SCOTUS rules in favor of the 2nd Amendment

[hugh jass]

i'm going to stop by pinepig's house later on my way home and hug it out with him. afterwards we will go the the embers and have a beer and look at titties.

[Pinepig]

i'm going to stop by pinepig's house later on my way home and hug it out with him. afterwards we will go the the embers and have a beer and look at titties.

Don't hug dudes, don't drink ( anymore ) but love them titties.

[E30 Cabrio]

I wonder how people can do these things to one another. It's almost like watching a preview of one of those "48Hour Mysteries" or "I Survived" shows.

As long as there are people out there like that, I will choose to arm myself.

The odds of becoming a victim of a crime as described in the links above are slim, but that's something I'm not going to leave to chance.

I would rather own a gun and not need it then to die a horrific death wishing I had one and a chance to use it...

[Ryan Stewart]

Having your gun stolen from your house was being responsible? Or from your person?

You're saying there is no solution to keeping guns out of the hands of criminals?

Who the fuck intentionally gets robbed? Seriously, find me someone who is actually getting robbed on purpose (instead of an insurance scam). Your interpolation is way off. Your only solution to this is to get rid of ALL guns because criminals would steal them even if someone who had a safety course was the only one who could own them.



No, there is no solution. Any solution proposed, even if it was actually targeted at controlling a criminal's access to guns, would be about as effective as, well, controlling access to narcotics. Fuck, we all know how well the war on drugs is going. Or prohibition, that sure went well.

All you do when you institute a ban is criminalize ownership. If people want something they will have it unless you want to live in an Orwellian Utopia (and even then people would still circumvent the system). And if you look at any statute its only purpose is to criminalize ownership. It only marginally addresses related criminal behavior. The Brady Bill had little to no effect on people who were career criminals. It only affected those people who obtained guns through legal channels.

How many criminals you think are going to fill out the NICS paperwork and wait 10 days before robbing a bank? None, they will pay the premium on the black market for firearms brought in from other countries illegally or stolen from those who own them legally. All criminalizing does is raise the price a bit.

[CleanAzzE30z]

We are headed in the right direction. We need more guns in this country. Its probably the one thing that will surely promote less crime in general. It makes perfect sense!!



Mariano

[joshh]

Who the fuck intentionally gets robbed? Seriously, find me someone who is actually getting robbed on purpose (instead of an insurance scam). Your interpolation is way off. Your only solution to this is to get rid of ALL guns because criminals would steal them even if someone who had a safety course was the only one who could own them.



No, there is no solution. Any solution proposed, even if it was actually targeted at controlling a criminal's access to guns, would be about as effective as, well, controlling access to narcotics. Fuck, we all know how well the war on drugs is going. Or prohibition, that sure went well.

All you do when you institute a ban is criminalize ownership. If people want something they will have it unless you want to live in an Orwellian Utopia (and even then people would still circumvent the system). And if you look at any statute its only purpose is to criminalize ownership. It only marginally addresses related criminal behavior. The Brady Bill had little to no effect on people who were career criminals. It only affected those people who obtained guns through legal channels.

How many criminals you think are going to fill out the NICS paperwork and wait 10 days before robbing a bank? None, they will pay the premium on the black market for firearms brought in from other countries illegally or stolen from those who own them legally. All criminalizing does is raise the price a bit.

Who said anything about being intentionally robbed?? You leave your gun out where it can be robbed and it makes you an irresponsible owner (unless they ripped your gun safe out of the house).
No that's not the only solution. You make gun owners be responsible for gun ownership. And if they can't be, you don't let them own guns. It's that simple.


Access to narcotics? the "war on drugs"? Have you done much research on that subject? We aren't even trying. That's why it's not working. Same goes for controlling criminals from getting guns.

Ban?? Who said anything about a ban? Wrong subject, wrong guy to point the finger at on bans. Are you reading what I've written already? I'm against bans.

Jesus Christ man, your examples are exactly what I was pointing out is wrong with legislation on gun control. The Brady Bill was a total joke. You're going to have to think much broader than the Democrats who pushed that into effect.

