim Student Union who lied to school administration about the supposed juvenile disruption?

          What type of behavior should young adult college students hold themselves by? To be heard at all costs, to make a scene to prove a point?

          Colleges are institutions of higher education and you cannot tell me that the 11 individuals involved in this blatant disregard for another mans dignity are of that designation. Learned, honorable, discriminating, and tolerant are all character traits of what successful college students are/should be, and these miscreants are devoid of any such titles.

          To practice such behavior in a high level gathering such as this is reprehensible and the Muslim Student Union, in an effort to save face, should be moving towards making a public apology, both written and spoken.

          There are unspoken rules and courtesies that all attendees agree to upon entering the auditorium, just as you the speaker accept all variables that may arise. You do not speak out unless called upon, you do not stand unless excusing yourself, you certainly do not carry out a premeditated protest that will cause international unrest.

          Such a deliberate and uncouth disruption would most definitely violate the school code of ethics, and rest in the hands of the administration the choice to expel such students who would knowingly execute such repeated misconduct.

          This was not a classroom, this was not a open forum for debate, nor was this an invitation to all those who might oppose the speaker to feel free to engage in malevolent behavior. Seeing it was not such a forum, these students do not have the right to speak out in the manner in which they did as in doing so label themselves ignorant and oppressive. The freedom in which to speak out is not inherently granted in situations such as these, yet it is understood that you reserve your thoughts weather for or against the speaker to be vented in the appropriate avenues within the college.


          WTB: e30 in So Cal

          Originally posted by downernsp
          See I was young too but wtf is up with these perves that know damb well they are manipullating females wiyh all their promises and words.

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            #6
            tl;dr

            SILBER COMBAT UNIT DELTA (M-Technic Marshal)
            RTFM:http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=56950

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              #7
              People should only be allowed to voice an opinion if I agree with that opinion.


              Most colleges don't allow different voices of opinion so it's a fail from the start.

              But to interupt a persons speach is childish instead of just not being there to show su[pport or picketing the event.
              Your signature picture has been removed since it contained the Photobucket "upgrade your account" image.

              "I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the [federal] government." ~ James Madison

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                #8
                fuckin ragheads

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