Couple of Questions for the Gurus

[CuriousE30]

Hello all! It seems I have caught the e30 bug, quite fast too. I have always had a general soft spot for these cars but never understood their potential - I am a long time Rx-7 lover but honestly I am looking for something a little more practical and having 4 seats is something I consider "practical". So here I was thinking "this will be simple" there are a few e30's listed on my local craigslist. However when I come to the forums all this new information comes up: 88+ models have a different style of bumpers (they allow plastic bumpers), the difference in the models (mainly for me different interiors), and other various things like that.

So I have a few Q's if you guys don't mind answering them:

1. I plan to do a V8 swap (this is why I am posting here ;) ). A car that I am looking at right now seems to have a very clean exterior and needs some minor work on the interior, price is right - but das ist auto! :hitler: So when I do my swap, will this be an issue? I understand that the sheet metal is the same for auto and automatic but is there anything different in the interior that would cause issues in swapping from auto to manual or is it as simple as ripping out the auto stick?

2. I was looking into swapping the M60 motor, price seems right and it keeps a Bimmer a Bimmer! But after posting a similar thread on Bimmerforums someone linked me an article when I asked about "alusil" and well I must admit it made me take a step back. It seems that these motors require a lot of maintenance? Please correct me if I am wrong because I see so many people doing the M60 swap. I thought of maybe doing an M62 swap like Gargastic has done, where they swap the M60 parts needed to make the wiring and computer communication more of an ease, but then that starts to sound like it adds up. So then I go back to what I was originally thinking (from my Rx-7 days) and just throw and LS1 in it! However, the cost of trans and motor mounts for the e30 is just absurd; from what I remember with the Rx-7 you could get trans and motor mounts for sub ~$300, anyone I've seen selling them here has a kit for ~$1400-$1600

-Could I just fab my own mounts? I can't imagine it would cost nearly this much to do it myself... I just can't wrap my brain around why the mounts are so expensive (Capitalism at its best?). Speaking of mounts I haven't even heard of mounts on the M6x, so how much are those?

That's about all I have that will fit in this section, I am curious about the performance issues incurred when people "stance" their cars, and good suspension combo's but I suppose those should be posted elsewhere?

Thanks in advance! Hopefully this community is more lively than the others.

[robiniscool]

hmmm 1st post

[CuriousE30]

Indeed

[JGood]

The only things you'll need to deal with when going from an auto chassis to manual would be installing the manual pedal box and removing the auto wiring, both of which are almost negligible amounts of work in comparison to the actual m60 swap. The auto and manual chassis were made the same, so everything is 100% bolt-in.

Do some research on the Nikasil/Alusil thing. Nikasil engines *were* the engines to watch out for, most of which have either been replaced by Alusil engines under recall, or simply never had a problem and are still fine to this day. If it's a Nikasil engine that you can't verify runs good, just do a leakdown and/or compression test.

That really has nothing to do with 'maintenance' on the engine. These are fairly typical engines, nothing really special about them as far as maintenance requirements.

Of course you can make your own mounts... if you're capable. Or, there's someone selling them on this forum for ~$150.

[CuriousE30]

The only things you'll need to deal with when going from an auto chassis to manual would be installing the manual pedal box and removing the auto wiring, both of which are almost negligible amounts of work in comparison to the actual m60 swap. The auto and manual chassis were made the same, so everything is 100% bolt-in.

Do some research on the Nikasil/Alusil thing. Nikasil engines *were* the engines to watch out for, most of which have either been replaced by Alusil engines under recall, or simply never had a problem and are still fine to this day. If it's a Nikasil engine that you can't verify runs good, just do a leakdown and/or compression test.

That really has nothing to do with 'maintenance' on the engine. These are fairly typical engines, nothing really special about them as far as maintenance requirements.

Of course you can make your own mounts... if you're capable. Or, there's someone selling them on this forum for ~$150.

So there is already room in the floorboard for the manual pedal? I remember some fab work having to be done with Rx-7s going from auto to manual. Am I better off looking for a shell that is manual? Or is the swap a lot simpler when you are doing a full motor/trans swap rather than just the trans? I really hope auto is still a viable shell option considering I have found one in rather good condition, still need to check it for rust but I believe I can get it for a good price - I'll post pics when I can.

I did do some research, I was unaware that it would be hard to find a Nikasil engine. If the owner is unaware how do I know whether the M60 is nikasil or alusil? Are the power gains from an M62 worth the extra trouble? Or is there not much extra trouble involved? What trans is recommended with this swap? I understand it's up between a 5 and 6 speed but what are they called and is the 6th gear truly that much more beneficial for highway mileage?

