How to keep the oil pan out of harms way.

[bmwman91]

There's no perfect solution unfortunately. Lowering a car, especially that much, is going to mean serious compromises. A steel M20 oil pan is IMO a better idea than a skid plate. Yeah it doesn't cool as effectively, but covering everything up with a skid plate is going to restrict air flow around the aluminum pan anyway.

Within a few years you'll raise the car. I was once like you and loved having a lowered ride, but the inconvenience of it and risk of oil system failure quickly broke me of that. I actually traded my used suspension parts for some brand new stock ones (Bilstein HD shocks though) with another forum member and busted oil pans became someone else's problem lol.

[bigredguy]

Unfortunately, because I still have the splash guard thing underneath the car this is the best picture I could get. I couldnt get my arm under the splash guard to hold up a set of keys or something to help you gauge the height, but the picture was taken with an iPhone, and when I held the iPhone up to the oil pan sideways, the pan sat about 3/8s of an inch lower than the iPhone. Sorry about the bad photo, but maybe some of you can compare the height of the splash guard and the oil pan.

Link to Picture:

http://imgur.com/yfLkgIY

[SmokeE30]

Yea looks like my car before I raised it up, a skid plate will protect the pan but you will bottom out on the slightly lower plate even more frequently but that's your only good option if you don't wanna raise the car. I did that for a While but I didn't have near stiff enough springs to be that low anyway. For a little bit my skid plate was only 1 finger off the ground(well you could fit up to the knuckle under it) and if I braked hard enough coming up to uneven intersections it would squat down and drag skid plate to a stop, it's not as cool as you may think essentially tossing anchor in your car when you stop lol

[bigredguy]

Yea looks like my car before I raised it up, a skid plate will protect the pan but you will bottom out on the slightly lower plate even more frequently but that's your only good option if you don't wanna raise the car. I did that for a While but I didn't have near stiff enough springs to be that low anyway. For a little bit my skid plate was only 1 finger off the ground(well you could fit up to the knuckle under it) and if I braked hard enough coming up to uneven intersections it would squat down and drag skid plate to a stop, it's not as cool as you may think essentially tossing anchor in your car when you stop lol

does it appear like the oil pan is sitting low, and the motor mounts may be bad? theres a few people that keep saying that they must be at my ride height that my pan sits that close to the ground, and I can believe it, just come better opinions would be nice.

[doktor_b]

install new motor mounts just because it's good maintenance.
lift the motor 1/2"
add a HIK Fabrication severe duty skidplate.

if you're not prepared to live with those mods (and constantly scraping the pavement), or breaking pans, just raise the car. you have to pay to play and massive, static drops are the most expensive games to play. you can raise the engine and run no skidder, but then your subframe is exposed. ever hang up a subframe on some piece of road or debris? it'll stop and fold your car or remove the subframe from it. those are both total-loss scenarios. hence the skid plate. you can still crush a pan thru a skidder. heaven knows every pan i've ever broken/crushed/whatever has been thru a skidder. so you have to get the engine out of the way of harm. there is no padding that can be used. there is no magic bean you can plant. 1/2" lift on the engine won't ruin your driveline geometry, but it will make a large difference when protecting your pan.

i read all three pages of this thread and the best i can tell, you're looking for a guarantee. that's laughable. there is no guarantee you won't have an anvil drop out of the clear blue and crush you, let alone a guaranteed way to magically defend your lowered car from the road.

[bmwman91]

install new motor mounts just because it's good maintenance.
lift the motor 1/2"
add a HIK Fabrication severe duty skidplate.

if you're not prepared to live with those mods (and constantly scraping the pavement), or breaking pans, just raise the car. you have to pay to play and massive, static drops are the most expensive games to play. you can raise the engine and run no skidder, but then your subframe is exposed. ever hang up a subframe on some piece of road or debris? it'll stop and fold your car or remove the subframe from it. those are both total-loss scenarios. hence the skid plate. you can still crush a pan thru a skidder. heaven knows every pan i've ever broken/crushed/whatever has been thru a skidder. so you have to get the engine out of the way of harm. there is no padding that can be used. there is no magic bean you can plant. 1/2" lift on the engine won't ruin your driveline geometry, but it will make a large difference when protecting your pan.

i read all three pages of this thread and the best i can tell, you're looking for a guarantee. that's laughable. there is no guarantee you won't have an anvil drop out of the clear blue and crush you, let alone a guaranteed way to magically defend your lowered car from the road.

Best post in this thread.

[JGee]

[quote=doktor_b;3848483]install new motor mounts just because it's good maintenance.
lift the motor 1/2"
add a HIK Fabrication severe duty skidplate.

