[HOW TO] e46m3 6-speed your e30

[TheRealE30kidd]

So, perhaps we should give the E46 M3 slave cylinder a try?

Tried swapping rod in the E46 slave with the E36 and still the same problem 90% free play until clutch engages.

[frantic]

I think the main reason you couldn't was because the clutch line uses a different fitting on the E46 M3 one. It could be as simple as comparing rod length between them as the actual slave itself looks very much the same length.

I'm just checking with a local wrecker who will hopefully have both and could compare. That 1/8th difference (3.1mm), might just be the difference it needs.

[e30austin]

^ +1

I am using a 420G, with a E46 M3 Flywheel / clutch and E36 325i Slave, E30 MC. The biting point is about 1/4 up from the floor. Just doesn't feel right.

I'm thinking I'd either have to look at a longer slave cylinder push rod, or a longer throwout bearing.

Anyone ever compare e46 m3 and e36 325i slave cylinders side by side for lengths?

*Edit never mind scrolled up, So the rod is shorter...hmmmm.

So, perhaps we should give the E46 M3 slave cylinder a try?

[jph]

Also in for answers as I am about to swap in an S52 with G420. Was under the impression any slave cylinder with a rod longer than the E36 325i would not allow the clutch to fully engage but it seems like the shorter rod length of the 325i slave cylinder could be in question here.

[frantic]

^ +1

I am using a 420G, with a E46 M3 Flywheel / clutch and E36 325i Slave, E30 MC. The biting point is about 1/4 up from the floor. Just doesn't feel right.

I'm thinking I'd either have to look at a longer slave cylinder push rod, or a longer throwout bearing.

Anyone ever compare e46 m3 and e36 325i slave cylinders side by side for lengths?

*Edit never mind scrolled up, So the rod is shorter...hmmmm.

[e30austin]

Hey guys, having a clutch issue here that I would like to get to the bottom of.

Car is an '88 touring with an OBD1 S52, E46 M3 Valeo dual mass flywheel, E46 M3 sachs clutch, pressure plate, pilot bearing, throw out bearing and G420 trans. We used all new parts for everything. Master cylinder is stock e30 and slave cylinder is for a e36 325i manual.

Simply, the clutch feels like fucking shit. Shit tons of free play and minimal engagement at the bottom of the pedal. Theres no air in the system anywhere. We've bled it 20+ times, reverse bled it and used a pressure bleeder at 12 psi and it didn't lose any pressure.

I'm at a loss of what to do. I know people have complained about the slave pedal feel. What do you recommend I do at this point? I almost think the slave isnt making very good contact, but really have no idea.

Thanks.

[Wanganstyle]

My twin turbo clutch had 22 splines.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jph]

Bmw has the answers to your questions; it's really only just variations on a product line theme.

\

SAC and CDV are 2 completely different cans of worms; you should probably spend some time reading on the E39 boards in regards to the SAC and its function.

if you have driven a properly maintained E39m5 or E46m3 with original clutch you have driven a SAC clutch; its not like they fail often; more like the owners destroy the car and everything fails.

Do you have a turbocharged engine or NA engine? This would make a big ass difference for gearing choice of the box; turbo gearboxes from BMW have ratios to suit turbo engines...

The S52 I'm building will eventually be supercharged, but at lower boost levels of around 6-7 psi. I have the ZHP trans and a new OEM M54B30 DM flywheel. Still trying to figure out the best clutch and pressure plate setup though. Sounds like a 135i clutch+pressure plate is the easiest and most OEM way to get me additional clamping force over the ZHP clutch+PP setup, but also not opposed to aftermarket solutions as long as they are daily driver tolerable. At under $400 the 135i equipment seems reasonably priced. I am open to any suggestions!

EDIT: Just realized the 135i clutch has a 26 spline input shaft center. The ZHP trans has a 22 spline. Thought you said the 135i clutch was a good option? Did I miss something?

[Wanganstyle]

Bmw has the answers to your questions; it's really only just variations on a product line theme.

So by using the ZHP flywheel and 135i clutch and pressure plate combo I will get a stronger clutch but not be able to avoind the SAC feature? Are there really any MAJOR drawbacks to the SAC when the CDV is deleted? Can I expect a vague clutch engagement running this combo?

One last question: I have a lead on a 135i manual transmission from a 2010 N54 powered car with only 19K miles on it. You had previously stated that this transmission would bolt up to the S52. Does the input shaft have the correct configuration and length to be able to use the ZHP flywheel with the pilot bearing installed in the flywheel and the 135i clutch/PP combo? Would I be better off sticking with the ZHP trans I have already with 102K miles?

How about the mount to the chassis? Same steps to mount it as the ZHP?

\

SAC and CDV are 2 completely different cans of worms; you should probably spend some time reading on the E39 boards in regards to the SAC and its function.

if you have driven a properly maintained E39m5 or E46m3 with original clutch you have driven a SAC clutch; its not like they fail often; more like the owners destroy the car and everything fails.

Do you have a turbocharged engine or NA engine? This would make a big ass difference for gearing choice of the box; turbo gearboxes from BMW have ratios to suit turbo engines...

