Suspension Questions and DIY?

[Jglaze]

Hello there everyone. I just got back from my local mechanic and am the recipient of a $2,900 parts/labor estimate that has directed me to seek your counsel regarding my suspension set up and how much (if any) of the labor costs I can remove by doing some work myself.

First a little background on the car in question. I have a 88 ix with 179,xxx on the clock. A lot of the bushings and minor suspension pieces are reasonably new on the car, but the main working parts of the rig are mostly original (I purchased the car at 135,xxx) and are pretty worn. The shop suggests new shocks, front control arms, and a couple other minor pieces. I should note that the quote above covers OEM parts.

My questions are thus: One, given the fact that I'm set to swap out my entire suspension and I'm inclined to upgrade rather than replace, what would you recommend as a good suspension set up for a car that will see a 50/50 split of track and street duty? This isn't going to be a full race car, nor will it be a daily driver, but something that is a little compliant for Bay Area roads would be good. Also, full coilovers aren't really my thing as I don't feel a need for constant height adjustment... My mechanic recommended the H&R cup kit if not going OEM, but I don't see the full kit available for the ix.

Side note (question 1a), the car came with Momo aftermarkets (15x7 I think, no clue on offset)...very 80s...and my mechanic was recommending changing these because they were wearing out the suspension and would be hard to align. True or is he just avoiding work?

And, two, what of this might be DIY to save me some cashola? I've read through some of EyExR's posts and maybe it's the level of detail he includes (h/t to the beer pictures) but I'm concerned that this work may be above my pay grade. I change my own oil, have replacee a EGFR sensor and alternator in an S-10, and helped swap a clutch in a '81 VW Rabbit for reference. I don't have a garage or a lot of specialized tools, but I don't necessarily see these as rate limiting steps.

OK, that was really long, and if you've read to this point, go ahead and give yourself a pat on the back. If you feel inclined to go one step further and reply with helpful advice, make that two pats.

Thanks in advance - jg

[nando]

wow.. $3k? I'm pretty surey ou could drop your car off at Ground Control and they could build a full custom suspension for your car for way less than that!

what's the offset on those wheels? 15x7 is the stock size so that's not going to cause any extra wear. They might be extra heavy.

I'd say, H&R sports, and bilstein HD's with the internal bumpstops trimmed, and just new stock parts otherwise (sway links, control arms). I like M3 control arm bushings but that may be above and beyond for you.

Defintely not an H&R cup kit. way, way too soft, way way too low for an ix. I bet if you put the car on the ground with a cup kit, the car wouldn't even sit on the springs, it'd have the car's full weight on the strut inserts.

is this your only car? the suspension isn't really that hard to work on, and there are people here that can guide you through it.

Is there a harbor freight near you? they stock a couple tools that are cheap and very useful for ix suspension.

it might be helpful to know exactly *what* you need to replace, there's a lot of parts but some of them don't wear as fast as others.

[frankenbeemer]

it might be helpful to know exactly *what* you need to replace, there's a lot of parts but some of them don't wear as fast as others.

Maybe scan and post up your estimate?

[Jglaze]

what's the offset on those wheels? 15x7 is the stock size so that's not going to cause any extra wear. They might be extra heavy.

I double checked them yesterday and they're actually 15x6.5 et40. What is the stock offset for the 15x7s?

I'd say, H&R sports, and bilstein HD's with the internal bumpstops trimmed, and just new stock parts otherwise (sway links, control arms). I like M3 control arm bushings but that may be above and beyond for you.

Yeah, that's the theme I've been gathering from the board and seems to be the way folks go for their cars, but I wasn't sure if most of them were doing it for show or for performance. Also good to know about the cup kit...

is this your only car? the suspension isn't really that hard to work on, and there are people here that can guide you through it.

Is there a harbor freight near you? they stock a couple tools that are cheap and very useful for ix suspension.

No, this car has become the toy. Fortunately for me, this means the Audi Ur-S6 Avant becomes my daily and we'll find a new car for my wife. Harbor freight is drivable and there is actually a BMW salvage yard near the harbor freight, so I may even be able to source some of the stock parts that way to save a little more money.

it might be helpful to know exactly *what* you need to replace, there's a lot of parts but some of them don't wear as fast as others.

I'll probably take it over to my regular mechanic next week to get a second opinion, but he's a BMW only guy, so he could probably give me a good run down on all the parts needed. Plus, he's the sort that would rather help me figure this out on my own and keep the car running as opposed to gouging me for money. As he puts it, "I make all my money off the new BMWs and Minis." Then he'll offer to buy my car...them boys love the ix.

Thanks for the notes.

[Jglaze]

Also, regarding the Bilstein HDs, I believe those are non adjustables. Has anyone tried the Koni sports on the ix? The external adjustments seem like they'd be nice to have when switching from track to autox to street.

The Koni site also recommends removing the bump stops, but only on the rear.

