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Old 01-09-2012, 07:03 PM   #1
VinniE30
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My BMW engine weights guide

For years people have been referencing the engine weights on
http://www.bimmerforums.com/engine_faq.php
and
http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/enumber.html

Most of the engine weights on the 2 pages above are gotten from the weight BMW lists for the part "Short Engine" which can be seen on
http://bmwfans.info/

For example, this is the page for the US E36 M50 engine:
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E3.../short_engine/

Although the image for the "Short Engine" part shows the entire engine with both the block and head, these weights are commonly criticized and thought to be way too low and inaccurate for the entire assembled engine as it would be in the car.

I believe using the bmwfans.info is accurate, just not for the entire assembled engine. It obviously doesn't include manifolds and other parts attached to the engine.
But I do believe it includes at least the block and head as the picture shows. I think this because you can add up the weight of the block and head for the engine listed and see that it's much less than the "short engine".
For example:
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E3...browse/engine/
M20 Short Engine - 257 lb
M20 Engine block with piston - 116 lb
M20 Cylinder head - 26 lb
116 + 26 = 142
So you can see their weight for the "Short Engine" is much more than just the block and head.
If you wanted, you could add up all the engine parts weights listed on that page and see how close it comes to the short engine weight. You could essentially figure out what the short engine includes from this or what the engine weighs with certain parts included. But I know it must be at least the block and head.

Also, on the unix nerd site, he lists most of the engines at the same weight as the bimmerforums FAQ, however, he lists some engines at very different weights than are reported by the short engine weight and the bimmerforums FAQ. I consider his website unreliable for engine weights since he is not consistent with using BMW's "Short Engine" weight or weights from official documentation or press releases.

Also note that the bimmerforums FAQ doesn't list exactly the same weight as the short engine weights on bmwfans.info for all the engines, although for the most part they do.
For example, they list the M50 at 299 lbs which is the same as the bmwfans short engine weight but they list the M30 at 315 lbs which is inconsistent with the bmwfans short engine weight which lists the M30 at the same weight as the m50, ~299 lbs.


Now for some more real realistic engine weights...

This website:
http://www.usautoparts.net/
lists BMW engines and their specifications including official weights reported by BMW in technical information documents or press releases. I have confirmed some of the weights and cross referenced them with BMW's reported weight for the ones I could find; and all of the ones I could find the weights for matched up. Going off that, I think it's safe to assume the are consistent with BMW's reported weight. These weights are much more than the "Short Engine" OEM parts weights and I think they are the best source to compare the engine weights since they are consistent with BMW's official documented weights. And these weights are much closer to what people on these forums have weighed fully dressed engines at.
They list almost every BMW engine with specs, however, they don't have weights for that many of them, and there are no weights for engines such as the US iron block M52/S52, but weights for the euro aluminum version.

Here are weights I gathered from that website unless otherwise noted:

Iron block M50B20 and M50B25
engine _____ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
non-VANOS _ 194 _______ 427.7
VANOS _____ 198 _______ 436.5
http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m50.htm
The US S50 should be the same as the VANOS M50 and the S52 should be very close to this weight as well.

Aluminum block M52B20 and M52B25
engine _______ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
VANOS _______ 166 _______ 366
Double VANOS _ 177 _______ 390.2
http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m52.htm

Aluminum block M52B28
engine _______ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
VANOS _______ 170 _______ 374.8
Double VANOS _ 180 _______ 396.8
http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m52.htm

engine _ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
M54 ___ 170 _______ 375
http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m54.htm

engine _ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
M60 ___ 210 _______ 463
http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m60.htm

M62
engine _____ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
non-VANOS _ 219 _______ 482.8
VANOS _____ 221 _______ 487.2
http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m62.htm


Weights reported by BMW found elsewhere:

engine _____ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
S85 ________ 240 _______ 529
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_BMWs-...4/article.html

engine _____ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
S65 ________ 202 _______ 445
http://www.e90fanatics.com/pdf/the_new_bmw_m3.pdf

engine _____ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
S54 ________ 217 _______ 478
http://www.e90fanatics.com/pdf/the_new_bmw_m3.pdf
(States the the S65 is 15kg/33lbs less than the S54)

engine _____ weight(kg) _ weight(lbs)
N52 ________ 161 ______ 354.9 - Update: 326 lbs / 148 kg according to latest update below
N54 ________ 195 ______ 430
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_N52
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_N54
http://www.mwerks.com/artman/publish...nter_960.shtml

Update - info on the new N20 engine!:
Quote:
The all-aluminum N20 I-4 is about 22 lbs. (10 kg) lighter than the N52. Overall, the engine weighs 304 lbs. (138 kg).
taken from -
http://wardsauto.com/news-amp-analys...ises-4-cyl-bar


I will add on to this list if I find anything else or if anyone else does.
Unfortunately I can't find anything for the older engines such as M10, M20, M30, and M42 that are reported by BMW documents or press releases like the ones above.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:17 PM   #2
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Fully dressed engine weights by r3v people and others:

Jean:
http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/show...17&postcount=3
M30 + G260 transmission = 540lbs
M10 + G240 transmission = 396lbs

Drew325is:
http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=99913
M20 = 180.3 kg = 397.49 lbs

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d6...52weigh_in.jpg
Aluminum block M52B28 = 148.85 kg = 328.16 lbs

Vorshlag:
http://vorshlag.smugmug.com/Projects...98_ovpJf-M.jpg
M20 + G260 transmission = 497lbs

http://vorshlag.smugmug.com/Projects..._w3v4X-M-1.jpg
M42 + 5 speed Getrag transmission = 419lbs + 8lbs intake = 427lbs
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:35 PM   #3
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So a M52B28 is lighter by about 100lbs than an M42.

