"car guys" driving automatics?

[cwatt]

So I've read a lot of arguments re: shift-speed of dual-clutch vs the enjoyment of rowing through the gears. What I haven't seen is anyone address the transmission/car combination. An automatic in my half-ton doesn't bother me as much as an automatic in a sports car.

Sticking to the OP's question, whether you define an e30 as a sports car is a matter of interpretation. For some, they may just enjoy the classic drive experience and aren't too interested in track racing or time attacks. For some car guys who are savvy enough to want such classic drive experiences, an automatic wouldn't compromise it.

With regard to newer vehicles, I think we need to acknowledge the past 10-15yrs in the auto industry has been largely muddied with the introduction of dual-clutch transmissions and auto-manufacturers misrepresenting automatics with paddle-buttons. Now that the dust is starting to settle, we're beginning to ask which cars should receive them and which shouldn't. I've always felt the E92 M3 was better suited with a manual because even at the time, it didn't represent the pinnacle of automotive technology. Carbon roof and dual-clutch aside, it was pretty low tech, especially with that V8 up front. It's my belief that cars such as Ferrari should all have dual clutch transmissions because the level of technology and micro-design would be completely undone by a stick-shift. A car like the FR-S is a perfect car for a manual because it's all about driver skill, not driver aids.


Let me know what you think. Like. Subscribe. lol jks

[Rodoni]

Most people don't use it though. That's why you always see everyone's brake lights lit up.

Again, an invalid argument. That's just your opinion. You can't possibly say that everyone with an automatic ALWAYS sits in traffic holding the brake pedal. Especially coming from someone who hasn't even been driving more than 4-5 years.

We get it. You like manual. Whoop-de-fucking-doo. No one is gonna change your mind just like you're not gonna change anyone else's mind.

[HennaE30]

Um, you do know that autos have a "neutral" gear too right? Your argument is invalid. You have to do the same steps to but an auto car in neutral just as you'd put a manual car in neutral.



Manual: Push clutch pedal, switch gear with arm/hand.

Auto: push brake pedal, switch gear with arm/hand.

Most people don't use it though. That's why you always see everyone's brake lights lit up.

[Rodoni]

Personally, on the traffic note, I'd rather have a manual, because if traffic is at a stand still or your at a light, you can pop it into neutral and your not sitting there having to hold the brake pedal like in a auto (assuming the car doesn't roll while your at a light, not a problem here in Texas where everything's flat)

Um, you do know that autos have a "neutral" gear too right? Your argument is invalid. You have to do the same steps to but an auto car in neutral just as you'd put a manual car in neutral.

Manual: Push clutch pedal, switch gear with arm/hand.
Auto: push brake pedal, switch gear with arm/hand.

[grn gbln]

I can't consider those yuppies in those supercars carguys. Cause prob 10% if not less actually wrench on their own ride I'm sure

[HennaE30]

But just because your car is a manual or an automatic shouldnt determine car guy status! At the end of the day your penis is still the same size as it was when the day began.

Loll. In the end, it doesn't really matter what you drive. You choose to drive what you drive. If it's a manual, great, if it's an automatic, good for you.

[grn gbln]

But just because your car is a manual or an automatic shouldnt determine car guy status! At the end of the day your penis is still the same size as it was when the day began.

[grn gbln]

I agree with varg! I live in va and deal with traffic all the time!!! My 92 f150 is a stick and daily that. Cruise the weekends in my 91 325i, its an auto :( but I bought it cause it was the best bang for the buck, other than peeling paint and a lil crack in the dash its pretty cherry. Debating on converting it but say what the hell if it ain't broke don't fix it. I'd rather go get another one MANUAL though. When I need to run up and down 95 cruise the automatic :) you just never know when and how long your going to sit in traffic and the auto relieves that headache. But when it comes down to it an auto e30 is no where near the amount of fun as one with the 5 spd. Hell IMO anything with a manual trans is more fun than its automatic counterpart.

[HennaE30]

just going by your join date (and the fact that you list daddy's car in your sig) here, but some of us aren't 19 and have developed a skill set to the point where just street-driving a manual transmission car doesn't polish it up any further.

Well fair enough. But it's still rewarding when you get onto a twistier road and you nail everything in a section of road. And just pushing the gas and letting the car do the rest, takes a lot away from that.

[decay]

Couldn'tve said it better myself... I guess it's a thing of, as a car guy, I'm always trying to better myself at driving my car.

just going by your join date (and the fact that you list daddy's car in your sig) here, but some of us aren't 19 and have developed a skill set to the point where just street-driving a manual transmission car doesn't polish it up any further.

[HennaE30]

This thread was on my mind on the way home from the gym tonight, and something else came to mind. Driving a manual is a much more emotional experience. For example, it feels real good when you're on a roll at shifting smoothly, rev matching well, and the car lets you know so. On the other hand, it's super obvious when you release the clutch too fast, or lug a bit too much from a stop...gives you the drive to improve. Makes the car feel more alive I think.

