Position 3 Users, Please Help!

[Japandrew73]

that being said i doubt a highschool kid with a cutoff wheel will get it right.

That's sort of poor logic, that's like assuming that when I replace a plastic part on my car that I personally make the mould, mix and poor the plastic into the mould and then put it into my car. Just because I'm having something re-enforced doesn't mean I'm doing it myself. Of course I'm not qualified to do something like that! That's what metal fabricators are for.

[Iain]

Hell no. Still notching the subframe and having it re-enforced, will be done by the end of the week. For those who are interested, notching the subframe gave about an inch and a half down, and just from moving it down, that gave a lot of room in the back direction. No pics yet, but still sticking to my original plan, and the fan is fitting.

[george graves]

But, you were doing it only because you thought Alpina had did it that way, and you wanted to stick to that plan? And now you are STILL going to do it, just to save face? Holy Mary mother of god.

[Stephen]

[87e30]

Dude, can you just give a slight explanation as to why you are doing it this way? (besides the BS that electrical fans are worse and you want it to be OEM)

Hell, even moving the engine back for weight balance would get a lot of us off your back.

[Japandrew73]

But, you were doing it only because you thought Alpina had did it that way, and you wanted to stick to that plan? And now you are STILL going to do it, just to save face? Holy Mary mother of god.

No no no, not at all. This is what I've been trying to explain but get shut down every time. My car will be modeled after the South African built 333i but won't be an exact replica. For it to be an exact replica I'd have to convert to RHD first of all, and there's no way in hell will that ever happen. So it will be built to my liking and personal touch along the way while still looking like a customized version of the 333i. I knew the entire time the 333i used an electric cooling fan and that it also had the choice of either PS or AC, while I'll be using both. And for those who mocked the 3.3 engraving on the side of the block, the 333i did in fact have a 3.3 engraved, the motor inside it was a m30b32 and on the side of the block they rounded up (much like the badge on the back).

Dude, can you just give a slight explanation as to why you are doing it this way? (besides the BS that electrical fans are worse and you want it to be OEM)

Hell, even moving the engine back for weight balance would get a lot of us off your back.

Well I've already explained the main reason for moving the engine to position 3, proper cooling (I understand that's debatable and biased, stop bitching). But yes, the second reason which is monumental, is what Hartge claimed to be as "the same handling as a standard 325i" with their Hartge H35. Hartge used position 3 with a clutch fan and had a much more improved center of gravity. These are the two reasons for moving the engine back.

[VacMan]

No no no, not at all. This is what I've been trying to explain but get shut down every time. My car will be modeled after the South African built 333i but won't be an exact replica. For it to be an exact replica I'd have to convert to RHD first of all, and there's no way in hell will that ever happen. So it will be built to my liking and personal touch along the way while still looking like a customized version of the 333i. I knew the entire time the 333i used an electric cooling fan and that it also had the choice of either PS or AC, while I'll be using both. And for those who mocked the 3.3 engraving on the side of the block, the 333i did in fact have a 3.3 engraved, the motor inside it was a m30b32 and on the side of the block they rounded up (much like the badge on the back).


Well I've already explained the main reason for moving the engine to position 3, proper cooling (I understand that's debatable and biased, stop bitching). But yes, the second reason which is monumental, is what Hartge claimed to be as "the same handling as a standard 325i" with their Hartge H35. Hartge used position 3 with a clutch fan and had a much more improved center of gravity. These are the two reasons for moving the engine back.

What a load of shit. You're doing it because you're too ashamed to admit that rengineering something simply so that you can do something else (that doesn't make sense logically or mechanically) just because you can is idiotic.

You should just log off the internet, put an electric fan on it and be done with it. It'll save you a bunch of time and money, not to mention face. If you weren't at the same level as whatt18yahoo before, you most certainly are now.

[Japandrew73]

What a load of shit. You're doing it because you're too ashamed to admit that rengineering something simply so that you can do something else (that doesn't make sense logically or mechanically) just because you can is idiotic.

You should just log off the internet, put an electric fan on it and be done with it. It'll save you a bunch of time and money, not to mention face. If you weren't at the same level as whatt18yahoo before, you most certainly are now.

Calm down.