And there you go taking about stolen guns from owners...LMFAO. I already gave a solution for part of that problem.
You do realize the Black market is not as easy as just having a friend buy the gun for you. And that is one of our biggest problems right there. Straw sales. One of the others is irresponsible gun owners many call "honest".
You don't think we can come up with a solution for Straw sales either I take it?

Any "gun control" (which is defined as anything stopping ANYONE from getting a gun) is bad gun control.

[joshh]

We are headed in the right direction. We need more guns in this country. Its probably the one thing that will surely promote less crime in general. It makes perfect sense!!



Mariano

Of course, lets keep arming the criminals as well.

[Vedubin01]

We are headed in the right direction. We need more guns in this country. Its probably the one thing that will surely promote less crime in general. It makes perfect sense!!



Mariano

Mariano, you come from a different side of life where you've seen guns that have killed (assuming on my behalf knowing a bit about you) I for one come from a walk of life where guns were always in the family and we were brought up understanding the use and the respect of a firearm. But because guns can kill people its not fair to ban them for people like me that use them for recreation and hunting. You have to understand there are people that are responsible and do not intend to kill others with a firearm.

Don't mean to single you out either, this thread is long. But just trying to use an example that some could relate.


V

[dlmpsy]

I too come from a gun background. Some of my fondest memories are hunting with my father, and him teaching me to shoot. My first gun and my father's hunting rifle, all very fond memories. Hunting camp with my friends. All very, very good memories. I also remember when somebody came out my 1/2 mile dirt road to steal gas, and my mother shooting her .38 Special over their heads to scare them away. I remember a red shirt running thru the field. I'm glad she had the gun and knew how to use it. I also know the challenge of hitting a small target a long way off, I know what a gun will do to an animal, I appreciate the mechanical artwork of John Browning when I look at a 1911, I remember the veterans when I look at a Garand, and I remember my basic training when I hold my AR15. There is beauty and art in guns as there is beauty and art in cars. Target shooting is very challenging, hunting requires skill and patience. It is also very enjoyable to customize your gun and be rewarded with an improvement in accuracy and reliability. There is much more to gun ownership than what some people think, and for me it is not about waiting for the apocalypse or for the zomibes to attack. I also feel reassured that if someone broke into my home that I would at least have a chance to protect myself and those I care about.

[Ryan Stewart]

Who said anything about being intentionally robbed?? You leave your gun out where it can be robbed and it makes you an irresponsible owner (unless they ripped your gun safe out of the house).
No that's not the only solution. You make gun owners be responsible for gun ownership. And if they can't be, you don't let them own guns. It's that simple.


Access to narcotics? the "war on drugs"? Have you done much research on that subject? We aren't even trying. That's why it's not working. Same goes for controlling criminals from getting guns.

Ban?? Who said anything about a ban? Wrong subject, wrong guy to point the finger at on bans. Are you reading what I've written already? I'm against bans.

Jesus Christ man, your examples are exactly what I was pointing out is wrong with legislation on gun control. The Brady Bill was a total joke. You're going to have to think much broader than the Democrats who pushed that into effect.

And there you go taking about stolen guns from owners...LMFAO. I already gave a solution for part of that problem.
You do realize the Black market is not as easy as just having a friend buy the gun for you. And that is one of our biggest problems right there. Straw sales. One of the others is irresponsible gun owners many call "honest".
You don't think we can come up with a solution for Straw sales either I take it?

Any "gun control" (which is defined as anything stopping ANYONE from getting a gun) is bad gun control.

How are we not even trying? We spend billions, institute border controls and even go into other countries to enforce.

What didnt the brady bill try and do except require a specific license for an automatic weapon? It failed at that

Im not even sure I should be arguing with you if you honestly think that a straw sale is easier than the black market. For starters, a straw sale means your friend is fucked if your intention is to commit a crime with that gun.

[Ryan Stewart]

We are headed in the right direction. We need more guns in this country. Its probably the one thing that will surely promote less crime in general. It makes perfect sense!!



Mariano

I detect sarcasm, I shall add to it.

