m20 tweaks

[nando]

I think the high beam removal would work well to increase air flow, but it should only be done if you have a conical high flow air filter.

it doesn't improve airflow, even with no AFM and a cone filter.

It does reduce intake temps.

if you already have them, use them. I just wouldn't reccomend them as an "upgrade" for somebody with perfectly good stock wires. Even if the quality was better, there's no gains to be had.

[Aptyp]

Um... define "stock."

Stock cam, new stock pistons, stock crank stock rods, stock lifters. STOCK.

All rods were match-balanced and forge ridges polished, all ports were polished and matched. Rocker arms were polished. Oh, and it got a scraper.

Internally, as far as all parts go, engine was "stock", it just took man hours to put together. Flywheel during testing was stock weight. That engine really purred. It didn't get headers, nor a larger throttle. Package is called "Stage 3, Clean Air". But as I was saying, all that power is inside. You can take all your accessories off, and put all kinds of "tweaks", and you max gain would be around 20hp. I'll be doing my build in the very near future, and I'll be doing everything to Korman specs. I'll take as many pics as I can for you guys.

My plan is to turbo, but I'll be breaking engine in and tuning it with MS without one.

[RobE30]

^^interesting....I'm going to search for more info on that

[NeoMishMoo]

it doesn't improve airflow, even with no AFM and a cone filter.

It does reduce intake temps.

Apologies, I meant that it would increase air flow (cooler air flow) to the filter, I didn't mean that it would increase airflow to the engine, but I see how it read like that.

[delatlanta1281]

Nando
Do you ever get sick of repeating yourself day after day? You should make a word doc and just link it to threads like this!

[Wh33lhop]

Stock cam, new stock pistons, stock crank stock rods, stock lifters. STOCK.

All rods were match-balanced and forge ridges polished, all ports were polished and matched. Rocker arms were polished. Oh, and it got a scraper.

Internally, as far as all parts go, engine was "stock", it just took man hours to put together. Flywheel during testing was stock weight. That engine really purred. It didn't get headers, nor a larger throttle. Package is called "Stage 3, Clean Air". But as I was saying, all that power is inside. You can take all your accessories off, and put all kinds of "tweaks", and you max gain would be around 20hp. I'll be doing my build in the very near future, and I'll be doing everything to Korman specs. I'll take as many pics as I can for you guys.

My plan is to turbo, but I'll be breaking engine in and tuning it with MS without one.

Bone stock head? Stock intake manifold and injectors? Stock exhaust? Stock engine management?

You say it's stock but mention tuning, port and polish, internal lightening etc. What, all in all, did they do to this M20 from fully stock to get it to 200hp? From what you are saying it sounds like they've got a standalone and head work.

[nando]

Bone stock head? Stock intake manifold and injectors? Stock exhaust? Stock engine management?

You say it's stock but mention tuning, port and polish, internal lightening etc. What, all in all, did they do to this M20 from fully stock to get it to 200hp? From what you are saying it sounds like they've got a standalone and head work.

yeah I still don't believe it. I'd love to see a dyno plot though.

the stock cam, airbox and AFM are pretty restrictive for the amount of air you'd need to support 200hp. the AFM and airbox sucked about 20whp off my engine alone. inline 6's are inherently balanced, so just doing a basic balancing on the bottom end isn't going to make an enormous difference. there are some gains to be had by porting/polishing the head but basically the intake ports are already huge and the only real way to take advantage of them is with a bigger cam.

Then there's the stock injectors, which can support more fuel with a bit more pressure, but they already run at a very high duty cycle stock and getting 200hp out of them isn't neccesarily easy, if it's even possible.

the intake manifold is actually pretty good and produces a strong 2nd reflection through the M20's torque peak. But the stock cam will peter out after 6k, even with forced induction, and without spinning it faster I just don't see how you'd get 200hp out of 2.5l of displacement without something more than a P&P and balance.

[Wh33lhop]

I've got it

Bone stock M20

With an extra belt, pulley and "accessory"

And as long as you only feed it air with preatomized fuel in it

[DmcL]

best cheap-ish performance mods IMO.

chip
4.10 diff
z3m shifter and little frankensteining to get it to fit if necessary
full exhaust system
shim rear roller brackets on the hood and cut out the middle section of scuttle panel weather seal (free and massively improves cooling and reversible)
cone or mushroom filter (mushroom if going the air feed route and not pulling the high beam)
try to make it a ram air style of intake if possible, more power at higher speeds

i have everything mentioned above done bar the full system but am wanting more but without spending a fortune. ideally would like boost but my wallet is telling me to go with teh giggle gas for those times where that extra get up and go is necessary. unsure on how much i can safely run with a wet kit and possibly a progressive controller. hoping at least 50hp.

[nando]

high beam intake doesn't provide a ram effect, already mentioned that. it only reduces intake temps, which it's quite effective at.

[Aptyp]

Bone stock head? Stock intake manifold and injectors? Stock exhaust? Stock engine management?

You say it's stock but mention tuning, port and polish, internal lightening etc. What, all in all, did they do to this M20 from fully stock to get it to 200hp? From what you are saying it sounds like they've got a standalone and head work.

Engine got a chip after it was broken in. It was a Korman chip, but it's really AA one. Injectors remained stock, and dyno exhaust was a straight pipe.


Head got a lot work. Like I was saying, it took manhours, but there weren't after market parts inside of the engine. Stock AFM was on as well.

Also, during dyno, we tested stock air box and a cone... Box had better torque through out it's range, but cone had a lot more horse power.

[nando]

yeah, still don't believe it without seeing a chart. I'm sure it was healthy, I just don't see 200hp out a stock cam that doesn't make power past 6k.

was that measured on an engine dyno or a chassis dyno?

[BützBöb]

M30 AFM is the biggest hack job mod you can do to the M20. It's not meant for the motor, the ECU isn't programmed for it and you're basically playing russian roulette with your AFR.

kinda reviving a dead thread here but I am curious.
I have read about people swapping to an M30 AFM on the M20 motor and am wondering if this is a legit mod. I have heard good and bad so I would just like to get peoples opinions on this.

Is it worth it? Pros/cons?

tia

[genocide98]

Its a legit mod.. It certainly wont HURT your car.

But like most people here are saying..

You wont really see much power out of an M20- built or not. Unless you force-feed it, you're going to be putting down less than 200hp to the wheels at best.

Minor mods here and there might add up, but it begs the question- Is it worth all the time and money to get 10-15 hp out of bolt-ons? Yeah, you can extrude hone the intake, big bore throttle, miller MAF & intake, work the head w/ valves, lifters, wild cam, injectors, tune, underdrive/ligthweight pulleys, lightened flywheel, headers and an exhaust.. but at the end of the day you're still only rocking like 30-40hp over stock and you just dumped $,$$$ into your car...

Alone, most of these mods don't do anything. Even when combined, they do very little, and without a tune they are extremely ineffective. Even when modded you wont have significantly more power over a well maintained stock motor, maybe 20% if its fully built, probably closer to 5% if it's just intake, tune and tune-up...

[Paukert11]

Another good cheap mod, is rm racing adj cam gear. You can adjs the timing and all that jazz to help you with your lovely hp. R-Mracing cam gear is really meant for turbo. But its also a good cheap mod to get you ready for turbo.