[Lurker27]

Well I've already explained the main reason for moving the engine to position 3, proper cooling (I understand that's debatable and biased, stop bitching). But yes, the second reason which is monumental, is what Hartge claimed to be as "the same handling as a standard 325i" with their Hartge H35. Hartge used position 3 with a clutch fan and had a much more improved center of gravity. These are the two reasons for moving the engine back.

1. You're not gaining any weight balance compared to electric fan users.

2. Electric fans are proven adequate to cool the m30. There isn't any "supercooling" advantage to be had

[RickSloan]

did hartge or alpina notch the sub frame? did they use a 524td fan?

your back peddling to seem right, know when to admit another way is better. your life will be easier and you will be happier

edit: and as a side note... remember when you said you would be done this swap in 2 weeks? and we all told you it wouldnt happen? That it would take longer cause these things take time?

when will you learn that we are trying to help you? we all went thru the swap already your not any less of a man if you just listen to the advice of others

[Good & Tight]

I've been watching this thread since you posted it up. Here is how much beating of the firewall you will have to do to get the engine back far enough to think about putting your fan in. Take a close look now and notice how smashed in the tunnel is by the drivers side to fit the starter, also the blower fan area. If you think it's worth it to smash the whole firewall in to accommodate a fan then go ahead.





The pan is about a 1/16" away from the steering rack.

[chadthestampede]

^ I seem to remember he said he was going to cut into the firewall.

[Japandrew73]

1. You're not gaining any weight balance compared to electric fan users.

2. Electric fans are proven adequate to cool the m30. There isn't any "supercooling" advantage to be had

Jesus christ dude.... read what I fucking wrote. I never said the mechanical fan is any lighter than the electric fan. I said that when moving the engine back to position 3 you have a better center of gravity than when you have it jammed up against the firewall. While I move the engine back and there's room for a viscous fan, I choose to put one in.

did hartge or alpina notch the sub frame? did they use a 524td fan?

your back peddling to seem right, know when to admit another way is better. your life will be easier and you will be happier

edit: and as a side note... remember when you said you would be done this swap in 2 weeks? and we all told you it wouldnt happen? That it would take longer cause these things take time?

when will you learn that we are trying to help you? we all went thru the swap already your not any less of a man if you just listen to the advice of others

I'm not going for an exact replica of any Hartge or any Alpina so why do you think that just because they didn't do it that I can't? Alpina never notched the subframe because they never used position 3. Hartge didn't notch the subframe because they had a special oil pan that was thin enough to clear the subframe but up front had a very large sump. So it's either recreate the Hartge oil pan or notch the subframe.

I do remember when I first started this swap, I knew almost nothing about how an engine worked at all. This has been an awesome experience for me and is a great learning experience and tons of fun. I took some of the advice given to me like replacing the timing chain guide rails, I choose to leave other advice, like using an electric fan, out of the picture. I'm not saying my way is the best way, it's just the way I choose to do my project.

Does anybody realize how this thread began? I asked 3 simple questions. One of which (subframe question) anybody could answer! Instead, I got shit about "my way is better, why get creative?" "Too much work, slap a fan on and call it a day". Seems to me it'd be easier to just answer a simple question.

And in response to "Good and Tight", I mean no disrespect to you because that's a pretty impressive turbo, but my engine currently sits in position 3 and I didn't bang up my firewall anywhere close to that damage.

[george graves]

I think I've figured out why this thread bothers me.

You know - if I ever found myself in a room full of people, all of whom had more experience than I did, and they were all telling me "it's fine you want to do somethings your way, but on this one, trust us, do it our way" - you know what? I'd stop what I was doing and listen to them.

But apparently, for you, this swap isn't about swapping a motor into a car - it's about the act of DOING the swap, not the final result. It feels good, and you are having fun.

It seems at every junction you are choosing what looks more "fun" for you to do. What looks cool. A "real" fan, an embossing on the block, or pistons that you could eat off of. Then if someone says something negative, you just say that it's "your way" of doing it. Well - there is a right and a wrong way.

So, just know that what you are doing is "playing" mechanic. Cleaning off the top of your pistons till they are shiny is not doing real work. It's pretend work. A real mechanic is looking at that motor, not with their eyes, but with a set of calipers. What's the clearance here? Oh, this will need work - or - let's leave this alone.

So all this pretend work - it kinda looks like one of those little girls at a pretend tea parties, sipping their pretend tea. It's kinda gay - and guess why? There isn't even any fucking tea.



/end rant
/audi 5000

[Danny]

Fuck tea!