[supernaughtIX]

The Koni's are adjsutable, but the Bilsteins are not bad when paired with the H&Rs right out of the box - as long as the front bump stops are trimmed. Otherwise you ride the bump stops all the time.

I have done several iX teardowns and installs in grass and gravel, no garage for me either, it is possible, you will just need some tools. If I had a budget of 3k for my suspension I could go a long way. You could get custom valved billies or konis, coilovers, swaybars, strut bars, poly bushings all around, new balljoints, adjustable trailing arm bushings, camber/castor plates....

What it boils down to is where you absolutely need to replace, upgrade if you can. If they are telling you that 15x6.5 et40 wheels are hurting your suspension, go somewhere else.

Where you might be hitting some cost hurdles is if you have rotten strut housing tops where the strut collar threads into the tube. Its not as easy a fix, but can be done.

But listen to nando, he knows the most of any ix owner ive seen - particularly when it comes to suspension

[nando]

Also, regarding the Bilstein HDs, I believe those are non adjustables. Has anyone tried the Koni sports on the ix? The external adjustments seem like they'd be nice to have when switching from track to autox to street.

The Koni site also recommends removing the bump stops, but only on the rear.

you won't need the adjustability, ever.

[EyExR]

CALL Ground Control and have a chat. I would go coilovers if you are upgrading. They now have iX camber plates too.

Take a look at my links below for details on restoring your suspension. It's iX specific and there's a ton of stuff you can do while you're in there. I think I addressed most things. I decided to go stock to keep costs down some but mostly to see and feel what the car was like new. Finishing an engine and tranny rebuild now. I will post that job as well.... stay tuned

[nando]

I'm going with custom valved bilstiens this time around, shortened 2". Waaaay cheaper than koni race inserts, since you can find used ix HDs for under $200. I should end up with all 4 custom built for less than just front konis.

The gc camber plates are awesome, but i only reccomend them with shorter inserts and shortened housings, not with stock length struts.

[Stabmasterflex]

Im riding on bump stops in the front. What/how do you trim the internal bump stops on my new bilsteins? Is this posted somewhere?

[Jglaze]

So I've been considering going the route Nando suggests given my specific needs. That said, I just saw this pop up in the FS threads and was curious to know if they'd likely fit on an iX: http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=257480

My guess is "no", but for the price I'd be silly not to ask.

-jg

[nando]

So I've been considering going the route Nando suggests given my specific needs. That said, I just saw this pop up in the FS threads and was curious to know if they'd likely fit on an iX: http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=257480

My guess is "no", but for the price I'd be silly not to ask.

-jg

the springs work but the front inserts, definitely not. the rates are really too soft for the ix anyway.

you either want koni race inserts or ix bilsteins shortened 2". I just went through this with bilstein, so they should know exactly what to do now that they've done one. Then you have to shorten the housings to match the inserts you get (koni race inserts are 2.1" shorter, bilstein could be anything you want basically, but I went for 2").

Modifying ix bilsteins is significantly cheaper (look for a used set to rebuild, they're cheap). expect a 6-8 week wait..

[Jglaze]

the springs work but the front inserts, definitely not. the rates are really too soft for the ix anyway.

you either want koni race inserts or ix bilsteins shortened 2". I just went through this with bilstein, so they should know exactly what to do now that they've done one. Then you have to shorten the housings to match the inserts you get (koni race inserts are 2.1" shorter, bilstein could be anything you want basically, but I went for 2").

Modifying ix bilsteins is significantly cheaper (look for a used set to rebuild, they're cheap). expect a 6-8 week wait..

Easy answer...and certainly one that I expected.

Turner sells the HDs and springs as a kit for the ix - other than trimming the bump stops, do I need to do anything to the housings in order to install that setup out of the box?

How much did bilstein charge for the rebuild? What springs are you planning on running?

-jg

[nando]

Easy answer...and certainly one that I expected.

Turner sells the HDs and springs as a kit for the ix - other than trimming the bump stops, do I need to do anything to the housings in order to install that setup out of the box?

How much did bilstein charge for the rebuild? What springs are you planning on running?

-jg

should just drop right in

it was $350 for the set, plus $25 shipping. I'm currently running 500f 600r, but I might drop the fronts down to 450 depending on if I can get the E46 swaybar bushings sorted (looking for a 21.5mm front swaybar vs the stock 17mm).

[Jglaze]

should just drop right in

it was $350 for the set, plus $25 shipping. I'm currently running 500f 600r, but I might drop the fronts down to 450 depending on if I can get the E46 swaybar bushings sorted (looking for a 21.5mm front swaybar vs the stock 17mm).

Great thanks. I'll probably just go with the kit from Turner rather than noodling with a custom setup for now...I'd rather have a "known" baseline first and then can adjust as needed.

Does the larger front sway help with understeer significantly? I'm not having huge problems with that currently, but with the stock setup my bigger concern is body roll....