Thanks for the endorsement doktor and BMWman.
Our skid plate does reduce ground clearance by about 1" so, for the super extremely slammed cars this or any other skid plate will not even fit under the oil pan. Good motor mounts are a must. I have seen motors sagging up to a half inch on worn mounts.

Doktor_b curious which skid plate(s) you were running when you cracked your oil pans? To date, I know of only one HIK Fabrication skid plate failure and he was jumping his lowered car.

JH

[bigredguy]

[quote=JGee;3929598]

install new motor mounts just because it's good maintenance.
lift the motor 1/2"
add a HIK Fabrication severe duty skidplate.

Thanks for the endorsement doktor and BMWman.
Our skid plate does reduce ground clearance by about 1" so, for the super extremely slammed cars this or any other skid plate will not even fit under the oil pan. Good motor mounts are a must. I have seen motors sagging up to a half inch on worn mounts.

Doktor_b curious which skid plate(s) you were running when you cracked your oil pans? To date, I know of only one HIK Fabrication skid plate failure and he was jumping his lowered car.

JH

Thanks. I realized that a skid plate will most likely not be of much help being so low. The pan sits about 2 fingers from the ground now and I have been told it is most likely sagging pretty bad from worn motor mounts.

The car will be getting put away for winter this weekend and then I can truely asses what needs to be done. I am already redoing the entire front suspension, so that may help a bit, and I am planning on getting new motor mounts and raising the motor a 1/2". Hopefully this would get the pan high enough to the point that I can lower the car more, but we will see when that time comes.

[doktor_b]

[quote=JGee;3929598]

install new motor mounts just because it's good maintenance.
lift the motor 1/2"
add a HIK Fabrication severe duty skidplate.

Thanks for the endorsement doktor and BMWman.
Our skid plate does reduce ground clearance by about 1" so, for the super extremely slammed cars this or any other skid plate will not even fit under the oil pan. Good motor mounts are a must. I have seen motors sagging up to a half inch on worn mounts.

Doktor_b curious which skid plate(s) you were running when you cracked your oil pans? To date, I know of only one HIK Fabrication skid plate failure and he was jumping his lowered car.

JH

I've crushed many pans on VWs.
i only crushed one pan on my e30 and it was through the HIK fabrication pan. we have some serious bullshit roads around here. hit an expansion joint on I-70 (in downtown Indianapolis) at the speed limit, and it got the front wheels off the ground i hit it so hard. merely cracked the pan, but enough to dump all but 2 litres of oil all over the parking lot. that was with new motor mounts, but no engine lift. i lifted the engine 1/2" since and haven't had any trouble since then...and i haven't raised the car at all.


forgive the horrid picture, i took it thru a filthy window while i waited for a pizza. but you get the picture about how my car sits.

[noE30]

Even if you believe that a skid plate wont help you because you're too low, I'd still run one. There are plenty of low r3v members that have used and abused the Raceskid plate and their oil pans are still intact. I haven't cracked a pan yet thankfully, but I did drive off a driveway and cause my skid plate to support the front half of the car. (was pulling out at an angle and the front right wheel dropped off the concrete pad which caused the plate the support the car) My oil pan would have been toast had it not been for my Raceskids plate.

I really don't think you can be too low for a skid plate..

[LowR3V'in]

Hella sick stretch stanced flush style.

[doktor_b]

Hella sick stretch stanced flush style.

would i be so much cooler and r3v-approved if i talked endlessly about my motor build and racing? or if i turned my attention to attacking all the different "styles" of e30s out there? hate to break it to you, but there are more than one way to make a car look and still retain functionality. it's quite a bit more challenging to lower a car that far and have it still perform. you get to re-engineer a lot of components and you always have something to tinker with. much more challenging than modding your car just like everyone else.

i suppose you prefer a swap to building the m20 because, "it's easier," and, "you get so much more power for your effort/dollars."

meh.

why not build your own damned car the way you like it, support other car enthusiasts in their passions, in your shared passion for e30s, and in general try not to be a dick for no reason?

[LowR3V'in]

How much crack did you smoke?

[JGee]

Thanks. I realized that a skid plate will most likely not be of much help being so low. The pan sits about 2 fingers from the ground now and I have been told it is most likely sagging pretty bad from worn motor mounts.



The car will be getting put away for winter this weekend and then I can truely asses what needs to be done. I am already redoing the entire front suspension, so that may help a bit, and I am planning on getting new motor mounts and raising the motor a 1/2". Hopefully this would get the pan high enough to the point that I can lower the car more, but we will see when that time comes.