Holy Fucking Shit!

I was only keeping the M42 because I thought it was the lightest engine but clearly I am wrong, well looks like engine swap might be in my future.

Edit: Scratch that noticed the M52 did not have the gearbox on it.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:39 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massimo View Post
So a M52B28 is lighter by about 100lbs than an M42.

Holy Fucking Shit!
Nope. Please read the text next to the weight.
The M42 weight includes it's transmission while the M52 weight does not.
Also the weights were taken by different people on different scales, so take it as you want. But both total weights are fully dressed.
But anyway, I do think the aluminum M52 is very close to or less than the M42.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:44 PM   #5
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And don't forget, that is the aluminum M52 - only a couple thousand or so of those were made in the US in the early Z3's. They are very rare and sought after and therefore more expensive.
You would be much better off getting a M54.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:12 PM   #6
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At 355lbs the N52 looks tempting.... 40 lbs lighter than an M20!
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:17 PM   #7
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How about @ 43 lbs more than than the feathery M20, M30 is God's gift to E30 and BMW in general.I'm a believer.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:22 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoveringuy View Post
At 355lbs the N52 looks tempting.... 40 lbs lighter than an M20!
It might actually be more than 40 lbs lighter..
The weight Drew325is posted for the aluminum M52 is a lot less than what BMW gives it as. And going by the BMW weights, the N52 is less than the aluminum M52.
So i'd say it's at least 70 lbs since that's the difference between his M20 and aluminum M52. And that's assuming the N52 is the same as the alu M52.
Also, BMW officially said the N52 is 22 lbs lighter than the M54, which is about the same as the aluminum M52.
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Old 05-30-2012, 07:27 PM   #9
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I'm currently deciding on spring rates for some coilovers and I'm trying to figure out the difference in weight between an M20 and S52.

I've done some reading and can't seem to come to any conclusions.

Assistance would be appreciated!
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Old 08-06-2012, 05:14 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjohnsons54 View Post
I'm currently deciding on spring rates for some coilovers and I'm trying to figure out the difference in weight between an M20 and S52.

I've done some reading and can't seem to come to any conclusions.

Assistance would be appreciated!
The Iron block US. M50/M52 engines are about 20-40 lbs more than the M20. People have weighted their car before and after and noticed less change in weight or no change in weight though, usually because they delete AC (~30 lbs) and/or other accessories when doing the swap.
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Old 08-06-2012, 06:11 AM   #11
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Update - info on the new N20 engine!:
Quote:
The all-aluminum N20 I-4 is about 22 lbs. (10 kg) lighter than the N52. Overall, the engine weighs 304 lbs. (138 kg).
taken from -
http://wardsauto.com/news-amp-analys...ises-4-cyl-bar


IMO this is the ultimate E30 engine swap for the best combination of low weight and power. Not to mention the best fuel economy.(who cares right, but it's a nice added benefit)

Lower weight in the front than a 318is along with a great torque curve? sign me up. Very underrated in stock form 240HP (they have been hitting almost that on the dyno at the wheels, stock) and they are making great gains with just a tune. Great gains with the aftermarket downpipes too.
http://www.f30post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=674439

With no lag and the torque coming on so early this is more than enough power for a E30 to put down well. Makes peak torque at 1250 RPM and holds it till 4800 RPM! The big thing here is the super lightweight front end you'll have.
Here's the technical doc.
http://bimmerboost.com/content.php?1...N52-comparison
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Old 08-06-2012, 09:33 AM   #12
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Wow, that's an excellent technical description of the N20; makes the older engines seem like obese porkers.. It will would be techincally challenging to run this motor without the stock ECU (it resides inside the intake!).

First question is how it would fit. Can anyone CAD model this? Issues would be the plastic oil pan on the subframe and the turbo hitting the shock tower.
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Old 08-06-2012, 09:47 AM   #13
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Old 08-06-2012, 12:18 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoveringuy View Post
Wow, that's an excellent technical description of the N20; makes the older engines seem like obese porkers.. It will would be techincally challenging to run this motor without the stock ECU (it resides inside the intake!).

First question is how it would fit. Can anyone CAD model this? Issues would be the plastic oil pan on the subframe and the turbo hitting the shock tower.
Ignoring fitment issues, assuming you could get a custom oil pan made, engine mount arms, etc... how would you approach running the engine?
Would you go a similar route as you did with your M54, using MS to control everything?
Or would go try to "dumb it down" and disable anything unnecessary that complicates things like locking the valvetronic and using an old school cable throttle body. (like with your M54 you just got it running on an M50 ecu first, then worked your way up, adding back features like DISA with your own made controller)
Or do you think it would be easier to swap over the whole electronic system and use as much as possible, and try to "delete" any inputs it needs that you can't give it such as a traction and stability control system and security (EWS)?
What do you see as the biggest challenges aside front any fitment issues?
It might be a pipe dream and unlikely that anyone does it, but it's none the less very interesting discussion being that you have experience with something like this.
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Old 08-06-2012, 01:57 PM   #15
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Direct Injection. Turbo. Valvetronic.

I just can't see that thing running right without the stock ECU. That said, anything is possible...
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