New Massive brake kits for e30s

[rob_e30]

Just to confirm, you have a racing BBK for an E30 325 with 15" Kosei K1 wheels? Your 325 kit is front only?

[Massive Lee]

Front kits only for now. The 0.81" kit works on Kosei K1s. No spacer with the NDL calipers, and 3 or 6mm spacer with the Superlite. Even the the 0.81" kit is not an easy fit-all-wheels.

I have profiles of the brake kits. They are the only sure way to know with which wheels the kits fit. I can email them and they need to be printed at 100% size. Cut them out and apply to your wheels.

With Team Dynamics Pro Sport 1, the 1.25" kit works with the Superlite calipers.

There will be a rear kit, but only for those running 16" wheels.
There will also possibly a cheaper kit with 11.75" x 0.81" for the rear. As say possibly as it is #5 on the list of products to come.

[rob_e30]

What kind of testing was done and what life cycle experience do you have with these?

[Massive Lee]

I have ran my own similar kit for 5 years on my 2002 racecar. The only difference between an e30 kit and the 2002 kit is the depth of the hat. I also have a bunch of e30 kits out there and was reported excellent results.

I have sold about 50 kits in the past years and was never reported any glitch/problem/failure. The only incident was three years ago when a customer got so confident with his brakes that he "forgot" to brake and crashed his car. He got replacement hats within 48 hours, in time for the next race.

My M3 kits are reported to be much better than other BBK which they replaced. My M3 kit with SL6R calipers has even replaced an ill-fitting AP Racing kit.

[Massive Lee]

BTW I earlier mentionned that my recommendation was toward using the Forged Superlite caliper as it is a very stiff caliper with proven track records. Those of you with space limitations can still use the Billet or cast NDL calipers, even though they don't offer the same stiffness. The NDL calipers are currently used by many kit manufacturers that catter to American iron, Miatas and MINIs. The Billet NDL caliper offers 5mm more clearance on each side, as well as a reduced radius. Wilwood still advertizes this component as a race caliper.

http://wilwood.com/Products/001-Calipers/017-BNDL/index.asp

http://wilwood.com/Products/001-Calipers/016-NDL/index.asp

[rob_e30]

Sorry, but I remain confused. The Racing kit (1.25) does not work with the K1's regardless of caliper?

[Massive Lee]

Hi Rob

The race kit requires 12mm spacers with Kosei K1s with et27 (what I had to test). Check the profiles in pdf format. I think I emailed them this morning. The race kit would require thinner spacers if used with NDL calipers. I tested my own K1s with 27mm offset on the e30 race kit. If e30 K1s have a different offset (perhaps et20), then the fit is easier.

Can you tell us what offset are the K1s for e30s?

K1s do have a lot of room behind the spokes, but the Team Dynamics Pro Sport 1.0 wheels are the clear winner in this department.

Picture from a 12.2" kit taken from FastBrake's website (free plug).

[e30_325es]

Where is the stiffness that you talk about felt and how do you rate it?

[Massive Lee]

Among other specifications, what makes a good caliper is its resistance against deflection when pressing hard on the brakes. Whatever pressure the brake pedal sends to the pads/rotors should not be absorbed by the brake lines or the expansion of the caliper. The extreme exemple is the Girling calipers on the early e30s. With a front wheel removed, have somebody press hard on the brake pedal, and witness the caliper carrier deflect. It is easily seen with your bare eyes. This deflection removes pressure applied to the pads, as well as washes out the braking modulation you can apply by having feedbacks from the brake pedal.

How to measure the stiffness? It is not difficult. Simply install a pressure gauge (300psi to 1500psi) inline in order to measure how much pressure is applied to the calipers. Apply different levels of pressure (300psi, 600psi, 900, psi 1200psi) and measure the deflection by using a digital caliper installed across the brake calipers.

[turbo_negro69]

Among other specifications, what makes a good caliper is its resistance against deflection when pressing hard on the brakes. Whatever pressure the brake pedal sends to the pads/rotors should not be absorbed by the brake lines or the expansion of the caliper. The extreme exemple is the Girling calipers on the early e30s. With a front wheel removed, have somebody press hard on the brake pedal, and witness the caliper carrier deflect. It is easily seen with your bare eyes. This deflection removes pressure applied to the pads, as well as washes out the braking modulation you can apply by having feedbacks from the brake pedal.

How to measure the stiffness? It is not difficult. Simply install a pressure gauge (300psi to 1500psi) inline in order to measure how much pressure is applied to the calipers. Apply different levels of pressure (300psi, 600psi, 900, psi 1200psi) and measure the deflection by using a digital caliper installed across the brake calipers.

wow! you're my new hero!
well hopefully when spring rolls around i'll be able to buy both your front and rear setups. they look very nice and it's obvious that you have put some R&D behind your product.:up:

[Massive Lee]

Thanks for the good word.

BTW The main motivation for making brake kits for the 318-325 e30s is that they are great cars with superb handling at the track (especially the 318is). So, they have style, handling, but damn, no brakes. Drive an e30 hard for a couple of laps, and everything falls apart, even with the best brake fluid and brake pads. I have tried everything on my H23. Went from Girling calipers to ATE (it got a bit better) but honestly, I felt I still got ripped off in the department of "velocity control"...

It is very difficult to design brakes for e30s as there is not much room.

[kowalski]

group buyy?

[Jean]

How is the fitment with Rota Slip or Grid wheels ?

Also, if a street kit is purchased can it later be upgraded to a race kit with the thicker rotors and calipers or will the calipers from the race kit not fit the street kit hardware ?

Thank you, can't wait to get a set for my car in a couple of months.

[Massive Lee]

Jean, if you want to know if the kits fit your wheels, simply email me and I will forward you the profiles in .pdf format. Irelands mentions on their website that the et20mm Minilites replica Rotas will clear Wilwood kits, but I have no experience.

The street kit uses an 0.81" thick rotor while the race kit uses a 1.25" thick rotors and shallower hat. For proper fitting hats and rotors cannot be interchanged. Nonetheless, somebody who starts with NDL calipers because of clearance restriction can later on, opt for the stiffer Superlite as they share the same mounting popints, offset and pad height.

Winter is quiet as people aren't yet at the step of building the brakes of their racecars. I currently only have two race kits and six street kits in stock. If more are required, It takes 3 weeks to produce more sets, including anodizing and shipping. I will have more pictures of both kits later this week.

[rob_e30]

The E30 Kosei K1's are ET 27. Can you detail my options?

Street rotor w/o spacers and NDL calipers
Street rotor w/ ??mm spacers and Superlite?
Race rotor w/ ??mm spacers and NDL calipers
Race rotor w/ ??mm spacers and Superlite (or will this work at all?)