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NO CCV, i fail yet again. Educate me.

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    NO CCV, i fail yet again. Educate me.

    Second track event with my recently rebuild motor (<5k mi) a fellow driver (whom i passed ofcourse) approached me saying how i had spewed oil all over his bumper. Unbenounced to me, i checed my exhaust and sure enough, it filled my hand with liquid oil thus ending my weekend and explaining why i'm down 2.5qts of oil.

    Two things.
    One, i forgot to install the CCV i forgot that because it was solidly clogged i capped the (obd2) valve cover with a snug rubber cap temporarily. I forgot about this, was far too exited about my running car, and off i went.
    Two, i can't remember if this head has a check valve somewhere in the oil passages. I'm doubting whether i even have it. I got the head from somebody and just dropped it in place. It was surfaced, (mostly) bare and clean when i got it.

    I did a compression check and the numbers are between 192-203psig so that is good. I've changed the oil ever 1000mi since the rebuild, and the current oil is clean, see through still. I broke it in correctly with the correct petrol based oil. It now runs 10w30 mobil 1, i've run this in the past although people always ell me to run 10w40 (twice the price).

    So,
    I'm trying to understand what damage i could have caused to my engine (to the rings?) and what is the solution. My valves get reaaaally loud and take like 10mins of street driving to quiet down. I have good oil pressure and sport 9qts of oil (oil cooler onboard). This was basically its second track event since the rebuild. The first was a drift even with short (<35sec) runs hence i didnt notice the oil loss although the valves got lout towards the end of the day.

    Max oil temp i've seen is 230F, avg'd like 210F through the day. pressures ~40idle cold ~9hot gets around 90-100psig near redline. I may have been pressurizing my crank pushing oil past my rings. I'm not a mechanic nor a engine builder, but simply a guy that likes to get his hands dirty for the sake of learning.. and yes i rebuilt this engine myself and rings are sized properly. Help greatly appreciated.
    No more e30s for me.
    88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
    88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
    91 BMW 325i [sold]
    86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

    #2
    based on your saying that valves are extremely noisy, I'm going to guess the problems in the head. Oil may be being drawn past the valve stem seals on every intake stroke (rare), or the head gasket is bad (common). Check your coolant, see if there is any oil in it.

    Compression checks dont really tell you anything about your engine, they only show you the big picture that air is being compressed. What you really need to do is a leakdown test. With that you will be able to figure out exactly what is leaking, where its leaking and how much.

    Comment


      #3
      yeap i don't have a compressor so to do a leakdown... won't be easy, but i'm gonna have to borrow one and necessary hardware. As for the valve stem seals, they are brand spanking new but pressurizing my crank probably didn't help. I can see that passing oil. Coolant is free of oil. What about the check valve on the head is there one on our head i can't remember exactly if we/i even have it?

      edit: its called "non-return valve" p# 11121735180 (#2). its also on the bottom of the head so the head needs to come off for thisone. I really don't remember if i had it or not. I didn't check when i put this head on. This can be a contributing factor -.- but i'm not about to just take my head off to check. Any suggestions?

      of if pic gets unhosted: http://realoem.com/bmw/diagrams/d/h/1.png
      Last edited by etxxz; 09-26-2010, 08:46 PM.
      No more e30s for me.
      88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
      88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
      91 BMW 325i [sold]
      86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
      http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

      Comment


        #4
        Lets try this again.

        1) What can happen from not having a CCV and running it like the madman that i am?

        2) What can happen if i don't have the non-return valve? How can i check if i have it without having to remove the head?
        No more e30s for me.
        88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
        88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
        91 BMW 325i [sold]
        86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
        http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

        Comment


          #5
          I run no ccv... Probobly need to add it in. I just have the line that would normally go to the ccv routed directly to my intake. Gets a bit of oil in the TB boot though every once in a while. Once again not sure if this is correct just what I have been runnin on my obd1 m52.