Couldn'tve said it better myself... I guess it's a thing of, as a car guy, I'm always trying to better myself at driving my car. And will you do well, the car rewards you for it. I guess that is more of what I'm referring to as a "car guy". The problem is, People have gotten lazy, and forgotten about the joy of driving. Personally, on the traffic note, I'd rather have a manual, because if traffic is at a stand still or your at a light, you can pop it into neutral and your not sitting there having to hold the brake pedal like in a auto (assuming the car doesn't roll while your at a light, not a problem here in Texas where everything's flat)

[Ether-D]

Cliffs:
-Cars (and transmissions) serve different purposes for different people.
-Who cares if peoples' DDs are autos.
-Some people are more fortunate than others to afford more than 1 vehicle with a manual transmission.
-Manual/auto, either way, traffic blows.
-I agree, my "sports" car wouldn't be an auto.

^This.
Automatic doesn't mean you are less of a man. Manual doesn't turn you into more of a man, it's just what you prefer. Wait, is this another 100+post thread arguing preference? Yeah, it's r3v…

[Rodoni]

Honestly, I don't see the big deal with you guys hating that much on automatics lol. I'm all for having a manual for the "fun" car. All my BMWs were manuals (aside from my 2nd e36 m3 which I swapped to manual after a few months of ownership) and I wouldn't have had it any other way. HOWEVER, it was a pain in the ass to DD. When I was younger (high school & early college) it didn't bother me that much. I too had the same thoughts as the OP, "why do car enthusiasts have autos?! That's so STUPID. Etc."

However, now that I am a little older, I realize that each transmission serves a purpose (IMO anyway). My DD now is an auto (SUV). I wouldn't dare DD a SUV in a manual. Why? Because it's fucking useless to me. I'd much rather sit and use one foot the whole time then mess around with both feet and my right arm. It's a fucking SUV...ever try and drive one like a BMW? It fucking BLOWS. It's not meant to be driven like that and that's how I like to drive my "fun" cars that have manual transmissions.

To be honest, I have a feeling my DDs in the future will also be automatics. Why? Because it's just a fucking DD. I don't know why some of you are taking it to heart so much lol. You don't like slush boxes, we get it. I didn't either. It's still not my preference for my "fun/weekend/track car". But some slush boxes serve a purpose. Just like the dude up top with the F250. Fuck having that in a manual. Sure, some would prefer it to be manual, but to each their own. I personally would not want it in a manual.

Sure, some of you can't afford 2, 3, 4 + cars. If your wife can't drive stick and you need to compromise and have automatics, then so be it. I don't see the big deal. Of course it wouldn't be my first choice but life goes on. Most of you drive fucking 25 year old cars that aren't worth shit. Why? Because you ENJOY THEM. Some people ENJOY autos more than manuals (I'm all for you auto haters, I'm on your side when it comes to having a sports car that is auto, I think it's dumb). But you can't knock the guy with an automatic station wagon, or some dumb civic, or mini van that they just use to DD with just because you drive a manual everyday and you think it's the end all be all transmission.

Cliffs:
-Cars (and transmissions) serve different purposes for different people.
-Who cares if peoples' DDs are autos.
-Some people are more fortunate than others to afford more than 1 vehicle with a manual transmission.
-Manual/auto, either way, traffic blows.
-I agree, my "sports" car wouldn't be an auto.

[GillesBigCowboy]

clutch in my vert presses down easy, so it is a good commuter... clutch in the 318is takes more effort, but my wife only complains a little.... I like to glide a lot while commuting but I guess you could do that in an automatic, but doesn't seem natural.

For me, I think it is mostly about Control - any automatic I have ever driven has had a mind of its own, and if I want to accelerate through a corner at or near the limit, I can't have the tranny deciding when to shift. Ever. And the slippage..

I am sure I could enjoy some paddle shifters and left foot braking if the manual mode NEVER messed with my control, never shifted unless asked, allowed me to coast when I wanted, etc..

I would still miss the satisfaction of smoothly matching revs, the oneness I feel with the car, and the mechanical sympathy that naturally develops from driving a stick shift smoothly.

[rturbo 930]

Automatics are definitely easier to drive. And I'm saying that as a manual-only guy. I love stick shifts, but if I had to deal with LA traffic every day, I'd have an auto. Letting the clutch in and out every 5 seconds is a PITA, and it doesn't take long, at least for me, before my leg/knee starts getting tired/sore. Sure, I could leave space in front of me, but around here, that means "Hey, you should pull in front of me."

"Well, I'm already in first; better release the clutch and press the gas to go"
or
"Well, it's an automatic; better release the brake and press the gas to go"


Wow, crazy harder, I know

Not really. The clutch pedal is not an on/off switch like the brake pedal is in an auto. It may seem like nothing if you're used to doing it, but, especially in stop and go traffic, a stick shift takes quite a bit more effort. Again, if I spent a lot of time in stop and go traffic, I would absolutely have an auto.