(Message from Athens) How do you cope with constant recession?

[nrubenstein]

good thing there's other EU countrys that can bail Greece out of their own shit tho'

Not really. It's politically impossible to bail out Greece to the level needed to make this all sustainable.

In my earlier post I forgot to mention that the other important difference between the dollar and the euro regions is that in the US, we already do significant redistribution from wealthy states (mostly coastal, blue states) to poorer states (flyover country and the south - and no, I don't count Texas as south). This ameliorates the damage done by not being able to revalue each state's currency for competitiveness.

[Xat1cZ]

good thing there's other EU countrys that can bail Greece out of their own shit tho'

[mikeedler]

bury your grandparents in your backyard so you can continue to collect their retirement like the rest of Greece.

HaHA, the Germans love Greece, everyday during lunch, they all just complain about how fucked the greeks are!!!

I personally think you all are O.K., kinda the american scammers of Europe.

[gwb72tii]

Long term, the only way that Greece will survive is to go off the Euro and default. There is simply no way in hell that they can deflate the economy enough to solve your problems through taxes and contractionary policies without causing the country to come apart. The Euro was a stupid idea when they put it in place.

The probablem with the Euro vs. the dollar is pretty simple: 1). No political unity. 2). Lack of mobility - someone in Wisconsin can pretty easily move to Georgia and find work. Not a lot of, say, Greeks can move to Germany and find work. Open borders don't solve cultural and language barriers.

And really, the way that you personally survive in a nation in a state of perpetual depression is you leave. Get the hell out while you still can (and I sure hope you are keeping your money in Swiss bank accounts).

qft

[mrsleeve]

Why should we use up our own oil when we can use up everyone else's first? I've never understood why we are so anxious to use our oil now.

because tar sands oil is not green enough for our current regime. its to dirty and fucks up the environment too much. Remember we should all be driving volts that are powered by wind 99% of the time. :)

that said I am all for drilling, here as well as importing from more friendly sources (even though a 1/4 of our imports already come from the hat)

[nrubenstein]

but our president wont let you sell it too us. your going to have to sell it China or drink it ;)

Why should we use up our own oil when we can use up everyone else's first? I've never understood why we are so anxious to use our oil now.

[nrubenstein]

Long term, the only way that Greece will survive is to go off the Euro and default. There is simply no way in hell that they can deflate the economy enough to solve your problems through taxes and contractionary policies without causing the country to come apart. The Euro was a stupid idea when they put it in place.

The probablem with the Euro vs. the dollar is pretty simple: 1). No political unity. 2). Lack of mobility - someone in Wisconsin can pretty easily move to Georgia and find work. Not a lot of, say, Greeks can move to Germany and find work. Open borders don't solve cultural and language barriers.

And really, the way that you personally survive in a nation in a state of perpetual depression is you leave. Get the hell out while you still can (and I sure hope you are keeping your money in Swiss bank accounts).

[mrsleeve]

We have a lot of oil.

but our president wont let you sell it too us. your going to have to sell it China or drink it ;)

[Raxe]

We have a lot of oil.

[mrsleeve]

^

while I agree with that assessment, there are many citizens in this country that still believe in capitalism and personal responsibility

[herbivor]

So a citizen of a government with unsustainable economic policies is asking citizens of another government with unsustainable economic policies how to cope in a recession? Well, we just printed 16 trillion dollars and gave it to the banks that caused the problem in the first place. Maybe your country should do the same thing...oh wait.

note to mod. May wanna move this to the P&R section.

[mrsleeve]

^

Yup but you guys are in a position where you need to lower your tax burdens to get things going, but that will not happen thanks to your political climate using taxes and entitlements to punish success and pander to the poor. Dont feel bad we have similar shit happening here in the US we are just further behind and have a better situation as the default world currency propping us up ..............................For now anyway

OP

Leave go abroad and make a life somewhere else, the same goes for your buddy with the engineering degree, there is so much opportunity abroad for engineers especially in the energy business from traditional (Mining, Petrol,) to the GREEN shit, and distribution of said resources.

[a3ternus]

Agree with both of you but not 100%.

bmwstephen,most people here wanted the equivalent of the "american dream".
Now after spending all their money on houses,they cant afford them due to increasing taxes.
Same goes for their cars,even though thats another story.
Bottom line is taxes are killing the economy for both the evading
and the law abiding citizens.Easy to understand why though...

gwb72tii,I agree on everything except for the part where you talk about Greece lying to the EU about the deficit.
Its now clear that this is not what actually happened.
Lots of speculation,intel and counter intel on this topic.
Some even say that it was a financial scum in which even Goldman Sachs was a part of.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,676634,00.html

In plain words this article say a lot about the causes of the Greek crisis.

http://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2011/10/11/wanna-know-why-greece-went-bankrupt/

Outrageous.

N.

PS.Apart from these I dont understand why we still need to buy arms from Germany?
TROIKA is endorsing these deals too.WTF is happening?!

[bmwstephen]

this is a big reason greece is so fucked up

there is lots wrong with not paying what is due, which is entorely different from fraudulently avoiding taxes as he mentioned

I should rephrase.

there's nothing wrong with utilizing tax loop holes. the average citizens would do so if they have the ability. what's wrong is that some are illegally avoiding taxes but it trumps what was wrong to begin with and that is:that your country is to keen on taxing every foreseeable activity to begin with.

[gwb72tii]

nothing wrong with avoiding taxes.

this is a big reason greece is so fucked up

there is lots wrong with not paying what is due, which is entorely different from fraudulently avoiding taxes as he mentioned