Well, minorities (including latinos) make up the majority of the prison population. Maybe minorities are responsible for violent crime. If we disarm we should whiten up the nation too. That should solve the problem.

[joshh]

How are we not even trying? We spend billions, institute border controls and even go into other countries to enforce.

What didnt the brady bill try and do except require a specific license for an automatic weapon? It failed at that

Im not even sure I should be arguing with you if you honestly think that a straw sale is easier than the black market. For starters, a straw sale means your friend is fucked if your intention is to commit a crime with that gun.

You're saying two different things at the same time.
On one hand you're saying we are trying to stop criminals from owning guns and on the other you're saying the Brady bill didn't work. That's called not trying. It's called bad legislation because neither side will compromise at all.
It was a horrible piece of law that didn't work because it was bad from the start.

A straw sale is way easier. I can name 10 people right this minute that would be willing to buy a gun for me. Same goes for any criminal. All they need is a person with a clean record.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_1_47/ai_67717300

BATF statistics indicate that more than 26,000 illegal firearms were purchased in straw-man transactions between July 1996 and December 1998.

[CleanAzzE30z]

Of course, lets keep arming the criminals as well.

Its that new thing, I think its called sarcasm. Dont know if its gotten around to you over there yet. ;) jk man.

Mariano, you come from a different side of life where you've seen guns that have killed (assuming on my behalf knowing a bit about you) I for one come from a walk of life where guns were always in the family and we were brought up understanding the use and the respect of a firearm. But because guns can kill people its not fair to ban them for people like me that use them for recreation and hunting. You have to understand there are people that are responsible and do not intend to kill others with a firearm.

Don't mean to single you out either, this thread is long. But just trying to use an example that some could relate.


V

Thats cool. I see your point of view, but I personally dont think the advantage of putting guns in the hands of more people outweigh the disadvantages of doing such a thing.

I detect sarcasm, I shall add to it.

Well, minorities (including latinos) make up the majority of the prison population. Maybe minorities are responsible for violent crime. If we disarm we should whiten up the nation too. That should solve the problem.

Thats exactly what I was getting at. Fucking Mexicans, haha. ;)

[Vedubin01]

Thats cool. I see your point of view, but I personally dont think the advantage of putting guns in the hands of more people outweigh the disadvantages of doing such a thing.

Im not saying more people should own guns. Its a constitutional right as founded by the fathers that build the United States. Now if people can not respect that, then there are other countries that have laws maybe ment for them.

Again I feel that one must have military training or have to go though a gun course (at least 80 hour classroom and field shooting) to be able to own them.

The problem will always be that there are guns on the street. You and the Government will never be able to remove those guns. The "bad" guys will never turn them in and you would only be disarming the law abiding citizen. Thus crime rates would go up, when the "Bad" guy have no fear of getting shot.

Its a hard battle but it has to fall all the way back to what the founders of our country wanted. And we just have to deal with the consequences of the few.

Just dont put you or your family in harms way, be aware of your surroundings and be ready to defend if necessary because no one else is going to do that for you. And most likely you would never have a problem with this gun issue. If one lives in a neighborhood that is bad, simply move to another town that would better suit you and your families needs and safety.

[Ryan Stewart]

You're saying two different things at the same time.
On one hand you're saying we are trying to stop criminals from owning guns and on the other you're saying the Brady bill didn't work. That's called not trying. It's called bad legislation because neither side will compromise at all.
It was a horrible piece of law that didn't work because it was bad from the start.

A straw sale is way easier. I can name 10 people right this minute that would be willing to buy a gun for me. Same goes for any criminal. All they need is a person with a clean record.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...47/ai_67717300

You arent listening/reading.

I said:

straw sales are shit for criminals because if you are using them in a crime you fuck the guy buying it for you. Black market = nobody gives a shit what you do.

0 of those 10 people wouldnt buy a gun for you if they knew you were going to use it for a criminal act.

And you are disproving your own point. You want gun laws but you are saying you know firsthand to get around them. GREAT! That means, like I said, the only people affected by them are those who already FOLLOW THE RULES.