Sounds like a good plan. Stiffen the whole front end and stop that motor from bouncing around with some good motor mounts. If you can get that oil pan four fingers off the ground its time for a skidplate, so you can stop worrying about every manhole cover and reflector you see.

I've crushed many pans on VWs.
i only crushed one pan on my e30 and it was through the HIK fabrication pan. we have some serious bullshit roads around here. hit an expansion joint on I-70 (in downtown Indianapolis) at the speed limit, and it got the front wheels off the ground i hit it so hard. merely cracked the pan, but enough to dump all but 2 litres of oil all over the parking lot. that was with new motor mounts, but no engine lift. i lifted the engine 1/2" since and haven't had any trouble since then...and i haven't raised the car at all.

Thanks for the feedback. Do you have any pictures of the carnage? So you were jumping the car too.(only yours was unintentional) Do you remember the clearance you had between the plate and pan? Are you still running the same skid plate? Speed limit 55? What is your skid plate to ground clearance? What serial number do you have? PM me your name and I can look up the serial number. Sorry for all the questions but, I have had not had any real feedback and am always looking to improve my products.

BTW Nice looking car.

Even if you believe that a skid plate wont help you because you're too low, I'd still run one. There are plenty of low r3v members that have used and abused the Raceskid plate and their oil pans are still intact. I haven't cracked a pan yet thankfully, but I did drive off a driveway and cause my skid plate to support the front half of the car. (was pulling out at an angle and the front right wheel dropped off the concrete pad which caused the plate the support the car) My oil pan would have been toast had it not been for my Raceskids plate.

I really don't think you can be too low for a skid plate..

If your skid plate is dragging on the ground while driving down a flat road your car is to low for a skid plate period You lollipop scraping guys fit into the category of people who can't run a skid plate. I understand and appreciate you super slammed guys. Most of you take super good care of your cars and they look bad-ass. I suggest you go with some kind of sump-less system.

NoE30 you do not fall into the above category. I'm sure Raceskids has saved many oil pans but, Raceskids has also failed many r3v members who didn't think they needed SEVERE DUTY protection and it is very well documented on this forum. Raceskid makes a fine product I'm sure. It all comes down to how much protection do you need? How low is your car? How bad are your streets? How do you like to drive? etc.


JH

[doktor_b]

Thanks for the feedback. Do you have any pictures of the carnage? So you were jumping the car too.(only yours was unintentional) Do you remember the clearance you had between the plate and pan? Are you still running the same skid plate? Speed limit 55? What is your skid plate to ground clearance? What serial number do you have? PM me your name and I can look up the serial number. Sorry for all the questions but, I have had not had any real feedback and am always looking to improve my products.

BTW Nice looking car.
JH

i have some pics of the damage on my instagram and in my phone. i'll dig some up or you can scroll thru the instagram (user handle doktor_b)

when i offered the HIK FAB skidder up to my car originally, it hung down way too far for my application. so i removed ~1" from the ends of the bash bar. required a little coaxing to get everything together, but a press-fit is a solid connection, right? lol *had i not trimmed the bash bar, my skidder to ground clearance would have been 0 to -.75" i then had ~.75" from road to skidder. as stated previously, i raised the engine a half inch as well as lowered the rear of my car to unload the front suspension and level the car. i have ~1" from skidder to road now. although it contacts the road frequently, it doesn't sustain the jarring impacts it once had to endure.

when i broke the pan thru the skidder, it did deform the pan pretty severely. it was bent up into the pan and had collapsed both angle iron supports at the point of contact. i straightened the skidder and the supports. i then re-welded the supports to the skidder to help add some more rigidity. the supports are now fully welded to the skidder.

the bash bar also was deformed slightly. the bar was 'pushed up' in the middle and subsequently opened up the "U" shape and slightly separating the posts where they bolt to the cups welded to the chassis legs. i was able to overcome this during reinstallation with just a ratchet-strap to squeeze the "U" back into shape.

couldn't tell you my serial number off hand, but i can tell you that my name is Chris Balich and that i live in Indianapolis.

if i can be of any more assistance don't hesitate to contact me on here or via email. drb.loa@gmail.com

i'll work on some carnage pics...





you can see the only crack in the oil pan in the first pic.
the second shows how well the ribs wear from a lot of abuse. the bend is between the front 3 holes for mounting and the large centered hole.
the third is post-straightened and re-welded (not pretty, but strong and with good penetration).

found this one from about two weeks after original install.


you can see some bending up a few inches behind the bash bar, but you can also see just how tough the skidder is. i am not nice to it and it chews up whatever i run over. lots of sparks, but being steel, it can be repaired or reinforced as necessary. it is really a quality product and i would recommend one to anyone who drives an e30. i love this skidder.