[jph]

135i only came with 22 spline invouluted type

You cannot bolt a 135 flywheel to a non n54/n55 engine. ring gear offset is also totally wrong.

You can bolt a m54b30 330i zhp 6 speed flywheel to any m54/m52/s54/s52

The 135i/335i oem clutch set (pressure plate+friction disc) will work with oem BMW m54b30 flywheel.

Oem BMW pressure plates from e39++newer are self adjusting

So by using the ZHP flywheel and 135i clutch and pressure plate combo I will get a stronger clutch but not be able to avoind the SAC feature? Are there really any MAJOR drawbacks to the SAC when the CDV is deleted? Can I expect a vague clutch engagement running this combo?

One last question: I have a lead on a 135i manual transmission from a 2010 N54 powered car with only 19K miles on it. You had previously stated that this transmission would bolt up to the S52. Does the input shaft have the correct configuration and length to be able to use the ZHP flywheel with the pilot bearing installed in the flywheel and the 135i clutch/PP combo? Would I be better off sticking with the ZHP trans I have already with 102K miles?

How about the mount to the chassis? Same steps to mount it as the ZHP?

[Wanganstyle]

I personally used an unsprung clutch and non-SAC pressure plate with an OEM dual mass flywheel on my old ZHP when I turbocharged and needed a stronger clutch. It was the Sachs Race Engineering setup. Very nice feel and the pedal was a bit stiffer but not unbearable. I would do this again in a heartbeat except the clutch and PP alone cost over $1K, not to mention the new OEM FW at $500. I would like to be able to run an OEM E46 330 FW with a non-SAC PP again. Can I get there using the 135i clutch plate on the OEM DM FW or would I need to run the OEM 135i PP as well?

Does anyone know if the 135i clutch plate has the 22 spline mount?

135i only came with 22 spline invouluted type

You cannot bolt a 135 flywheel to a non n54/n55 engine. ring gear offset is also totally wrong.

You can bolt a m54b30 330i zhp 6 speed flywheel to any m54/m52/s54/s52

The 135i/335i oem clutch set (pressure plate+friction disc) will work with oem BMW m54b30 flywheel.

Oem BMW pressure plates from e39++newer are self adjusting

[jph]

With any zf or getrag 6 speed you can:

run a e36/46 g250 or zf320 slave; it works just fine. Different bores but it allows you to tune to own liking.

330i flywheel will be LIGHTEST duam mass @ 20# but only accept self adjust pressure plate ( SAC)

Only the friction disc must match the trans splines.

You could also run aftermarket if desired.

For a street car there are many options. If driven with precision a m20 stock fly+clutch can handle a s52b32 in race situations

I personally used an unsprung clutch and non-SAC pressure plate with an OEM dual mass flywheel on my old ZHP when I turbocharged and needed a stronger clutch. It was the Sachs Race Engineering setup. Very nice feel and the pedal was a bit stiffer but not unbearable. I would do this again in a heartbeat except the clutch and PP alone cost over $1K, not to mention the new OEM FW at $500. I would like to be able to run an OEM E46 330 FW with a non-SAC PP again. Can I get there using the 135i clutch plate on the OEM DM FW or would I need to run the OEM 135i PP as well?

Does anyone know if the 135i clutch plate has the 22 spline mount?

[Wanganstyle]

Does this only apply to the E46 M3 six speed? I have a 330 ZHP ZF transmission. It makes sense I would want to use the slave cylinder designed for that transmission when I install it in my S52 E30. Is this logic wrong? I was planning on running a stock E46 330 flywheel and 135i clutch as I have heard this is a good combo. Does clutch/pressure plate choice factor in to which slave setup is best?

With any zf or getrag 6 speed you can:

run a e36/46 g250 or zf320 slave; it works just fine. Different bores but it allows you to tune to own liking.

330i flywheel will be LIGHTEST dual mass @ 20# but only accept self adjust pressure plate ( SAC)

Only the friction disc must match the trans splines.

You could also run aftermarket if desired.

For a street car there are many options. If driven with precision a m20 stock fly+clutch can handle a s52b32 in race situations

[jph]

Just a quick update for anyone doing this swap and gathering parts. I've purchased a custom brace from Tyler at ArcAsylum that I'm very pleased with. Also if you follow most post about the slave cylinders for the e36 325is, the E36 M3, and the E46 M3 having the same rod lenth they are wrong. The one you definitely need is the E36 325is slave. This particular slave is just over 3/16 of an inch shorter than the E36 M3 slave. Using the E36 M3 slave will cause the clutch not fully disengage and clutch slipping will occure. Ask me how I know this.

Does this only apply to the E46 M3 six speed? I have a 330 ZHP ZF transmission. It makes sense I would want to use the slave cylinder designed for that transmission when I install it in my S52 E30. Is this logic wrong? I was planning on running a stock E46 330 flywheel and 135i clutch as I have heard this is a good combo. Does clutch/pressure plate choice factor in to which slave setup is best?

[SmokeE30]

Can the e46 m3 slave cylinder be used?

You can use the standard e36/46 g220 or ZF slave, Jim H at Kassle Performance is using one with his 6speed kit