Checking out an S52.. what should I look for?

[genocide98]

1998 S52b32us, approximately 55k on the clock. Head removed and exhaust valves are gone due to mechanical overrev (mis shift).

Here's my delima;

Owner says its been in storage (inside a shop/garage) for a couple years. What should I look for? I know I'm gonna check the pistons for any hawt piston/valve action, and check the cylinder walls which should look pretty good on a 55k motor. I've never even touched an S52, so I don't really know where any trouble spots might be, or where some identifying marks and serial numbers are.

Is there anything else I should be aware of on an engine that has been stored for a long period of time? I know there might be some surface rust, what is safe and what is bad? Can the head warp?

TL;DR-

Gonna go look a partially torn down S52 on friday, need to know what to look for on a mechanical over-rev and 1-3 years storage to make sure I'm not buying a worthless lump. I can deal with some valves and some head work.. but I'm not looking at rebuilding the bottom end if I can avoid it (like buying a motor w/o lots of issues.)

Thanks R3v, I'll be waiting for your reply.

[nextelbuddy]

look for any cracks in the head such as hairline fracutres etc and if you see none even if its slightly warped due to any type of over heating the machine shop can shave the head and depending on how much they take off you can compensate with a thicker head gasket to get back to factory compression or run lower compression pistons witha stock head gasket.

[genocide98]

look for any cracks in the head such as hairline fracutres etc and if you see none even if its slightly warped due to any type of over heating the machine shop can shave the head and depending on how much they take off you can compensate with a thicker head gasket to get back to factory compression or run lower compression pistons witha stock head gasket.

Ya, the PO didn't say anything about overheating it, but I'll be sure to look. maybe bring a magnifiying glass?

Anyone know where cracks pop up most often?

[hoveringuy]

I wouldn't worry about looking for cracks from overheating. You probably wouldn't see them, anyway. Why would P.O. have money-shifted if the car was overheating?

Bottom end is fine. Head needs some work, pistons need to be checked.. probably pulled to clean the bores.

I you want to get anal you could look in the pan or the oil filter for metal.

Get some pictures!

[genocide98]

I wouldn't worry about looking for cracks from overheating. You probably wouldn't see them, anyway. Why would P.O. have money-shifted if the car was overheating?

Bottom end is fine. Head needs some work, pistons need to be checked.. probably pulled to clean the bores.

I you want to get anal you could look in the pan or the oil filter for metal.

Get some pictures!

So I'll probably be looking at a hone and a re-ring in addition to the valves and gasket set if it was stored improperly?

Should I bother tearing it down and having it tanked, balanced, etc? or are they pretty solid from the factory?

I wonder if oversize valves would help any.. I guess that's a question for another thread.

Pictures.. maybe. If its in a useable/workable condition I'll probably just pick it up right then and then of course ;) I gotta start looking for another car, too, before I wrap too much $$ into this thing.. someone stacked mine up yesterday afternoon =/

[Adrian_Visser]

First maybe you should think about a budget.
You do a minor head rebuild and make sure the pistons aren't scuffed that=$
You do a minor head rebuild and rehone/ re-ring the block that=$$
You do serious headwork and blueprinting? that=$$$

If the engine really only has 55k on it you shouldn't have to re-hone and re-ring the bottom end unless a piston or two need to be replaced

[Farbin Kaiber]

I'd look to see that the third alpha in the VIN on the back of the head is an "S", I went thru three m52's with a wrecking yard because without coil covers they look similar.

[genocide98]

First maybe you should think about a budget.
You do a minor head rebuild and make sure the pistons aren't scuffed that=$
You do a minor head rebuild and rehone/ re-ring the block that=$$
You do serious headwork and blueprinting? that=$$$

If the engine really only has 55k on it you shouldn't have to re-hone and re-ring the bottom end unless a piston or two need to be replaced

My budget is as low as possible, which is why I'm looking at a motor in this condition anyway. I'm not interested in walking away with a motor that I have to dump thousands into, but if its just 'some assembly required' I'm game.

The only reason I'm considering oversized valves is because I'm already going to be replacing them. I'm not particularly interested in head work aside from valves and port matching. I think CC-ing and extensive porting/honing is out of my price range unless I manage to find someone to do it cheap while the head is off. I hear these heads are pretty well off from the factory, anyway.

My main concern would be deciding if the head work is worth it, or if the money would be better spent elsewhere... I'm just not sure how much benefit the S50/S52 will see from it. Can anyone point me in the right direction? I don't mind a bit of reading.. I just haven't found too much to be concrete.