It seems the life on Lsx engines are not as great as the Bimmers, this somewhat makes me not want to do the LSx swap considering many well priced engines are ~100k+ in miles. Please correct me if I am wrong in my assumption.

I mean the mounts themselves seem simple, I haven't made mounts before but I will be doing this with a buddy who's dad has a shop, it's a specialized shop so I'm not sure what they have at their fingertips in regards to a CNC machine etc. Making my own mounts was really concerning the LS swap, considering the kits are ridiculously expensive...

Thanks for the input everyone, keep it rolling!

[JGood]

No, like I said, the auto chassis is identical to the manual chassis. Literally. You unbolt the auto pedal box and bolt in the manual pedal box. It's a self-contained assembly that requires no modifications. The hole in the firewall is even there for the clutch master cylinder and hard line, it just has a rubber grommet in it that you pop out. Even the chassis wiring is the same, there is just an additional harness that runs to the auto shifter for the park/neutral safety switch that you will remove. The shift linkage uses the same mounting point on the chassis, the trans brace uses the same mounting points... it's all the same. 100% bolt-in.

My point with the Nikasil/Alusil thing is that it's not a huge deal anymore, it's sort of an exaggerated issue. Most of the problem engines have been taken care of. If you come across a Nikasil engine that the owner can't verify the condition of, compression check it. If you can't do that, offer a very small amount of money, or just walk away. There are serial numbers that tell you which engine it is. Do some google searching, try "m60 nikasil alusil", should give you all the info you need.

[slammin.e28]

Get an e30 with an airbag. Then the pedal box is the same and you just add a clutch pedal, IIRC.

[CuriousE30]

Get an e30 with an airbag. Then the pedal box is the same and you just add a clutch pedal, IIRC.

This would be interesting to find out...

[JGood]

The manual pedal boxes are a dime a dozen and are held in by 6 bolts. It takes 10 minutes to install it. If you can install the clutch pedal on an auto airbag pedal box, it would still require removing it, so it actually requires more work then just installing a manual pedal box in the first place. But we're talking about a trivial task either way. I certainly wouldn't select a car based off of this.

OP, the pedal box really is a non-issue. You've already put too much thought into it, lol.

[kevinbednarek]

As I am in the middle of an M62 swap on my 84, I would recommend going with the M60 unless you are really crafty with electronics. I set out to do a full OBD2 conversion, and now I'm paying the price. The EWS system is a real pain in the ass. With the M60, you have an ECU available that doesn't have EWS, and at its worst, you can get around it (or so I have read). M60 is the way to go. But, make sure to get a cheap donor car. It's gonna save you a ton of hassle.

[CuriousE30]

The manual pedal boxes are a dime a dozen and are held in by 6 bolts. It takes 10 minutes to install it. If you can install the clutch pedal on an auto airbag pedal box, it would still require removing it, so it actually requires more work then just installing a manual pedal box in the first place. But we're talking about a trivial task either way. I certainly wouldn't select a car based off of this.

OP, the pedal box really is a non-issue. You've already put too much thought into it, lol.

What can I say, I'm a curious guy haha ;)

I appreciate you alleviating my concern!

So the M62 is not worth the trouble? I was really looking forward to the ~30 extra horses (am I wrong in that number? No time to double check). I'm just trying to get the most power I can out of this thing while trying to stay within $6000 total (car and everything). Here is the "shell" I've been looking at - it has a trans and motor but both are virtually toast, to the point I was told to bring a trailer. What would you guys offer on this?

[CuriousE30]

What would you guys pay for that car in my last post? Engine and trans are both in need of repair or replacement (I will replace) rear bumper has damage, that's all I know for now will be checking out the car weds.

[Wild Ride]

I have trouble paying over $1000 for an e30 that does not run with no bonus go fast parts. Anything less than $500 is scrap value so somewhere between those two. At a glance the car looks straight and is a late model which is a good start. I would rather pay 2k or more for a really clean one with a sport package and perfect paint interior etc. than a beat up car. A beat car that is cheap will have cost control issues just like an m60 vs m62.

[Wild Ride]

Save yourself some time and money and buy this car your 6k build will turn into the 10k real fast. for 10k asking price you couldn't build this

http://garagistic.com/index.php?page=lela---m60-b40-6-speed-e30