Does anyone know of a good suspension/dynamics forum?

[TwoJ's]

I see that corner carvers is no longer in existence. I am looking for some reading on suspension design and vehicle dynamics. I am just starting my senior year in a ME program, and I am leaning towards designing some chassis bracing or possibly some adjustable tubular control arms for my senior project.

On a related note; what other kind of parts would you track-going guys be interested in having (suspension/chassis related)?

[Brian D]

I see that corner carvers is no longer in existence.

Incorrect, try www.corner-carvers.com/forums . Have you read the books that are available on the subject? It can be very hard to weed out the BS on forums, even one as good as CC. The books are a foundation that you can build on with info from forums. This would be a good first step:

http://www.amazon.com/Advanced-Race-Car-Suspension-Development/dp/0936834056

Check out the associated books also.

If you've read some books, forgive me. I don't know your experience level.

[TwoJ's]

Yeah I have a .PDF of "race car vehicle dynamics" which is recommended by a few people online. It is a textbook, and is over 400 pages. I am trying to find a digital copy of "tune to win" by Carroll smith which is also highly recommended from what I've read online.

I forgot about the hyphen in the address, thanks.

[Skafrog]

Dont post on there until you have done research, or you will regret it. It's about the only forum on the internet that has the balls to ban people for not searching (which is a beautiful thing).

[TwoJ's]

Yeah, when I went to register I wasn't able to see the forums or post. I read their thread with the forum rules and all that shit and I was blown away at first. I was under the assumption that all car forums would be loose and full of a bunch of bull shit like this one is. It will be a nice change of pace, and from what I see, cc is the type of forum I will like.

I guess the ability to post takes a while to go through so I will just start reading and get the lay-of-the-land.

Do any of you have ideas for a part of something that you would like to have on your car? I am brainstorming ideas for my senior project and I am leaning towards chassis stiffening/suspension geometry optimization. I'd really like to hear from some guys that actually track their cars. What I have in mind so far would be an "x brace", some fully adjustable control arms (that would be designed for a lowered car), camber plates etc. I have experience with carbon fiber molding, and I am considering making a strut brace out of CF or some other type of composite.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

[Knockenwelle]

Hello, fellow ME student...

If you haven't read Donohue's 'Unfair Advantage', do so. It's a great read, and manages to convey a lot of sound technical vehicle tuning and development tips through narative of his driving career. Donohue had the fairly uncommon (as far as race drivers go) ability to assess what a car needed from its performance, and make chassis or setup changes from that, rather than just telling the Crew Chief that "the car's loose". It's also a neat historical record of his career, especially the development of the 917.

RCVD is a book that is almost readable on its own, but it would make a lot more sense if you were to work through an entire chassis build with it. I recently used mine to figure out a 5-link rear suspension for the University of Arizona's solar race car. Then I designed parts in SolidWorks, and made them in the machine shop. Very satisfying.

As far as ideas for the E30, I'd eventually like to make some assorted chassis bracing, but will wait until I can lighten the car as I add bracing... You could make motor swap parts, trans swap parts, brake swap parts... Do you have 3-D CAD skills?

[z31maniac]

A way to address bumpsteer (non-M obviously) and control arm angle on lowered E30s in the front.

Fully adjustable rear trailing arms out back.

[kishg]

Yeah I have a .PDF of "race car vehicle dynamics" which is recommended by a few people online. It is a textbook, and is over 400 pages. I am trying to find a digital copy of "tune to win" by Carroll smith which is also highly recommended from what I've read online.

I forgot about the hyphen in the address, thanks.

why digital copy? you can order it from amazon. it and his other books are worth the $$. If you can't afford it, borrow it from your college library. Don't steal other's IP. don't they teach professional ethics in your ME program?

[Brian D]

Something that has crossed my mind would be a front strut brace that tied into the firewall somehow. This thread brought it to mind again, especially the point made by Jack Hidley about halfway down. It may be pretty difficult to connect to the firewall on an E30, but you wanted a bit of a challenge, right?

[TwoJ's]

Hello, fellow ME student...

If you haven't read Donohue's 'Unfair Advantage', do so. It's a great read, and manages to convey a lot of sound technical vehicle tuning and development tips through narative of his driving career. Donohue had the fairly uncommon (as far as race drivers go) ability to assess what a car needed from its performance, and make chassis or setup changes from that, rather than just telling the Crew Chief that "the car's loose". It's also a neat historical record of his career, especially the development of the 917.

RCVD is a book that is almost readable on its own, but it would make a lot more sense if you were to work through an entire chassis build with it. I recently used mine to figure out a 5-link rear suspension for the University of Arizona's solar race car. Then I designed parts in SolidWorks, and made them in the machine shop. Very satisfying.

As far as ideas for the E30, I'd eventually like to make some assorted chassis bracing, but will wait until I can lighten the car as I add bracing... You could make motor swap parts, trans swap parts, brake swap parts... Do you have 3-D CAD skills?

Yeah, I actually really like to model stuff in solid works. I designed the pedal box and master cylinder for our electric car last year, and will be finishing the fabrication this quarter. I'm working on my FEA skills.

[TwoJ's]

A way to address bumpsteer (non-M obviously) and control arm angle on lowered E30s in the front.

This is definitely something I'd like to research and toy with.

why digital copy? you can order it from amazon. it and his other books are worth the $$. If you can't afford it, borrow it from your college library. Don't steal other's IP. don't they teach professional ethics in your ME program?

Come off your high horse. I could either get it at the library at school and photocopy what I want, or get a digital copy and print what I want. All are free to me, and it has absolutely no ill effect on anyone.

Something that has crossed my mind would be a front strut brace that tied into the firewall somehow. This thread brought it to mind again, especially the point made by Jack Hidley about halfway down. It may be pretty difficult to connect to the firewall on an E30, but you wanted a bit of a challenge, right?

That's funny, I was actually reading that thread last night. A better front strut brace would be good. I have experience with composites, so I want to look in to making something extremely light.

[iflytii]

So does this mean you are thinking about doing a SLA retrofit? :D

[TwoJ's]

At this point that is beyond me. I could probably crudely design and make something that would have proper geometry while static. But it would be quite a task for me to improve on the existing suspension with short/long setup. If I did that I'd bet that the geometry would be all screwed up under different loads.

[TwoJ's]

Or maybe not. I haven't really read anything on it recently, but it would be pretty cool to do that. I really wish i already had a model of the e30 chassis. That would make things muuuch more simple.

[Skafrog]

If you could fab up something that could be welded onto the outboard rear trailing arm pickup point that allows for both toe and camber adjustment, you would be e-famous, and would be ensured at least 1 order :)
Something like this:

http://www.e30m3project.com/e30m3performance/tech_articles/misc-tech/dp_dtm/pics/rr_trailing-arm_pickup-1.jpg