          Comment


            #6
            well ive never had to take my head off but a quick search suggests that the check valve maintains oil pressure to the lifters: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=827803
            sounds like it may be related to your "valve noise" if it sounds like lifter tick. and if your valve cover was plugged then your crankcase pressure has nowhere to go except bad places. :razz: so your guess that oil may be pushing past the valve seals is what im also guessing could be the problem. you should probably hook up the ccv or a filter to let the valve cover vent and just drive it some more while monitoring the oil consumption. as for checking for the presence of the check valve well you know what has to be done. :(

            Comment


              #7
              i'm dumb. i'm real dumb. fo real. That's what i get for trying to remove, tear down, rebuild, install and get running an s52 obd2 swap in two weeks with parts that aren't mine. OK, i gotta do what i gotta do. That probably addresses the valve tick. The lack of CCV addresses oil consumption. I need to do these two before i ask anything else.

              i get the feeling like the general consensus is no engine damage on pressurizing the crank. Hot Sauce!

              LR
              No more e30s for me.
              88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
              88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
              91 BMW 325i [sold]
              86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
              http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

              Comment


                #8
                so i'm in the process of tearing down my engine. with the head just about to come off i decided to borrow some hardware and do a Leak Down.

                1 4%
                2 5%
                3 4%
                4 26% - spark plug was drenched in oil too.
                5 5%
                6 2%

                so something's going on with 4, and its neither intake or exhaust valves. I put rings on this engine using the same method and boring as the other guys. What are my options here?

                Head is coming off for the check valve. So i could remove, re-measure bore and taper, can't say what this next step(s) will be until i measure, basically ends in re-ringing this cyl... what a pain in the ass. Third time i gotta deal with this fricking motor since my oil pump failed. I just wanna race it!
                No more e30s for me.
                88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
                88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
                91 BMW 325i [sold]
                86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
                http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

                Comment


                  #9
                  shit man! sorry to hear you have had such bad luck luis. that sucks serious ass. i guess you won't know the exact problem until you tear it down. keep us posted
                  sigpic
                  Gigitty Gigitty!!!!

                  88 cabrio becoming alpina b6 3.5s transplanted s62
                  92 Mtech 2 cabrio alpinweiss 770 code
                  88 325ix coupe manual lachsilber/cardinal
                  88 325ix coupe manual diamondschwartz/natur
                  87 e30 m3 for parts lachsilber/cardinal(serial number 7)
                  12 135i M sport cabrio grey/black

                  Comment


                    #10
                    oh boy..


                    oil scraper ring on cyl 4:


                    leads to this:



                    skirts



                    top third of the oil ring broken/missing


                    piston deformed/damaged


                    currently bore looks like this after careful honing:



                    i need to measure, but intuition tells me its not going to meet spec (bore OR taper)
                    No more e30s for me.
                    88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
                    88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
                    91 BMW 325i [sold]
                    86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
                    http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

                    Comment


                      #11
                      those vertical scratches are not good. That needs a rebore, not just a hone.

                      as far as not having crankcase ventilation, you'll get a lot more blowby/oil leaks without it. It's definitely a must- have.
                      Build thread

                      Bimmerlabs

                      Comment


                        #12
                        thanks nando.

                        I finally measured the bore and taper and it was bad. Very bad, specially along the less smoother areas, some measurements reaching into the 86.58-86.63mm. This block may need to go as far as 87mm, and even then, who knows. IMHO, stroking this already stroked block is not worth it, even raising compression. The gain vs cash spent is just not worth it. This block is worth more melted ; /

                        Luckally enough, i have my old block sitting in my garage which is a perfectly good block. The one i'm using came with my head. I think another $400-500 (200 of which are rings) i can get this bad boy running again. Everything else is pretty much "new" already. Third dime is the charm!!
                        No more e30s for me.
                        88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
                        88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
                        91 BMW 325i [sold]
                        86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
                        http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

                        Comment

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