[genocide98]

I'd look to see that the third alpha in the VIN on the back of the head is an "S", I went thru three m52's with a wrecking yard because without coil covers they look similar.

Are there any other easily identifiable marks?

[MR E30 325is]

Are there any other easily identifiable marks?

No there arent, they are almost identical on the outside. One of the only differences is the VIN, as previously stated. Check that to ensure you are getting exactly what you are being told you're getting.

[SiGmA_X]

Are there any other easily identifiable marks?

Being the head is off, look at the bore, side of block, filter housing, cams, and timing cover.

- Bore, S52's have a large bore with very small amount of material between cylinders, the stock number of 86.4mm is popping into my head. Its right around there. An M50/52 has a 84mm bore, its very obvious.
- Side of block, look for the crank sensor by #6 below the starter.
- Filter housing, S52's have metal housings, M52's have plastic. S50's/M50's also have the metal housing, so its not a dead give away.
- Cams, S52 is taller and broader, IIRC.
- Timing cover, This just tells between early/late, like the block mounted crank sensor - The OBD2 motor uses a plastic tube for coolant that pops into the timing cover, while the OBD1 motors have a nipple that comes out the back of the timing cover. Combined with the OBD2 cranksensor, you should easily be able to tell if its OBD1 or 2, and thus S50/52. Bore should tell you if its an M50/52 vs S50/52.

May I ask, how much are you being offered the motor for?

[genocide98]

Being the head is off, look at the bore, side of block, filter housing, cams, and timing cover.

- Bore, S52's have a large bore with very small amount of material between cylinders, the stock number of 86.4mm is popping into my head. Its right around there. An M50/52 has a 84mm bore, its very obvious.
- Side of block, look for the crank sensor by #6 below the starter.
- Filter housing, S52's have metal housings, M52's have plastic. S50's/M50's also have the metal housing, so its not a dead give away.
- Cams, S52 is taller and broader, IIRC.
- Timing cover, This just tells between early/late, like the block mounted crank sensor - The OBD2 motor uses a plastic tube for coolant that pops into the timing cover, while the OBD1 motors have a nipple that comes out the back of the timing cover. Combined with the OBD2 cranksensor, you should easily be able to tell if its OBD1 or 2, and thus S50/52. Bore should tell you if its an M50/52 vs S50/52.

May I ask, how much are you being offered the motor for?

anywhere from $1000-$1200 depending on condition. Is that a fair price?

[SiGmA_X]

Reasonable, I suppose. If you're on a budget, which it sounds like you are, if there is rust in bores I'd walk away. If it was oiled before storing, it'll be worth it. New (used) valves, valve guides, and a head surface/pressure test, and top end seal kit will set you back maybe $650-800? A $2000 S52 with a new top end will be pretty decent.

[genocide98]

Reasonable, I suppose. If you're on a budget, which it sounds like you are, if there is rust in bores I'd walk away. If it was oiled before storing, it'll be worth it. New (used) valves, valve guides, and a head surface/pressure test, and top end seal kit will set you back maybe $650-800? A $2000 S52 with a new top end will be pretty decent.

Should I offer less?

I was assuming surface rust wouldn't be a big deal so long as I could clean it up. If its gnarly I'd definitely steer clear.

Hopefully that isn't the case, I might be coming home with an S52 tonight.

EDIT:

I just realized i used to follow your turbo thread on bfc. Do you know anyone local who could hook up some machine or exhaust work in the future? My friend has a guy in Brush Prairie who hes quite satisfied with. I think he said his name was Sumner, worked on drag engines and whatnot... Ever heard of the guy?

[SiGmA_X]

You bring up a good point. SURFACE rust is ok - real rust is NOT. I've purchased 2 motors (one known bad, one claimed perfect..) that had rusty bores. They were NOT ok and required boring. They were both extreme cases, but buyer beware. I'd bring some scotchbrite and WD40 with you and see if it comes off with a VERY gentle application of scotchbrite. Well used or softer grade scotchbrite works well.

I'd always offer less, I like to lowball ;)

I used Steve's Machine in Tigard, and they did an okay job I believe. Verdict is out, and will be back once Bearing Service downtown looks at my block. Bearing Service is the go-to place here in Portland, to be honest. You don't have to think twice about their level of work. My shop has used them for ~25yrs, and a number of other shops use them for their typical customer work as well as race motors.

Exhaust, I used Columbia River Mandrel Bending back in 07 and they did an amazing job at a -reasonable- cost. My friend used A1 on Barbur and is very happy with them. If you need something done in about 2-4 weeks, shoot me a message, we'll have a lift in my friends shop and we have a TIG and everything else.