Introduction and question

[hpde30]

Hello,

The is my first post on the forum. I'm glad I found this place because there is a lot of info available here, more so than any other forum I've visited. I'm going to like this place.

I just recently picked up an 89 325is, which I am in the process of doing all the regular maintenance on before I deem it road worthy. My car has A/C and the PO said it use to blow ICE COLD, whether or not I believe him is another story. On the ride home from purchasing the car it was only blowing warm air and the PO said it just needed a recharge. My dilemma is whether to remove the AC or not...

I got this car to eventually become a dedicated HPDE/TT car, so in time it will have the interior stipped and a cage/seat installed. That is at least a year away though and until that time comes I will be driving it on the street to and from the track, as well as DD'ing it a little, and I would like to be as comfortable as possible when doing so.

Would it be worth it to keep the AC and recharge it with R134a? Assuming the system has no leaks, how long will a recharge last if its already filled with R12? I've read R134a will eventually degrade the seals in an R12 system. I'm assuming if the PO ever recharged it he used R134a, so that process is probably already started and could be why its not holding a charge to begin with. I have everything apart now while I'm doing the timing belt, so removal of the compressor and other related parts would be a snap, but if a recharge will last me thru the summer then I can probably hold off until I'm ready. I need some advice please...

[Sagaris]

If you want to recharge, look into Freeze-12. It works incredibly well and saves you from having to convert the system in case the PO actually didnt. I was on the fence about removing the A/C as well but I did it and haven't looked back. The weight reduction and increased ability to change direction every day of the year are worth the handful of days that I might be stuck in traffic and a bit uncomfortable without A/C. If you have a child that you transport in the car regularly then maybe you will want to keep the A/C in there.

[hpde30]

thanks for the input. I don't know why I was having such an issue with pulling the AC or not. I guess I just felt the need to keep the car as original as possible considering the PO did the same. I wound up keepin the AC system intact. I will just get a new belt and try to recharge it. I only need it to last me 1 year then its coming out anyways when the cage and stuff go in, lol.

[StereoInstaller1]

Find a beater to make into a track car, leave the reasonably unmolested car stock-ish.

You will be happier in the long run.

Luke

[hpde30]

I don't want a beater as a track car, that is just asking for problems and down time. Reliable, well maintained street cars make the best track cars.

[StereoInstaller1]

I don't want a beater as a track car, that is just asking for problems and down time. Reliable, well maintained street cars make the best track cars.

Yeah, it is just a shame to waste another E30 IMO.

I guess it makes my fleet worth more, right?

[hpde30]

I wouldn't call it a waste, its what the car was engineered to do. :D

[StereoInstaller1]

Nah, no way. It got pressed into service and kicked ass doing so, but no car with semi-trailing arms is in any way "designed" to be a race car.

If I were to track anything "cheap", I would do C4 corvette stuff in a tube chassis, and no body, just an exoskeleton...THAT would be a fun track car.

[jlevie]

I don't want a beater as a track car, that is just asking for problems and down time. Reliable, well maintained street cars make the best track cars.

That is very true, but I doubt you'll find a well maintained street car suitable for track duty for south of $6k. The average E30 typically needs several thousand in parts to correct for maintenance that has been deferred or skipped. A beater may not need much more and most beaters get that designation because of appearance rather than mechanical condition. Appearance doesn't matter for a track car.

The smart way to do this is to buy a car that has already been set up as a track rat or as a race car. In the end that will be cheaper and be a more reliable car.

[bernzpeed]

Listen to the wise men.

[hpde30]

Nah, no way. It got pressed into service and kicked ass doing so, but no car with semi-trailing arms is in any way "designed" to be a race car.

If I were to track anything "cheap", I would do C4 corvette stuff in a tube chassis, and no body, just an exoskeleton...THAT would be a fun track car.

When did I say it was designed to be a race car? I never said that. I said I was doing what it was engineered to do... which is be driven. that is its sole reason for existing.

Cheap is a relative term, you can track an E30 for a hell of a lot cheaper than you can a C4. Trust me, I've been down the corvette road already and I would steer clear of anything pre-c5. C4's, IMO, are a waste of space and their technology is very dated. C5's and up are another story all together, but thats neither here nor there.

[hpde30]

That is very true, but I doubt you'll find a well maintained street car suitable for track duty for south of $6k. The average E30 typically needs several thousand in parts to correct for maintenance that has been deferred or skipped. A beater may not need much more and most beaters get that designation because of appearance rather than mechanical condition. Appearance doesn't matter for a track car.

The smart way to do this is to buy a car that has already been set up as a track rat or as a race car. In the end that will be cheaper and be a more reliable car.

I agree somewhat, but for me right now the journey is just as much fun as arriving at the destination. I've bought cars all done up and you sometimes get more than you bargin for.

I picked up an e30 325is that I could have driven the car right to the track, but I went ahead and did all the regular maint (timing belt, wp, oil pan gasket, vc gasket, hoses and ect). my plan is to DE the car bone stock, sans tires and pads, for a year to make sure I like it then I will be installing a cage and race seats.

[jlevie]

I agree somewhat, but for me right now the journey is just as much fun as arriving at the destination. I've bought cars all done up and you sometimes get more than you bargin for.

I picked up an e30 325is for $1,200 that only need two front tires. I could have driven the car right to the track but I went ahead and did all the regular maint (timing belt, wp, oil pan gasket, vc gasket, hoses and ect). so far I'm in less than $600 in parts not including my sweat equity. my plan is to DE the car bone stock, sans tires and pads, for a year to make sure I like it then I will be installing a cage and race seats.

For track duty I'll bet that car needs:
Control arms
Tie rods
Wheel bearings
CAB's
Subframe bushings
Rear trailing arm bushings
Sway bushings & links
Shocks & upper mounts
Half shaft boots
Radiator, expansion tank, cap, and all hoses
Caliper rebuilds & probably a new master cylinder
Motor, transmission & differential mounts
Fan clutch or installation of a 16" 2300CFM electric fan

And if still present new power steering and oil cooler hoses.

That isn't to say that it could not be taken to the track the way it is, but rather that is what should be done before taking the car to the track.

[hpde30]

For track duty I'll bet that car needs:
Control arms
Tie rods
Wheel bearings
CAB's
Subframe bushings
Rear trailing arm bushings
Sway bushings & links
Shocks & upper mounts
Half shaft boots
Radiator, expansion tank, cap, and all hoses
Caliper rebuilds & probably a new master cylinder
Motor, transmission & differential mounts
Fan clutch or installation of a 16" 2300CFM electric fan

And if still present new power steering and oil cooler hoses.

That isn't to say that it could not be taken to the track the way it is, but rather that is what should be done before taking the car to the track.

Eventually I'm sure I'll need to replace most of those parts you listed, but as it sits currently the car should pass tech inspection with no problems. The fact that I'll be running regular street tires for a while helps a lot too. As you know you can only generate so much corning force with street tire.

Not to take this too far off topic but what do you feel is the weakest link with these cars? From the research I've done it seems a lot of guys are installing crank scrapers to help with oiling issues. I have to assume they're running R-comps on high banked tracks though.

[Sagaris]

I would look into all the chassis reinforcements you could possibly do. Sway bar, front subframe, rear strut mount, along with other chassis bracing. The sheetmetal is prone to fatigue cracks on any older car that is driven hard.